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Legal Position in UK and USA on Being a Tickling Fetish Producer

Babyshambles

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Can anyone clarify the position of the law with regards producing video clips of people being tickled. Specifically can you address: -

Making of
Distribution of
Other requirements - age of models etc.

I live in the UK. What is the legal position in the UK?

You may also want to talk about legal position in USA, Australia, Canada, France, Germany etc.

This thread will be interesting to a lot of people.

Could producers chime in with their experiences too please?
 
I was wondering this too, With that new law they were on about before.

*waits patiently for the informative peeps to show up*
 
I was wondering this too, With that new law they were on about before.

*waits patiently for the informative peeps to show up*

Hopefully we'll get an answer.

I would like to enter this world in some capacity at some point. But I do not want to be open to even the smallest hint of criminal action against me. I don't have a criminal record, and I want to keep it that way!
 
What new law; the one they introduced to crack down on women trafficked for prostitution? I don't think that'd have much bearing on the production of pornography/ erotica unless you're having women trafficked for the express purpose of starring in your videos :-o

I don't think there's any more constraints legally speaking on a producer of pornographic material than there are on anyone else. As long as you pay your taxes and operate conscientiously you'll be alright. Also I believe the legal age for wimminz to be in pornos in the UK is 18; don't quote me on that though.

EDIT: Some shitz from Wikipedia on the subject as it stands in the UK:

In Britain, where pornography is more restricted than it is in many other English-speaking or Western Europe countries, sexual media is easily smeared for an audience that is seldom given an opportunity to see what really is sold under the name of "pornography".[1] However the current British legislative framework including the Obscene Publications Act 1959 (in England and Wales), the Civic Government (Scotland) Act 1982 and the Video Recordings Act 1984 leads to a confusing situation in which there is a theoretical ban on the publication and distribution (but not possession) of pornographic material in any form, which is in practice unenforcable due to the vagueness of the legal test of material that "depraves and corrupts". In practice, hardcore material on video and DVD was until recently banned by the requirement under the Video Recordings Act to be certifed by the BBFC, while mainstream hardcore material in other forms such as magazines and websites is essentially unrestricted. European, American and British hardcore pornographic magazines are now openly sold in many British newsagents, for instance. Due to libralisation in BBFC policy, mainstream hardcore DVDs now receive R18 certificates, legalising them but restricting their sale to licensed sex shops such as those in Soho.

British-made pornography tends to focus on a rough-and-ready semi-amateur look rather than the more stylized glamourous look of mainland European pornography.

Producers such as Ben Dover
lololol concentrate on producing "girl-next-door" or "candid" material. Some British pornography concentrates on sexual fetishism, particularly erotic spanking and rubber fetishism which has been popular in Britain since the 1950s.

Despite the existence of a national porn industry and widespread social acceptance of porn consumption, the UK is still the only Member State of the European Union that prohibits private imports of adult pornography by consumers coming from other Member States of the European Union. In the 2004-2005 fiscal year, the agents of Her Majesty Revenue & Customs seized 96783 items of pornographic media carried by people travelling into the UK".[2].

The UK porn industry is estimated to be now worth about 1 billion pounds, compared with 20 billion pounds worldwide


====================

In England and Wales, the main legislation on pornographic materials is contained in the Obscene Publications Act 1959, the Obscene Publications Act 1964 and the Indecent Displays (Control) Act 1981. Video-orientated depictions of hardcore material (with certain exceptions for works considered primarily 'artistic' rather than pornographic) were illegal until 1999, when trade-barrier difficulties with regards to European Community membership ensured the relatively free movement of such goods for personal importation only. R18-rated videos are only available in licensed sex shops, but hardcore pornographic magazines are available in newsagents' (shops selling newspapers, magazines, confectionary, et cetera). The Crown Prosecution Service is currently prosecuting a man under the Obscene Publications Act for a textual story posted on a pornography website involving Girls Aloud[16]. The Home Office brought forward legislation to criminalise possession of what it has labelled extreme pornography, now contained in sections 63 to 68 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008 [17].

Child pornography is illegal (child is defined as a person under 18) to possess, make (in terms of electronic copies) and to distribute, and is punishable by up to 10 years custodial sentence on conviction. In England and Wales the law on this type of material is strictly defined by the Protection of Children Act 1978, Section 160 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988, further amended by the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 to include pseudo-photographs, and the Sexual Offences Act 2003 which raised the age from 16 to 18 (the age of consent in the UK is still 16). Sales of pornography is for over 18s only. In Scotland, similar provision is to be found in sections 52 and 52A of the Civic Government (Scotland) Act 1982, which was also amended by the 1994 Act and by the Protection of Children and Prevention of Sexual Offences (Scotland) Act 2005.


So yeah. Pornography of any kind is illegal to publish and distribute in the UK, however nobody is going to enforce this law because to do so would require a prosecutor to definitively prove that the material is likely to "deprave and corrupt" a person who views it; both terms which, to the best of my knowledge, are not legally defined anywhere. Also it says here that a child is defined as a person under the age of 18; that's for the purposes of appearing in pornographic material because the age of consent is 16. Just, y'know.... yeah. Bizarre.
 
Last edited:
What new law; the one they introduced to crack down on women trafficked for prostitution? I don't think that'd have much bearing on the production of pornography/ erotica unless you're having women trafficked for the express purpose of starring in your videos :-o

I don't think there's any more constraints legally speaking on a producer of pornographic material than there are on anyone else. As long as you pay your taxes and operate conscientiously you'll be alright. Also I believe the legal age for wimminz to be in pornos in the UK is 18; don't quote me on that though.

Its the law introduced as due to a girl getting killed, and there was violent porn on the killers computer so they decided that all people that watch such things are potential killers also, so they made a law against it, This may or may not be what B`s on about but tis part of my concerns.
 
Its the law introduced as due to a girl getting killed, and there was violent porn on the killers computer so they decided that all people that watch such things are potential killers also, so they made a law against it, This may or may not be what B`s on about but tis part of my concerns.

I was unaware of this; link us to the story :-o It's not that case where some loon strangled a violin teacher and was found to have snuff porn on his computer is it? Because that's been bandied about for years and came in a while ago so it's hardly "new", and to be honest it seems like a fairly reasonable piece of legislation to me at least.
 
I have zero faith in the CPS in the UK. I would want substantial clarification on the law before I get into this tickling industry.
 
I was unaware of this; link us to the story :-o It's not that case where some loon strangled a violin teacher and was found to have snuff porn on his computer is it? Because that's been bandied about for years and came in a while ago so it's hardly "new", and to be honest it seems like a fairly reasonable piece of legislation to me at least.

Nah I dont think its that one, I dont even think this laws come into play yet, I think early next year or something, Dont take my word for it tho 😛 I dont pay much attention to politics so I know very little on the subject.

I havent read the story myself, I heard it from word of mouth so what I said may even be a stretch on the truth. But its something like that anyway 😉 Theres diffinatly some sort of ban on extreme porn coming up tho,, cant remember quite what it was, Something like its illegal to have material where someone appears to be suffering or something..
shrug.gif
 
I have zero faith in the CPS in the UK. I would want substantial clarification on the law before I get into this tickling industry.

If you want stone-clad clarification on your legal position as a producer of fetish erotica in the UK, you need to consult a legal professional. To the best of my knowledge we have no such professionals versed in UK law on the TMF; which means moar initial outlay for your enterprise to appease your own unease.

This is just me, but if I had the wherewithall and inclination to do something like this I'd just fucking go for it and deal with the problems is and when they arose. There are a fair few UK based bondage websites doing the rounds (restrained elegance being one), plus there ARE British based tickling companies out there; you see them from time to time popping up in the Clips forum, but their clips have a strange "Carry On!" vibe to them and as such they disappear quickly into the mire. That tells me that whatever legislation there is around, it's either not being enforced or it doesn't outlaw the production of such material. My understanding is that for the material to be proscribed it has to have violent content, so stuff like rape vids, bleeding, beating, any of that sort of "hardcore" stuff, that's out. I think anyone would have a hard time trying to convince a sound-minded judge that anything but the most mean-spirited tickling video constituted a portrayal of sexual violence, so I'd think as long as you don't take the tickling, bondage or whatever too far you'll be alright. As far as worrying about the CPS, don't; a more effete, ineffectual bunch of no-hopers you could not hope to find. Their recruitment policy since 2002 seems to have become "find chimp, apply wig, send into court".
 
As far as worrying about the CPS, don't; a more effete, ineffectual bunch of no-hopers you could not hope to find. Their recruitment policy since 2002 seems to have become "find chimp, apply wig, send into court".

Agreed. But being so incompetent is dangerous. It means that they won't even think about their own guidelines when making a prosecution. Prosecuting a tickling producer will almost never be in the public interest.

But I tell you where I worry. I worry about the legal position when recruiting models. If someone takes offence to your recruitment drive (even in the fetish model industry) you could have a visit from the cops very quickly.

Or if a model agrees to work with you under misaprehension, and then calls the police to compain.

And lets face it, no one is going to lay out the bare facts in a recruitment drive.

"I want to film you being tickled out of your mind to sell to a bunch of perverts who will masturbate furiously. This is a fetish. I have a fetish and I will be aroused when filming it and tickling you."
 
Agreed. But being so incompetent is dangerous. It means that they won't even think about their own guidelines when making a prosecution. Prosecuting a tickling producer will almost never be in the public interest.

The thing to remember about the CPS is that they're working under the same restraints of economy as every other section of the British government; everything they do has to be value for money. That means if they're not 99% sure of a conviction, they won't bring the fucker to court. Given the fuzzy wording of the legislation as I understand it they're not likely to vigorously pursue a prosecution of someone who is taping girls laughing as they're being tickled. To my mind you'd have a hard time convincing anyone that the tickling in any of the clips I've seen constitutes an act of violence, or that such material is likely to deprave and corrupt a person who views it. There are so many defences to that it'd hardly be worth bringing it to court, and to the best of my knowledge ("new law" not withstanding) there's no legal precedent for it.

But I tell you where I worry. I worry about the legal position when recruiting models. If someone takes offence to your recruitment drive (even in the fetish model industry) you could have a visit from the cops very quickly.

Yeah you could, but what are they going to do you for? They can't get you for solicitation, because you're not soliciting sex. They can't get you for coercion of any kind, because you're not coercing anyone to do anything.

Or if a model agrees to work with you under misaprehension, and then calls the police to compain.

And lets face it, no one is going to lay out the bare facts in a recruitment drive.

"I want to film you being tickled out of your mind to sell to a bunch of perverts who will masturbate furiously. This is a fetish. I have a fetish and I will be aroused when filming it and tickling you."

The answer to that one is simple; don't lie. Be straight with women you're seeking to recruit in regard to exactly what it is you're doing and what you want them to do and you can't go wrong. Obviously you'd leave out the bit about distributing the video as a wank-aid in your blurb; you can make people aware that it's an erotica production without having to be quite so vulgar and forthright with your words.

The best bet, if you're really really worried about this and are serious about starting up a production company, is to talk to a legal professional. They'd be able to set you straight on matters pertaining to the law and legality of the videos you're making, and explain what responsibilities you'd have to assume as a producer/ distributor of such material and, ultimately, as an employer.

EDIT: Just out of interest, if you WERE to start up a production company what sort of videos would you be producing? Videos like Viper's with a heavily sexualised BDSM component, or videos like The Last Laugh which are almost purely tickling fetish material?
 
EDIT: Just out of interest, if you WERE to start up a production company what sort of videos would you be producing? Videos like Viper's with a heavily sexualised BDSM component, or videos like The Last Laugh which are almost purely tickling fetish material?

If I was to do this, I would not want to do anything too sexual. Vibration, orgasm etc. would be out of the question.

Nudity would be a possibility - but top half only, for my particular tastes.

I would not go down the route of last laugh either. They are nice, but too "organic" for my liking. They don't appeal to me in an aesthetic way.

If I was to go down this route, as a fully-fledged producer, it would be a small shop, producing a small number of aesthetically pleasing, artistic, beautiful films of extremely attractive models being tickled. The producer of "ticklish bride" and "hotel manager tickled" would be part of my inspiration.
 
If I was to do this, I would not want to do anything too sexual. Vibration, orgasm etc. would be out of the question.

Nudity would be a possibility - but top half only, for my particular tastes.

I would not go down the route of last laugh either. They are nice, but too "organic" for my liking. They don't appeal to me in an aesthetic way.

If I was to go down this route, as a fully-fledged producer, it would be a small shop, producing a small number of aesthetically pleasing, artistic, beautiful films of extremely attractive models being tickled. The producer of "ticklish bride" and "hotel manager tickled" would be part of my inspiration.

Sounds good 😀 To be honest I don't really think it matters too much what you're doing, as long as it's not overt sexualised violence you should be alright under the law and whatnot and I really, really don't see how tickling could be portrayed as sexualised violence. If you're going to go for it then good luck, Xenu-speed and keep us posted. Also don't use Brummie girls; their voices are obnoxious and their laugh is worse >_<
 
Sounds good 😀 To be honest I don't really think it matters too much what you're doing, as long as it's not overt sexualised violence you should be alright under the law and whatnot and I really, really don't see how tickling could be portrayed as sexualised violence. If you're going to go for it then good luck, Xenu-speed and keep us posted. Also don't use Brummie girls; their voices are obnoxious and their laugh is worse >_<

You know - I think I might just have to grasp the nettle and go for this.

Look out for some nice material in January.

:roflmao:
 
What "nettle", man? Starting a production company is cheaper than paying for dungeon sessions and you get to make money off your hobby. It's like a hobby baker baking cakes to sell on the internet. But with more semi-nude women and shit.

Do it man. For the good of the city 😀
 
Can anyone clarify the position of the law with regards producing video clips of people being tickled. Specifically can you address: -

Making of
Distribution of
Other requirements - age of models etc.

I live in the UK. What is the legal position in the UK?

You may also want to talk about legal position in USA, Australia, Canada, France, Germany etc.

This thread will be interesting to a lot of people.

Could producers chime in with their experiences too please?

I do not have a clue about that, but consult legal aid. There are British selling ticking clips in Clips4sale, maybe you can contact them and get some indication from them about your questions or who you should ask. Maybe they do not replay for fear of competition, but in any case, you would lose nothing by trying.
 
Hari, is this what you're on about... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4195332.stm

Aye, that's the music teacher/ violin woman/ whatever she was who got strangled by a strangling fetishist. The laws they're planning are against stuff like necrophilia and proper hardcore torture porn (i.e material where the woman is physically harmed), and they're talking about prosecuting people who produce such material under the Obscene Publications Act 1959. That particular act outlaws the making of material which has the potential to "deprave or corrupt" people and is fuzzy at best.

Frankly I think this is all a big hoo-hah over nothing. They're not doing anything more than clarifying existing legislation and will maybe start clamping down on violent pornography in the same way as they do on child pornography; something they're perfectly within their rights to do, since technically ALL pornography is illegal in the UK.


tl;dr P&R Rant Time:

It's also yet another example of a family who have suffered a loss taking their grieving out into the public domain with a misguided campaign which finds support amongst the dense, opinion-seeking throngs in Parlaiment. The same thing happened with automatic rifles after Hungerford and handguns after Dunblane. In those cases the families and law-makers seemed to think that by outlawing the weapons that these men fired they'd be able to cut the number of gun-related crimes. That didn't work to any noticeable effect. In this case the family of the dead woman think it was the violent pornography he wanked over that caused this man to murder their daughter, as if he'd stumbled on it by accident one day, thought "wow, strangling a music teacher is a fucking HAWT IDEA", then went out and strangled a music teacher. This bloke was a loonie before he ever downloaded the images, so how making the possession of such material illegal is going to save lives is beyond me. Fucking Britain, eh? Hell in a handcart says I.
 
Or was he?
After reading about Leah Betts, I took to wearing a backpack of water to nightclubs.
 
Being in Australia I can't say I am versed in US/UK laws. But the basic, universal, all-bases-covered legal principle is the same:

Ask your lawyer 🙂

A TMF member might say the same thing as an adult industry barrister; but if the faecal matter hits the rotating device, at least I can sue the latter for professional negligence.
 
babyshambes just PM some producers
they will not reply to a main thread
 
I thought I'd revive this thread since the new law banning possession of extreme pornography is now in effect (as of Jan 26/09) and there seemed to be some misinformation floating around.

The law doesn't target producers of porn only, it targets anyone in the UK (including producers and viewers) possessing an image/video that is both:

a) pornographic
An image is “pornographic” if it is of such a nature that it must reasonably be assumed to have been produced solely or principally for the purpose of sexual arousal.

and b) extreme
An “extreme image” is an image which—

(a) falls within subsection (7), and

(b) is grossly offensive, disgusting or otherwise of an obscene character.

(7) An image falls within this subsection if it portrays, in an explicit and realistic way, any of the following—

(a) an act which threatens a person’s life,

(b) an act which results, or is likely to result, in serious injury to a person’s anus, breasts or genitals,

(c) an act which involves sexual interference with a human corpse, or

(d) a person performing an act of intercourse or oral sex with an animal (whether dead or alive),

and a reasonable person looking at the image would think that any such person or animal was real.

The relevant section of the law is here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2008/ukpga_20080004_en_9#pt5-pb1

The law is absolutely pointless and will do more harm than good overall, but tickling itself doesn't fall under the banned category. You'd basically have to possess an image or video where someone's life, anus, breasts or genitals were in serious danger.... or be tickling an animal or a corpse :blaugh:.
 
I thought I'd revive this thread since the new law banning possession of extreme pornography is now in effect (as of Jan 26/09) and there seemed to be some misinformation floating around.

The law doesn't target producers of porn only, it targets anyone in the UK (including producers and viewers) possessing an image/video that is both:

a) pornographic


and b) extreme


The relevant section of the law is here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2008/ukpga_20080004_en_9#pt5-pb1

The law is absolutely pointless and will do more harm than good overall, but tickling itself doesn't fall under the banned category. You'd basically have to possess an image or video where someone's life, anus, breasts or genitals were in serious danger.... or be tickling an animal or a corpse :blaugh:.

The above is bang on but just to clarify, there IS a potential situation where this can affect us in the tickling community:

An “extreme image” is an image which—

(a) falls within subsection (7), and

(b) is grossly offensive, disgusting or otherwise of an obscene character.

(7) An image falls within this subsection if it portrays, in an explicit and realistic way, any of the following—

(a) an act which threatens a person’s life,

It's the bits in bold that cause a problem here mainly because of their incredibly loose wording. Let me give you an example here of someone being tickled while tied up to an X frame. If someone wanted to be a complete bar steward they could claim that the mere act of being in such a position is a 'threat to the individuals life' as (and this is just an example to illustrate the point, I know how ridiculous this is going to sound) 'if anything went wrong it may be impossible to release them in time and it is clearly a situation designed to ape torture' etc etc etc.

Ludicrous? Yes but at the same time it's an argument that IS within the letter of the law. This is what the Fetish scene in the UK has been up in arms about for some time now but it's now law. Worse, the mere act of possessing such an image can land you in trouble so if, for example, you get a nice little virus that downloads an image that falls within these categories without your knowledge you can be busted for simply having it on your hard drive.

That said the chances of actually getting in trouble for this are so slim you're probably more likely to win the lottery.
 
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