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Germany smashes child porn ring.....

venray

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Germany smashes child porn ring


The operation is said to involve at least 33 countries
German police say they have broken up an international child pornography ring with links to thousands of people in at least 166 countries.
Several hundred suspects are being investigated in Germany and more than 500 homes across the country are said to have been searched in the past week.

The BBC's Tristana Moore says this is a major breakthrough for the German authorities.

The operation - known as Marcy - has been going on for more than a year, run by police in the eastern state of Saxony-Anhalt and prosecutors in the city of Halle.

It is being co-ordinated by Interpol and the German federal crime office.


Get the rest of the story here...... http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3142080.stm

Congrats on a job well done!.......


Ven
 
thanx from good ole Germany.....

Success!! But it really was about time to pay much more attention to this kind of crime. Hell, there are even parents who rape their children. And what do they get - a 200 bucks fee or something like that - that's the real perversion. So let's hope they manage to do it again (errr, the police of course)
 
Love hearing good news, Ven...

thank you!

The more this happens the better the authorities will get at busting them until finally we'll have the creeps running scared. Heartening!

Button 😎
 
This has gotta be one of the most heinous crimes there is...

People guilty of this should be executed. Damned scum!:sowrong:
 
Good for them! A group of people such as this deserve to be dragged out and shot, I agree with you there, Dan. Great job, law enforcement!!!🙂 Here's to many more captures.
 
Not to support these guys (I don't) but really, what do you do with 'em? Where can they go? How do you successfully supress your sexual leanings.... forever?

Seriosuly, I need to know, because this damn tickling monkey on my back takes up WAY more time and money in my life than is good for me. Life is bad sometimes.
 
Wonderful news! I'd like to think my recent involvement with the IWF had something to do with it. lol Bit of a needle in a haystack job though. 😉
 
i have to agree with Oddjob here. good job on busting it up, but will killing these people solve the problem? these people have an illness. a mental disorder. their sexual desires have been infantilised. i have sympathy for them. imagine being born with this: to have to fight it, every day. to have to suppress and suppress and for all to hate you because they dont understand that the beast gnaws inside you, and you have to be constantly vigilant. how would we react if tickling were declared morally reprehensible, and the community (at large) turned against us? i in NO WAY condone child porn. but i pity the sufferers of that dread affliction. of course they can learn to overcome it, with much counselling and perhaps meditation and medication. what makes me truly sick is people who do not have this affliction, yet do this thing every day for money. to consciously and rationally do this is despicable.
 
Good for you OJ!!!

Personally I don't think killing anyone ever solves anything. Imprisonment as punishment is different of course, but what we really need to do is this...

Accept that this quirk of sexuality is as in-born and naturally occuring as loving tickling or having a foot fetish. Now tickling and feet can be satisfied with causing no harm to anyone and pleasure to many, paedophilia obviously can't. We are NEVER going to solve it until we stop making potential paedophiles afraid to come out of the woodwork and ask for help. what we need to do is have a program set up by the government that invites people worried by their developing tendencies to come in for treatment and councelling. It won't drive them underground, it'll give them an opportunity to be as healed as they possibly can. This has got to be a better solution to waiting until they've murdered and raped half a dozen kids and then hanging or electrocuting them. Cut off the problem at it's source and it'll stop! Make people realise that there is no shame about being born this way, only in giving in to your depravity and physically acting on it. I also feel a great sympathy for people who have these inclinations and I think society should give them every assistance in stopping them from carrying their fantasies into real life.
 
I'm kind of glad some people are finally saying we have to cure these people.

It's all well and good that people want to get rid of these people, and most of them should be gotten rid of. But if you have a son or daughter who is born a pedophile, then what? Or if it's someone you know, then what? I have no children, and don't plan on having any, but for those who do, what do you think of that possibility?

Are people even born like this, or does it develop later on in life? So little study has been done on these people, probably because no one ever wanted to, but now that scores of Catholic priests and others have been jailed, I think they should seriously start - they have enough test subjects who aren't going anywhere.

Is it even possible to sure these people? Lets look at the gay issue, for example. Some people say people are born gay, some say people choose to be gay. But both those opinions are based on whatever prejudice one feels. I personally want cold, hard science to decide which it is. I think gays want it discovered that they are born gay to ward off the hatred of the religious right - to attack someone who is born a certain way is like attacking a cripple or someone born with down syndrome - it would be viewed as inhumane. Most gay haters won't be swayed a bit if science does prove homosexuality genetic, but maybe generations from now humans will look back on their ancestor's stupidity as we do now looking back centuries ago. The religious right want homosexuality to be a choice so they can attack homosexuals guilt free.

So if all sexual tendenacies are genetic, and with ALL the vast science we have now, especially in genetics today, is it possible to "cure," or re-engineer these pedophiles so that they become normal human beings, or even discover this and stop it at the fetal stage? I don't know, I don't know enough about this to know if this is all impossible or not.
 
3 cheers for the krauts!

hiphip hooray! etc., etc.
good job, now string the bastards up!

all this talk of illness, and help, and curing might sound nice to the faint at heart, but the truth is IT CAN'T BE CURED!
there is 100% resitisizm for child molesters. it can't be cured, that is a fact. they have to be locked away. or done away with!

steve
 
Re: 3 cheers for the krauts!

areenactor said:
hiphip hooray! etc., etc.
good job, now string the bastards up!

all this talk of illness, and help, and curing might sound nice to the faint at heart, but the truth is IT CAN'T BE CURED!
there is 100% resitisizm for child molesters. it can't be cured, that is a fact. they have to be locked away. or done away with!

steve

Just out of interest Steve, how would you feel if a relative of yours had paedophilic tendencies, and confided in you for help? What advice would you give them apart from directions to the nearest shop that sells rope and razor blades?

No-one is saying that people who act on their tendencies should'nt be punished, because they're grown-ups and they know the consequences of what they're doing. They know that the kiddie is gonna end up damaged and traumatised. But what about the ones (and they DO exist) who struggle daily with it and want to get it out of themselves because they know it's evil, but can't because the health authortes and the police don't want to know till there's a body?
 
maybe you're being sarcastic jim, but i'll take you as being serious

i'll answer your hypothetical question. if one of my siblings told me that, or my very closest friend, you know, someone i give a shit about. i'd tell them to end it them self, if they'd already touched a child. if they had not, and were struggling with it, i'd say come on, were getting you to a hypnotist, and an m.d.the hpynotist to help with the urges, and the m.d. for a chemical sterilizor.

anyone outside of that close knit circle, odds are i'd either shoot them, or sit on them till the cops got there.

confession time once again; anyone who was a regular on the amt site up to a couple years ago probobly will remember this, i was raped/sexually molested when i was 10 years old. and yes it has left me a deep burning hatred for child molesters. till you've been in my shoes, you just can't imagine what was done, and how it felt, both psychologiclly and physically. the culpret was caught, and put in jail. but it was his 4 trip to jail, he was a known molester, going back till age 21. see his child record was sealed, but he had been active as a teen too.

so there's my story. there is no cure.


steve
 
Re: maybe you're being sarcastic jim, but i'll take you as being serious

areenactor said:
maybe you're being sarcastic jim, but i'll take you as being serious, i'll answer your hypothetical question. if one of my siblings told me that, or my very closest friend, you know, someone i give a shit about. i'd tell them to end it them self, if they'd already touched a child. if they had not, and were struggling with it, i'd say come on, were getting you to a hypnotist, and an m.d.the hpynotist to help with the urges, and the m.d. for a chemical sterilizor.

No, no, I was being deadly serious! I know I'm more than capable of sarcasm and extreme satire, but this is one subject that it's hard to find a funny joke about. I meant my question in 100% earnest.
I often wonder how I'd have coped with it if I'd been cursed with the urge. I shudder to think about what I'd have done. Personally I don't believe in mercy on anyone who's idiot enough to give in and not see if they can find a therapist or whatever. They may not be able to help the way they feel, but no matter how much they kid themselves, they KNOW it's not special love. They KNOW it's traumatising. Anyone who gives in should get the heaviest penalty the law allows.

areenactor said:
anyone outside of that close knit circle, odds are i'd either shoot them, or sit on them till the cops got there.

confession time once again; anyone who was a regular on the amt site up to a couple years ago probobly will remember this, i was raped/sexually molested when i was 10 years old. and yes it has left me a deep burning hatred for child molesters. till you've been in my shoes, you just can't imagine what was done, and how it felt, both psychologiclly and physically. the culpret was caught, and put in jail. but it was his 4 trip to jail, he was a known molester, going back till age 21. see his child record was sealed, but he had been active as a teen too.

so there's my story. there is no cure.


steve
Oh Jesus.



If I was a kiddie fiddler, I think I'd fear jail more than the chair. Category C they call them over here. They keep them under heavy guard so all the honest, hard-working criminals can't get to them. That's the theory anyway. All to often one of them ends up in company of about 8 blokes who have called in some heavy favours to be allowed the privelledge of jumping on some paedo's bollocks. It's hard to feel any sympathy. (Not that I would be inclined to feel any, if they've let themselves get to that stage.)
 
Curable? No. Treatable? Yes. There are cases where through counseling and constant evaluation/reporting in with a parole officer that these people do not re-offend. They simpley repress it, hold it in check, or sublimate by living out their sex fantasies with young looking (but of legal age) adults. They are the minority, but it is a noticable minority, which should open the door to exploring alternative legle measures for the future. There are also drugs available that repress aggressive sexual urges, but they aren't very effective because they cause nausea, physical weakness and other mental problems. Retarded people who just don't 'get' the age laws thing are usually successfully taught not to violate them, but oft-times only after they've been caught engaed in behavior unnaccepatble to society. And a lot of these pedophiles otherwise contribute a great deal of good to our society as doctors, dentists, religious leaders, teachers, soldiers, police, cooks, cab drivers, what have you. They aren't all drifters or desert-dwelling Mormons......

And marrying young - 13 to 16 year olds - happens in other cultures. It's normal and expected.

"Yeah- those are OTHER cultures, not ours."

Well.... it wasn't that uncommon in OUR culture until recently. In the hillbilly culture (or subulture, whichever) they were taking child brides until the 1930s (and I bet they did it afterward illegally). Grover Cleveland married a woman much younger than himself, who was actually a teen when he became her ward. We had Woody Allen as a president 100 years before Woody Allen exsisted! The last living Civil War widow was married off at the age of 15 or 16 to a Civil War vetren who was in his 60s at the time. And that idiot nut David Koresh was having sex with 13, 14 year old girls and the general public treated him as a VICTIM of the oppressive government.

Admittedly, there IS a difference between the relationship of marriage and using living people as fodder objects of porn, but a hard-on is a hard-on, relationship or not.

Good for the Germans for taking the predators off the street. Manson was a victim of childhood sexual abuse and look what happened to him. Most abusers were abused themselves, and there was no joyful, gleeffuly anger-filled avenger there for them, so 1st and foremost my emotions run deep for the victims. Sane adults of legal age know when there's something wrong and when to get help. If my nieces were ever molested I'd want the perpetrators killed. But since that hasn't happened, I'm not directly involved with the victims but rather only a member of the bigger society, my perspective is different and as a law-abiding, voting, taxpaying legal citizen of the larger society my perspective and what is just is also valid. Right now I have no problem morally with putting these people away, even executing them if that's what society deemed fair. But I don't have to run wild and free with a prideful anger/lust rush to punish (and those who have had direct experince with such crimes, I UNDERSTAND their feelings... )

But also, when this stuff happens in the U.S., I have to pay for these guys to sit in jail - when many of them are highly capable of making way more $$ than I do in a year. It's not just an issue of fairness, it's also an issue of economy. Right now, all we can really do effectively is warehouse these people. But what do we do about the future, when we know that, really, the brain and body is just a bag full of chemicals and those chemicals don't always flow the same way in us? No one wants to prevent crime but people are very willing to punish. If we did one, we wouldn't have to do the other. And the government is going to tax you and spend your money anyway, so it's not even a liberal/conservative argument, it's about spending money more wisely. Why not spend it to research and fix the problem so that there are less victims to begin with. Once the problem has been addressed, when an honest attempt at prevention has been employed, and someone is still victimized THEN let the caveman within us come out, construct a gold-plated guillotine, put the punishment on pay-per-view and solve the national debt! But this waiting for a problem to occur and then reacting to it... why not just do away with airport security, just wait until the next hijacker acts, then punish- rather than prevent in the first place.
 
Last edited:
Oddjob0226 said:
But also, when this stuff happens in the U.S., I have to pay for these guys to sit in jail - when many of them are highly capable of making way more $$ than I do in a year. It's not just an issue of fairness, it's also an issue of economy.

On the subject of economy OJ, it's cheaper that way.
 
BigJim said:
On the subject of economy OJ, it's cheaper that way.


jim, do i see what i think i'm seeing?
are you espousing taking matters into your own hands, as o.j. simpson did? you who are anti-capital punishment?

now i waited till i heard back from a psychologist i know, and have strong reason to believe, and trust.
i called and asked him yesterday about what oddjob posted. truth be told i did mis-read what oddjob posted, i thought he said it's curable. well it's not. as oddjob, and the psychologist both said. it is also not controlable by monitoring alone. it is true that this is being done in a few cases, but what oddjob left out is that these individuals are also druged to the hilt! they are on the stuff i mentioned earlier. medisonal castration. and drugs to stem their urges. it is well accepted that these sick freaks can not, and never will abandon their hideous urges!

steve
 
I believe the OJ=Jim's abbreviation of oddjob, Steve who's post he was responding to.


Ray
 
areenactor said:
jim, do i see what i think i'm seeing?
are you espousing taking matters into your own hands, as o.j. simpson did? you who are anti-capital punishment?

Ven is right, OJ was what I was refering to oddjob0226 as. OJ Simpson doesn't come into it.

areenactor said:
now i waited till i heard back from a psychologist i know, and have strong reason to believe, and trust.
i called and asked him yesterday about what oddjob posted. truth be told i did mis-read what oddjob posted, i thought he said it's curable. well it's not. as oddjob, and the psychologist both said. it is also not controlable by monitoring alone. it is true that this is being done in a few cases, but what oddjob left out is that these individuals are also druged to the hilt! they are on the stuff i mentioned earlier. medisonal castration. and drugs to stem their urges. it is well accepted that these sick freaks can not, and never will abandon their hideous urges!
steve

I believe you! The pro-creative urge is the singlemost powerful urge in the human body. When that urge is focused on children, it's something to be feared! As chemical research advances, hopefully we'll come across pharmeceuticals that are both more effective and less stoning than those currently in use. I find the solution you proposed Steve, to be the closest we currently have to a problem-solver. It would be more effective though, if we could get more of them to come in of their own accord.
 
I'm pretty sure pathological pedophilia is curable. As soon as the control/insecurity issue is resolved and the perp in question has attained a healthily secure stance towards his/her own sexuality and self esteem, the need to abuse children will cease. Kids may still play a role in her/his fantasies, but the realization of those needs will fade and be replaced by a relatively normal sexual conduct pattern. I speak from (partly abstract, since not a pedophile) personal experience here. A few years ago, I wouldn't have thought it possible to get an erection (much less sexual intercourse) when not involved in some hardcore non-con tickle torture, and now I have wet dreams about plain ole' sex, all thanks to a woman who made me reconsider my sexual identity. Same goes for every sexual hangup - the effects can be suppressed to allow for a moderate and more acceptible erotic lifestyle.
 
Hmmmm Maurader, there is still

great disagreement among researchers and therapists as to whether or not that's true.

The psychology of sexuality being what it is, any disruption in natural development, especially if it is traumatic, actually changes the architecture & chemical functioning of the brain.

When unnatural sexual development is forced upon a child by a person in power and is further combined with trauma, complex damage to his psyche is the inevitable result.

There's something that makes one abused child grow up repulsed by the thought of abusing children himself, while another will blindly act out his early trauma. Unfortunately, it's not yet entirely known what that "something" is.

"Successful treatment" is a fuzzy term. Will he stop molesting children entirely, will he be satisfied with only molesting a few, or maybe just one now and then?

Given the appalling number of victims whose lives a pedophile will damage
(statistics show a single perpetrator will have an average of 400 victims during his career), I don't believe it is wise to take a chance on dubious treatments.

Button
 
maurader your's was not the same, at all!

there was a huge major difference between you, and pedophiles. your unnatural urges were directed towards adult women. you already had a normal target for your lusts.

i know you posted your opinion, out of a sense of true feelings of compassion. what's more it is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. i even respect you, and others like big jim, for your constant compassion.

however, your compassion is missplaced. and incorrect. these low-life scum, bottom feeders can never be changed, or rehabilitated. they will never come to lust after women, or men. they will always be drawn to children. speaking from personal experience, it is not worth the chance of another child being harmed to let one of these ambulatory piles of garbage loose on the streets. they should be rounded up, and put on an island somewhere. preferably in the arctic circle.

steve
 
What about false accusations?

Areenactor, the law can't be super-duper gung-ho find 'em and immediatly fry 'em about these guys, because what about a false accusation?

Once again, I don't know how the legal system prosecutes these guys or gals, but it seems like false accusations would be real easy to make. Like, if someone accused you of murdering BigJim, and we all go to BigJim's house, and he's sitting on his couch eating a cookie and watching the Incredible Hulk, we know for an absolute fact that you didn't murder him. If someone accuses you of stealing a million dollars, and we go to your bank records, and see that a million dollars was never deposited, and we audit the bank and a million dollars isn't missing, and your DNA isn't anywhere, you never stole the million dollars! But with pedophilia, it seems like all you need is one person's word. Look what happened to Paula Poundstone. She was taking care of some unstable children, one got pissed off and accused her of molestation, and she was dragged through an expensive legal process because of one kid's word. If there was an immediate death penalty, in essence, any kid could snap their fingers and have any adult executed by one accusation.

If the treatment avenue is pursued, and the person is innocent, the doctors won't be treating anything, so it can't be that bad (again, I don't know what treatments are used, so maybe it would be bad, but I'm assuming unnecessary treatment is better than death.)

This may sound like paranoia, but guess what? It did happen.

Remember way back, in like the early 90's, I believe, late 80's. Scores of parents were being accused of molesting their children, carted off to jail, humiliated, their children were taken from them and placed in the state's custody. They'd bring their kid to the doctor, and the doctors were using repressed memory therapies on them, and hypnosis. People started to wonder why so many parents could be doing these horrible things. Well, the people who revealed this was a sham came out of left field - the skeptics. That's because people who believed they were kidnapped by aliens were also using these same techniques to prove their abductions to Venus happened, and the skeptics debunked them. The doctors were implanting ideas into the children's heads, and it led to tragedy for the parents. Why would they do this? Why do cops break up supposed satanic cults, where poor girls are kidnapped and forced to have scores of babies to be sacrificed to satan? Because they get recognition, awards, and thousands of slap on the backs. But questions arose, like in the satanic cults cases - these girls were too young to possibly have that many babies, tests show they were never even pregnant, if hundreds of girls were kidnapped, who are they and why hasn't the city noticed..etc. These doctors didn't want to admit they were wrong, because it would mean for them loss of pride, loss of jobs, and massive lawsuits. So most stood by their lies. Even with the Catholic Church, though many priests are molestors, many are completely innocent, who are targets of people who don't like them and know they can take them out by one false accusation.

Now, that's on the innocent front.

Lets turn to those who are guilty.

If the penalty is so harsh, so severe that it outweighs the crime, worse things will happen. Look at WWI - Germany got treated so harshly after the war, it got revenge in WWII. The lesson - chill out with the unbelievable harsh justice, bad things happen. How many murders turn themselves in? A few, not a lot, but a few. They know if they do, they'll just get life in prison, and probably be released in their lifetime. How may robbers turn themselves in? A few more, the penalties are bad, but they can be out in a few years and start all over again. How many drug users turn themselves in - quite a few more - they'll just get treatment, and probably no jail time. (Look at all those actors...) Now, how many Al-Qeada turn themselves in - None! They know the penalties will be so harsh, they should just stay evil, they have a better chance. If the penalty for anyone who is a pedophile, even if they haven't done anything yet, is death, how many will turn themselves in - Zero. And that's the last thing anyone wants. You don't want society to start feeling sorry for them because they are being treated worse than murders. You don't want them to stay out there, and therefore have a better chance of doing harm, because they won't get help for fear of death or torture. And you certainly don't want to organize! That's would be the main affect of intensly harsh penalties - they actually join together, and start to help each other aggressively. They're bad enough alone, and they're even worse when in these loose knit groups, like the one that just got busted in Germany. I don't want to imagine what would happen if real fear drove them to form tight knit groups.

I truely believe that a cure can be found, but no one wants to find one. This is a different sitaution, but look how many people out there are happy that AIDS is around. I know too many people who just love the AIDS virus, because they're conservative christians, and conservative christian wll play lip service to how bad AIDS, and how a cure "must be found!" But take them behind the scenes, and they'll let you know that God sent down AIDS to punish those evil gay and lesbians, and anyone else who dares have too much fun with their sex life. AIDS is what they get for not living the way Jerry Falwell demands that they live, dammit! I believe this attitude prevails in society - better to judge these people than find a cure for this, because if we cured it, we'd have that fewer people to look down on and judge. Can't have that, now can we. Meanwhile, children are at risk, because of this stupidity. I also think this whole nightmare could almost prove God and Jesus non-existent. We're taught to be loving and forgive, but here is a group of people who are incapable of forgiveness, who are incapable of being saved. This would appear to nullify everything Jesus said, and prove religion false. Or am I wrong?

I mean, come on people! We can make artificial hearts, we can clone cows and cats and plants, and grow human ears on mice, and stick a damn rat with some glowing chemical, and have that damn rat that glowed in the dark, but we don't have the science to cure a bunch of pedophiles? I think if scientists REALLY tried, they'd cure this once and for all, and protect children today and forever from future predators. They just need to TRY.
 
it's true, many are faulsly accused.

it's become a favorite accusation here in illinois, for the mother to accuse the father of this in cases of divorce. my own best friend was the victim of this type of smear. but it was proven to be false ,and went against her in court. that's the place where it's proven, in court!

in my case i was able to give a VERY good description, and pick the bastard out of a line up. again, he was already a known child molester, with previous convictions. i think you'll find the real cases stand out.

if they are guilty, i personally say hang them from the nearest lamp post. but i know too many are wishy washy ,and will never go for that ,so that's why i say put them on an island, away from children forever.

i agree with you on the unjust peace following ww1. poor germany didn't even start the damn war!

steve
 
Re: maurader your's was not the same, at all!

areenactor said:
i know you posted your opinion, out of a sense of true feelings of compassion. what's more it is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. i even respect you, and others like big jim, for your constant compassion.
however, your compassion is missplaced. and incorrect. these low-life scum, bottom feeders can never be changed, or rehabilitated. they will never come to lust after women, or men. they will always be drawn to children. speaking from personal experience, it is not worth the chance of another child being harmed to let one of these ambulatory piles of garbage loose on the streets. they should be rounded up, and put on an island somewhere. preferably in the arctic circle.

steve

There's where we disagree. For me the transformation only occurs when they have carried their fantasies into real life and traumatised a child. That's when they make a conscious choice to stop fighting something they KNOW to be immoral and evil. People can't help the sexual urges they're programmed with. They're either in-built at birth, or sub-consciously aquired through experiences in life. No-one actually chooses to be a paedophile, but they do choose whether to get help and stop it, or carry their sickness through to physical reality.

Of course, I can afford to be compassionate towards such a person, because I've never been buggered by one. I have suffered from trauma that might (and I only say might, because I can't possibly know for sure) be equivalent to the sort of sexual abuse a paedophile commits. Most of my "trauma" was psychological, rather than physical. I imagine a paedophilic attack is closer to 50-50, wheras mine was 98-2.
 
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