Anti-War

[jhop220]

Let me start out by saying that I am an American. I live in the country of the free people. I am happy to live here where I can voice my opinion and honestly I have one. I am not a Pacifist by no means but I do not support a war against Iraq. These things take time. The weapons inspectors need time to locate weapons of mass destruction if there are any. I know we can't trust Saddam Housein when he says he doesn't have any weapons. I feel that we havn't given suffient evidence that they arn't cooperating. They are destroying their missles. Also when do we America ever provoke war? We are not suppose to attack a country without a cause. They say that Iraq puts money into terrorist organizations but we can't prove it. If they do support or harbor terrorist that attack us then we should take action but no evidence has proved that. Also, we should not attack a country without approval from the U.N. Even if we get nine votes France will veto, if they don't Russia will and if they don't China will. I feel that U.N. support would be better than doing it anyway. Bush to me is focusing on the wrong issue. While inspections continue in Iraq we should turn our focus to North Korea. They have already stated that they are making weapons of mass destruction. Thewithdrew from the truce and they withdrew from the Nuclear Treaty. North Korea is posing a greater threat than Iraq is to me. Te real regime change is Kim Jong Il. I agree that Iraq needs a regime change to i just feel that world support is needed a little more than attacking a country without world support. I say give the Inspectors more time and turn your attention to the DPRK or North Korea. I do not want other countries to feel like America is a threat to peace like they seem to be now. We need World support and Bush doesn't care about that.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

They are destroying their missles

They are destroying missles that only 1 month ago, they declared they never owned nor built.

 

[Krokus]

...

and rebuilding the very missles they are destroying.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Re: ...

and rebuilding the very missles they are destroying.

Also last month, they (the inspectors) found vials of anthrax and one of Saddam's spokes-men said it was "merely overlook and not intentionally left out, and was only used for "research""

I wonder what else was "overlooked" by Saddam's regime?

 

[redway10]

As brutal and risky as a war might be, it simply is never a good time to pass up the opportunity to crush a madman with lots of money and military control.

It would also send a clear message to other mental cases in control of strong armies that they too could be removed.

Saddam Hussein has been an omnipotent god (like Stalin or Hitler on a smaller scale) for a long time.

Will the Iraqi people thank the U. S. for removing this psychopath who tortures and rapes his own people on a vast scale? Probably not.

I am sure there are some in Afghanistan who miss the Taliban (and some in Germany who miss Hitler, and some in Russia who miss Stalin).

All too often (this extends to nationalism, tribalism, and religion), people mistake the fervent nature of their beliefs for their veracity. Vast numbers of individuals know that their religion, nationality, tribe, or basic system of beliefs, is one of the best (if not the best) in the world (not just the best for them, the best). They also know that other people who think their 'group' is 'better' are wrong.

Just because beliefs are strongly held ('war should be avoided under nearly all circumstances'), does not make them true. The evidence is clear that the leader of Iraq is a brutal monster who enjoys the boundless freedom of an extremely fearful populace. It is too bad for him that Americans do not live in constant fear of his extensive tortures and cruelties.

Bye, bye, Saddam, Uday, Qusay, and all the other sadistic monsters whom everyone knows (not believes, knows) are guilty of extensive crimes against humanity.

The U. S. acts too slowly (Nazi Germany, Serbia, etc.), not too quickly.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

As brutal and risky as a war might be, it simply is never a good time to pass up the opportunity to crush a madman with lots of money and military control.

It would also send a clear message to other mental cases in control of strong armies that they too could be removed.

Saddam Hussein has been an omnipotent god (like Stalin or Hitler on a smaller scale) for a long time.

Will the Iraqi people thank the U. S. for removing this psychopath who tortures and rapes his own people on a vast scale? Probably not.

I am sure there are some in Afghanistan who miss the Taliban (and some in Germany who miss Hitler, and some in Russia who miss Stalin).

All too often (this extends to nationalism, tribalism, and religion), people mistake the fervent nature of their beliefs for their veracity. Vast numbers of individuals know that their religion, nationality, tribe, or basic system of beliefs, is one of the best (if not the best) in the world (not just the best for them, the best). They also know that other people who think their 'group' is 'better' are wrong.

Just because beliefs are strongly held ('war should be avoided under nearly all circumstances'), does not make them true. The evidence is clear that the leader of Iraq is a brutal monster who enjoys the boundless freedom of an extremely fearful populace. It is too bad for him that Americans do not live in constant fear of his extensive tortures and cruelties.

Bye, bye, Saddam, Uday, Qusay, and all the other sadistic monsters whom everyone knows (not believes, knows) are guilty of extensive crimes against humanity.

The U. S. acts too slowly (Nazi Germany, Serbia, etc.), not too quickly.

I think all Christians should use war, as only the last resort. But also, we know we must use war, when other efforts have failed.

Saddam has had 12 years to dis-arm. He is dis-mantling missles, that only a month earlier, loudly declared that Iraq neither owned, nor produced, which makes me wonder what else Saddam is hiding. Does he have a nuclear weapon? I don't think he does **right now**, and **right now** being the key phrase, here.

I would hate for him to have to use a nuclear weapon, as the only way for the rest of the world to wake up and smell the radiation.

I don't take joy in anybody's defeat, but I also know if we do not take action against Saddam, he could become another Hitler, who is no longer interested in just ruling Iraq, but decides he wants to rule the entire world.

I am glad that we are not making the mistake of Saddam that we made with Hitler.

 

[kurchatovium]

Those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it.

Amen, brother!

 

[SteveyB]

Ok - so your logic for attacking Iraq without any provocation is that Iraq might attack without provocation. You lot make me quite sick, and reinforce the stereotype that most of the west has of the US. We "know" you're mostly civil, intelligent people, but every day we see what Bush and co have said on the news - and you supporting that maniac disproves it a little at a time.

The initial aggressor is, and always has been in the wrong, no matter what the press has been telling you.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Ok - so your logic for attacking Iraq without any provocation is that Iraq might attack without provocation. You lot make me quite sick, and reinforce the stereotype that most of the west has of the US. We "know" you're mostly civil, intelligent people, but every day we see what Bush and co have said on the news - and you supporting that maniac disproves it a little at a time.

The initial aggressor is, and always has been in the wrong, no matter what the press has been telling you.

That was pretty much what people said, when defending Hitler "Well, as long as he is only killing people in his own borders, I don't see why that should bother or conern us".

But then killing his own people was not good enough. He wanted to kill Europe, and then he has visions of being a "global emperor", where only the "German Race" was allowed to live, and everybody else was "inferior" and therefore must be "purged".

Had we acted, while there was still time, 6 million Jews may not have been gassed.

 

[Deleted member 2452]

thanks for stopping by steveyb

please do visit again, especialy after we have defeated the iraqi army, and found all the illegal weapons that sadom claimes he didn't have! then maybe you can tell us why a very sane, and wise president bush was wrong to order the troops to move in, hmm?
steve

 

[ShiningIce]

a very sane, and wise president bush

ROFLMAO!!!!! LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

 

[JoBelle]

As a rule of life, I find conflict between countires to be a sad thing. War is never good. It's often productive to a point of completing a task, but it is never "Good." Light is good. Cooperation is good. Trust is good. Death...war...not so good.

My first instinct would be to take an intellectual approach toward solving world problems, however that isn't always possible.

As much as I would like to join the crowd of folks who think time will solve the issue with Iraq, I can't. I remember sitting in my college dormitory watching the scenes of the Gulf War. It's been 12 years, and Saddam has not done what the world has asked him to do. THE UNITED NATIONS..not the United States. How much time does he need? For those of you who are opposed to military action, can you give me an answer to that? I've asked many times and not received a response. I doubt anyone will this time either.

As far as the innocent element...
Of course innocent people will suffer. No one is arguing that point.The problem is...people are suffering as a result of the regime in Iraq NOW! Does this justify it? NO...but where are all the people screaming to protect the innocents? If innocent life is the sticking point, then why aren't you out there demanding that someone step in and protect those people TODAY? The argument of protecting innocent life is a hypocrite's stance at this point.

Personally, I feel that the people who are so opposed to what the current administration is doing, are simply the ones who want to cover their ears and say "Lalala" whilst a UNITED NATIONS resolution is being defied. It's a matter of hiding one's head in the sand.

"I'll pretend Saddam is relly cooperating even though weapons inspectors have yet to say as much."

"I'll pretend Saddam doesn't rape and murder women and children in his own country. Then I can feel ok in my smugness."

"I'll pretend Saddam hasn't used his citizenry as guinea pigs for his weapons."

"I'll pretend there is NO POSSIBLE WAY that terrosists might be in cahoots with Saddam even though they have the same goal."

"I'll pretend France's opinion of US policy matters since they are such a trustworthy and dependable world power."

"I'll pretend the UK and Spain don't count."

"I'll pretend the rest of the world doesn't use the United States like a cheap hooker when they need a 'fix' and toss it to the curb and spit on it the rest of the time."

Granted some of that is a bit on the extreme side, but to me it's not much worse than saying self-preservation is bad.

In the end, we have to remember...the resolution Saddam is neglecting to follow is a UNITED NATIONS demand. There was a reason it was set in motion. You'd have to be a fool to believe the rest of the world doesn't sense the danger in Iraq. They just dont' want to get any dirt under their nails. They'd rather let the US do it alone.


Joby, irritable and sick to death of hearing people whine about world affairs while there are military boys and girls in the line of danger at this very moment!

 

[Texas_Tickle]

As a rule of life, I find conflict between countires to be a sad thing. War is never good. It's often productive to a point of completing a task, but it is never "Good." Light is good. Cooperation is good. Trust is good. Death...war...not so good.

My first instinct would be to take an intellectual approach toward solving world problems, however that isn't always possible.

As much as I would like to join the crowd of folks who think time will solve the issue with Iraq, I can't. I remember sitting in my college dormitory watching the scenes of the Gulf War. It's been 12 years, and Saddam has not done what the world has asked him to do. THE UNITED NATIONS..not the United States. How much time does he need? For those of you who are opposed to military action, can you give me an answer to that? I've asked many times and not received a response. I doubt anyone will this time either.

As far as the innocent element...
Of course innocent people will suffer. No one is arguing that point.The problem is...people are suffering as a result of the regime in Iraq NOW! Does this justify it? NO...but where are all the people screaming to protect the innocents? If innocent life is the sticking point, then why aren't you out there demanding that someone step in and protect those people TODAY? The argument of protecting innocent life is a hypocrite's stance at this point.

Personally, I feel that the people who are so opposed to what the current administration is doing, are simply the ones who want to cover their ears and say "Lalala" whilst a UNITED NATIONS resolution is being defied. It's a matter of hiding one's head in the sand.

"I'll pretend Saddam is relly cooperating even though weapons inspectors have yet to say as much."

"I'll pretend Saddam doesn't rape and murder women and children in his own country. Then I can feel ok in my smugness."

"I'll pretend Saddam hasn't used his citizenry as guinea pigs for his weapons."

"I'll pretend there is NO POSSIBLE WAY that terrosists might be in cahoots with Saddam even though they have the same goal."

"I'll pretend France's opinion of US policy matters since they are such a trustworthy and dependable world power."

"I'll pretend the UK and Spain don't count."

"I'll pretend the rest of the world doesn't use the United States like a cheap hooker when they need a 'fix' and toss it to the curb and spit on it the rest of the time."

Granted some of that is a bit on the extreme side, but to me it's not much worse than saying self-preservation is bad.

In the end, we have to remember...the resolution Saddam is neglecting to follow is a UNITED NATIONS demand. There was a reason it was set in motion. You'd have to be a fool to believe the rest of the world doesn't sense the danger in Iraq. They just dont' want to get any dirt under their nails. They'd rather let the US do it alone.


Joby, irritable and sick to death of hearing people whine about world affairs while there are military boys and girls in the line of danger at this very moment!

Well stated, Princess Joby!

 

[DutchTickler]

Let me start out by saying that I am an American. I live in the country of the free people. I am happy to live here where I can voice my opinion and honestly I have one.

Write 'Give peace a chance' on your shirt, visit a mall, and find out how free you really are. 😛

 

[Stitch62679]

Looks like in a few hours everyone who's anti-war is gonna be really pissed off!!

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Re: Re: Anti-War

Write 'Give peace a chance' on your shirt, visit a mall, and find out how free you really are. 😛

There's prolly more to that than they are letting on.

 

[ShiningIce]

Looks like the entire world's gonna be pissed off

 

[JoBelle]

And yet they still do not respond to the question.

ICE, and others.....what is the solution if you don't approve of what's happening now? I dare say that none of us LIKES it...but some of us see it as the best course of action at the moment.

Still waiting,
Joby

 

[Cosmo_ac]

Will the Iraqi people thank the U. S. for removing this psychopath who tortures and rapes his own people on a vast scale? Probably not.


And who put him in Iraqi in the first place?

 

[Limeoutsider]

I don't want to go to war. What's the purpose? @ (or more) countries get pissy, start large scale fighting, people die, economy suffers, no one wins. Oh, I'm sorry, the person with the least rubble and ruins wins. Besdies, what's war going to stop? After the war, they're probably just going to start making, building, and/or concocting (again, my wonderful spelling) the things that started the war.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

War never solved a single problem in the entire world.....

Oh, except for slavery, communism, Nazism and facism

 

[Limeoutsider]

And we found different ways to discriminate and make them legal.

 

[ShiningIce]

amen

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Well SI and Lime, what about Hitler? What would you have said about Hitler back then... "Well, it's OK by me if he wants to kill all of Europe. It ain't **my problem**"

Or what if Saddam uses nuclear weapons on another nation. Would you turn your head and say "I didn't see nuttin"?