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My View on Things

ShiningIce

3rd Level Green Feather
Joined
Feb 14, 2002
Messages
4,702
Points
36
Ok, everyone here pretty much knows how liberal I am. After some long hard thinking I wrote this essay to explain my views.......THIS IS NOT FLAME BAIT!


Conservatives stand for status quo. Liberals want change. Conservatives only oppose (abolition of slavery and segregation; Christianity). They propose nothing of value for the public. Creativity and growth occur under liberal leadership. War, pestilence, misery occur under conservatives. Conservatives misunderstand (and that's giving them the benefit of the doubt) simple principles of economics. Poor people make the economy move. Money in their hands provide benefits to many. Money in the hands of conservatives benefits only conservatives. Poor people simply want to live easier. They spend their money to provide that ease. They buy cars, washing machines, TVs, VCRs, CD players, clothes, and other consumables. This creates jobs. Conservatives park their money in offshore bank accounts and avoid paying taxes. Yet, conservatives are the first to demand war to correct slights to their positions and well being. They who contribute little to the treasury demand and get the most in return. Selfish blighters. They are the first to call themselves Christian. And are the first to refute Christian teachings.

I would say this type of generalized tripe in your article message is typical of whites who would tell us how to deal with our painful experiences that continue to today in this society. I wonder what the reaction would be to the situation faced by Jews in Warsaw in 1939. That experience, though somewhat different in scale and scope, holds similarities to our plight.

Jews who advocated what Clarence, Thomas, Walter and Ward propose, were similarly treated and somethimes put to death in Warsaw. Clarence and friends urge cooperation with those who wish us ill and on the oppressors' terms. Jews who pushed for cooperation with the occupying Nazis used the same arguments as Clarence and co.

What is the level of mistreatment Clarence and friends receive? They are unmolested physically, but castigated verbally for their opinions. Right wingers do not died for their beliefs. Only progressive voices are silenced: MLK, JFK, RFK, MX. I cannot recall any dropout/uneducated Rush Limbaugh types getting murdered. This is the American way. The nail that sticks up gets hammered. Can conservatives (reactionaries) point fingers? With honesty they can not. The level of hatred levelled at President Clinton from the day he WON election fairly and squarely is without parallel in anyone's experience. Reactionaries put the m in mistreatment. Even Richard Nixon (Watergate, Allende, CREEP) and the amiable idiot Ronald Reagan (Iranian Hostage crisis, Nicaraguan Contras, Iranian Arms deals) were treated decently when they were shown to have attempted hijacking of the constitution.

This is not a nation of free speech. One who has the temerity to express an opinion in public must be prepared to receive vilification, if one is progressive minded. No one shoots reactionaries. Reactionaries are the ones with the shooter mentality. As far as one might generalize, blacks do not display political bumper stickers on their automobiles that support liberal causes/candidates; only conservatives do. When last have you seen one on a black person's vehicle? There is a reason for that. It simply is dangerous to do so. Liberal minded people do not mark cars, break windscreens because they do not like a bumper sticker. Reactionary/consrvatives very often cause damage to vehicles displaying messages contrary to their positions. They feel (not think) they have a right to tell others what to think and how to express themselves.

It is a specious assertion that liberals stand for a welfare state among other things. I suppose it is only liberals who subscribe to New Testament offerings that we should help the less fortunate, we should strive for fairness in all dealings, love our neighbors, etc. Reactionaries/conservatives spout individual responsibility, but practice corporate welfare. Unchallenged subsidies, guarantees, cost overruns, monopolistic contracting in billions of dollars are available to giant corporations. Reactionaries have the gall to decry a few (I repeat, a few) contracts to black companies to provide $65,000 worth of furniture, $400,000 worth of asphalt, et al, amounting never to more that $1 million each. The totality of affirmative action contracts awarded to black comapnies last year does not exceed the cost overrun paid to General Dynamics on one submarine contract.

Multiculturalism. It is a fact. The complexion of this nation is changing. Reactionaries should take a page from the book they ask us to read. Get over it and quit whining. Move on. Whites will be in the national minority in due course. They fear that what was done unto others may be their fate under changing and different circumstances. Folks with clear consciences should not fear this coming phenomenon. I embrace it.

Why is this nation hated so abroad? It is not the nation that is hated. It is the power structure and its representative face: White males. Having visited over 90 different nations and being able to hold discourse with different elements on all continents (Europe is not a continent), I have heard the voices of many express their unappreciation. The handlers of Clarence and Ward embody those objects of hatred. It is for good reason they are disliked. Most of the world's people live at tiptoe stance, not knowing from where the meals for tomorrow will come. They are not stupid. They know when things are uneven. They know their despotic rulers are acting on behalf of U.S. and lesser foreign interests. No one has to tell them that. They tolerate, persevere, endure until all boils over. Then they go on seemingly mindless rampages of unbridled rage. They are not after progressives. They want release from the conservatives. Downtrodden people in many places say that white male conservatives are incapable of honesty, dcency, fairness, empathy and justice. They cry out why is this happening to us? What have we done to faceless people who have never been to our village? They see their gold, diamonds, oil, minerals, agricultural products leaving their shores for pittances of compensation.

Why Clarence, Jesse Lee, Ward andco. believe they have much in common with their handlers is beyond reason. The 10% that owns 90% of this nation's bounty are phylogetenically incapable of having the likes of those who "stray from the reservation" in their midsts. This cadre may do their bidding by sowing confusion and dissent, but they can never be part of the oligarchy. Many of us liberals choose not to attempt entry into those halls of the mighty.

We who believe in a "paternalistic" government want one thing from that government: ...establish justice, ensure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.
 
Dentyne Blue...

I have no problems with what you just stated, Ice - I agree with most of it.

It's that damned blue-coloured font that is driving me batty!!

Other than that, good show, mate.


Cheers. 😀
 
I disagree with most of what you said and I hate the blue color writing as well. Still I support your right to believe what you want. I just wish someone would tell me where my offshore bank account is.
 
ShiningIce said:





Multiculturalism. It is a fact. The complexion of this nation is changing. Reactionaries should take a page from the book they ask us to read. Get over it and quit whining. Move on. Whites will be in the national minority in due course. They fear that what was done unto others may be their fate under changing and different circumstances. Folks with clear consciences should not fear this coming phenomenon. I embrace it.


That is quite possibly the single most offensive remark that I have ever seen, on any forum. Your whole "Essay" is filled with obvious racism. Weak...quite Weak...
 
Last edited:
ShiningIce said:
Conservatives only oppose (abolition of slavery and segregation; Christianity). They propose nothing of value for the public. Creativity and growth occur under liberal leadership. War, pestilence, misery occur under conservatives. Conservatives misunderstand (and that's giving them the benefit of the doubt) simple principles of economics.



938419.jpg


Run, boys! She's gonna blow!!!


🙄

😛

:angel:


ASUTickler
 
Ice- Daumantas, Capt. Spalding and Hal are all at least as "liberal" (whatever that means) as you are. Though I usually disagree with their views, I welcome their posts. They express themselves with intelligence, wit, humor, and respect for the views of others. You do none of those things. Try being more like them. Your rants make me tired.

Strelnikov
 
Yup, I pretty much expected these types of responses from the right wingers. You guys just cant respond to anything that crtizises ur views without being hostile, if I was a foreigner saying these things I probably would have been treated even worse. You can come up with all the smart ass responses you want but if none of you have anything INTELLIGENT to say dont waste my time. Maybe I'm different from the other liberals here because Ill get down in the mud and sling it out with you conservatives, and thats fine by me. 🙂
 
Expected?

Of course you'll get those types of responses...you made sure of it with unsupported "theories" that you've thrown out as "facts"...lol.

Like this: 1-- "Conservatives stand for status quo."
2-- "Creativity and growth occur under liberal leadership
3-- "Conservatives misunderstand (and that's giving them the benefit of the doubt) simple principles of economics.
4-- "Liberal minded people do not mark cars, break windscreens because they do not like a bumper sticker."
5--"Whites will be in the national minority in due course.


Says who? You? I just grabbed a few, but your entire post is filled with the same vein, so why would you be surprised that people might not agree with your generalizations? These type of steroetypes are what prevent reasonable discussion between opposed viewpoints, because they present themselves as absolutes, instead of mere opinion and conjecture. You're guilty of the same bias you're ranting about...kind of ironic really. Q
 
Yep

Ice has proven what the liberal beliefs are based on, hypocrisy. Well said, Q.
 
Nah...

I'm not talking about the "orientation" of his post, merely the way it's presented actually. If you provide a link to the Census bureau that shows clearly that over the last four censuses the % of white males has decreased an average of 4% per decade, and THEN you state that given the continuation of that trend, eventually white males will no longer be in the majority within "x" years, it just makes for a better argument. Same goes for sweeping statements such as "Conservatives stand for the status quo." Any statement that labels an entire group and is just an "island" in itself, is suspect and poorly presented, imo.
Try this one: "All people over 6'2" tall are dizzy because the air is thinnner up there. They don't have the reasoning ability of other people because their brains are oxygen deprived."

See? I'm not a doctor( as far as you know...lol), and I have no proof, but it's MY assertation that this is so....because I know a couple of guys that tall and they're not too bright, at least imo...

It's just sloppy posting and a sure way to get a knee jerk reaction, but if that's what floats yer boat, keep putting them up and enjoy the feedback. Q
 
Re: Nah...

qjakal said:
Try this one: "All people over 6'2" tall are dizzy because the air is thinnner up there. They don't have the reasoning ability of other people because their brains are oxygen deprived."

See? I'm not a doctor( as far as you know...lol), and I have no proof, but it's MY assertation that this is so....because I know a couple of guys that tall and they're not too bright, at least imo...


AHA!! I knew there was a reason I seem to be getting dumber! Uhhh... DUDE!!! Where's my CAR?!?!

😛


ASUTickler
 
It is futile for me to attempt to carry on a discussion with one who who is so untutored and obviously knows so little about the world in which he/she purports to live. Racism, Indeed!! Such statements are meant only to terminate speech.



That is quite possibly the single most offensive remark that I have ever seen, on any forum. Your whole "Essay" is filled with obvious racism. Weak...quite Weak...
 
Ok

Now thats a little overboard, ice. I don't agree with your opinions, but I won't personally attack you. You, on the other hand, have been quick to insult me. I'll be the better man and let it go. Im disappointed in ya, bro.
 
You are entitled to your opinions Ice however extreme they are, however I must agree with qjakal that making these unsubstantiated claims is only flamebait. You might want to take page from Hal or BigJim, who have a liberal point of view but give facts to back up their ideas. It is always a pleasure to discuss stuff with them. This is merely going to turn into a hurling of insults at one another which I will not take part in. Mainly cause I like you to much to do that.
 
Look it up in the dictionary and look at the changing demographics. The fastest growing groups and sexes are..... Not even militia groups would contend that there is a significant difference between atmospherics at 5' 6'', and 6' 2" above sea level. It is a hallmark of immaturity and circular thinking to take absurd propositions (I am not a doctor. Already indicated), flavor them with egocentric predicaments (I have no proof) and arrive at specious conclusions (A coule of tall guys are not bright because they are tall).

What in the world is an assertation (assertion)?





what do u sat to this response? " If you provide a link to the Census bureau that shows clearly that over the last four censuses the % of white males has decreased an average of 4% per decade, and THEN you state that given the continuation of that trend, eventually white males will no longer be in the majority within "x" years, it just makes for a better argument. Same goes for sweeping statements such as "Conservatives stand for the status quo." Any statement that labels an entire group and is just an "island" in itself, is suspect and poorly presented, imo. Try this one: "All people over 6'2" tall are dizzy because the air is thinnner up there. They don't have the reasoning ability of other people because their brains are oxygen deprived."

See? I'm not a doctor( as far as you know...lol), and I have no proof, but it's MY assertation that this is so....because I know a couple of guys that tall and they're not too bright"
 
Interesting thread, Ice. I am rather liberal, but frankly, your essay sounds more like a fallacious editorial to me. I'm not saying you're wrong, but if you want to share your views with us, I suggest taking a look at this:

http://home.att.net/~resurgence/LiberalFAQ.htm

The late Steve Kangas was a hard-core liberal, but his arguments are well-written, and he always backs them up with research. Your passion is appreciated, dude, but it needs to be tempered with logic! 😀

Please don't take this personally. Thanks, and I hope I've helped you. 🙂

P.S. I like the color blue, but not on a silver background! 😛
 
About time you showed up Alex. 😀 My proofs coming Ill just have to take a couple of days and collect it all and put into essay form, and when I do........ :firedevil :firedevil :firedevil
 
I think you're all a bunch of wankers...😀

How's that for flamebait? ...:wavingguy "hi!"

I remember...oh, it seems like yesterday, now, when yours truly posted some rather post-inducing threads aboot certain views concerning some certain topics...

I've even (inadvertently) hijacked a thread, or two, with my replies...

But, in the end, when all is said and done, one feels better for sharing one's opinions, even if they turn out to be unpopular.

I say, "Well done, Ice."

But please remember, all of you, in the spirit of this forum, that once you've ventilated your opinion(s), there are others upon these boards that need our genuine discussion and support, so let us not dwell upon the trivial, shall we, hmmm?

Take care, all. We're just playing with words, here...

Cheers. 😀
 
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