The Original Star Wars Trilogy

[Celtic_Emperor]

Well, last week I purchased my copy of the trilogy and almost immediately noticed the new additions and differences.

The most noticable ones to me were:

- The eye goggles on Vader's helmet are now semi-transparent in New Hope, and you can now see Anakin's eyes and parts of his face.

- The lightsaber blades are more refined and touched up, like in the new trilogy.

- Leia's eyeshadow seems to be different in New Hope, going from a bluish color to an almost orange one.

- Emperor Palpatine's transmission to Vader in ESB now has Ian McDiarmid as the hologram instead of that older, crudy looking animation. Also, Palpatine's messege to Vader is a bit longer and includes new dialogue.

- The actor who played Jango Fett in Episode II does the voice over for Boba Fett in this trilogy, with the former voice having been replaced with Jango's for a more fimiliar sound. Theres also a slight difference in the dialogue when Boba Fett speaks.

- At the end of ROTJ, Anakin's spirit has been replaced by Haiden (can't spell his last name) from the new trilogy. I see this as a plus and a minus. I see it as a plus because it goes to show that when you've returned to the Force you regain your former self, in this case, Anakin's youth and vibrance. It gave a sense of deja vu, and really connected the new trilogy to the original.

I see it as bad, because theres no point in him returning to looking as though he's a young adult. Obi-Wan wasn't any younger, and neither was Yoda.

- Anything that was in the "special additions" was present in all three movies. This includes added scenes and better effects/explosures, etc.


Some of the oddball stuff/mistakes:

- One of the tie fighters during the dogfight between the Falcon in New Hope has a green box around it for a brief moment. Obviously this was not editted out as it was supposed to be.

- Theres something wrong with the audio throughout the discs. I ended up having turn the volume up louder than I normally would to hear whats being said. It seemed as if when one character spoke it would be fine, but the character next to them sounded like they were several feet away or in the background. Odd. Anyone else notice this? I at first thought it might be my tv, the dvd player, or even the discs, but I don't think it is.

- When Vader and Luke's sabers clash together when Luke attempts to kill Palpatine in ROTJ, Vaders saber looks like its transparent and is moving through Luke's. That shouldn't be.

Theres plenty more I know I noticed but can't recall at the moment.

Anyone else notice anything, good or bad?

Overall, I think its definitely an improvement over the original.

 

[alchemy1]

Lucas lucas lucas...

Alright, so the Greedo scene was a LITTLE better, but there really is no excuse for altering a great work of art. You'd think that he had done enough damage with the "special editions," but nooooo. Further more, why did anakin get to be young in the afterlife and obi-wan and yoda remain old geezers? If I were them I'd be pissed! Sure, the quality of the picture is better, but seriously, someone needs to take the scissors away from Georgie.
:grind_tee

 

[alchemy1]

oh, by the way, your artwork truely rules man!

 

[BigNorm]

lol, all those edits, reminds me of that south park episodes where lucas edits all his films to take out violence, i.e. replacing guns and lasers with walkie talkies. lol.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

@ alchemy- Lucas is notorious for editting his own material. Sometimes though, he bends to the will of the executives though and its not really his idea to make the change. Lucas is a brilliant man to create such a story and bring it to life like this. On the other hand though, his sense as a director isn't as good as it could be.

Thanks, I'm glad you like it. ^__^ I've taken a bit of a break recently, but I should have more of my artwork up sooner or later.

@ Bignorm- I didn't like the fact Lucas took at the guns, for only one reason- wheres the sense of urgency in trying to contain an alien presense? The guns are necessary, at least with the agents' mentality.

On the other hand though, I don't blame Lucas and Spielberg for caving in under pressure. If you watched the extra features on the E.T discs, it seemed to me like Spielburg was relecutant to take the guns away and put the walkie talkies in instead. But it was a "family movie" and young children were watching it as well.

Its like what Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) said in a recent interview-

" They look at all this footage (20th Century Fox in regards to the character Chewbacca) and thats all they can think of is "this character has no pants on!" They had big fights about this back and forth. They did sketches of him (Chewbacca) in koolots, and baggy surfer shorts, and I was like "this is so stupid!"

They didn't even want "Wars" in the title."

- Mark Hamill

 

[nessonite1]

I see it as bad, because theres no point in him returning to looking as though he's a young adult. Obi-Wan wasn't any younger, and neither was Yoda.

One could argue, I suppose, that he returned to the point in his life before he turned to the dark side. Yoda and Obi Wan stayed old because they had never turned. Perhaps the Jedi don't see age as dibilitating and undesirable so looking like their wise old selves in their ever-present ghostly forms isn't a bad thing.

I don't mind the new versions of the trilogy. I dig the enhanced special effects. I do NOT like that Lucas is refusing to aknowl;edge the existence of the original versions and will not release them on DVD so loyal purists can view it in widescreen (finally) and with digital picture and sound. That's just wrong I think and is really slighting the very people who made the series so popular.
Also the damn alien shooting Han Solo first...that's just plain wrong. It wasn't even executed properly and looks like they used scissors and scotch tape on the film to put it in there.

 

[Ghost_Host_9991]

ok...a few things:

Vader's eyes were always visible in the tie fighter scene at the end of star wars.

The sarlac should not look like audrey 2 from little shop of horrors.

I understand wanting to sort of let the original movies tie in with the new trilogy, but its a bit like screwing with the ceiling of the sistene chapel after its been painted and enjoyed.

I can't speak for everyone but i grew up on these movies, and to see them messed with, clipped, probed, and imasculated (did we really need a dance review number in Jabba's palace?)

You shouldn't fix something that isn't broken. I have a VHS box set that was THX remastered BEFORE the special edition crap was added...this is my ideal set and I'm sticking with it. I have the movies i love wihtout George Lucas or anyone else screwing them up.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I have the VHS trilogy before the special edition as well, and I appriciate both versions. Its fortunate we have a choice of which one we like more.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Oh, and a good point Ness, in him returning to an younger version of his previous self. I was sort of thinking the same thing, seeing as how being 'old' isn't a bad thing for Jedi in Star Wars. It doesn't help in duel obviously, but the experience, knowledge, and wisdom they gain and the ability to use and channel the Force more than makes up for it.

I see Anakin's spirit returning as a youth as a good thing also because it represents his innocence. Sure, he was a pain in the ass for Obi-Wan all those years Kenobi trained him, most probably, but at heart he was/is a good person, and its good to know he never really lost that, even as Darth Vader.

In fact, one of the reasons Palpatine wanted a showdown between Vader and his son is because he knew that Anakin had "awoken" after his duel with Luke of Bespin. The Emperor forsaw his own death, but figured if he could get rid of what he felt would be a treacherous Vader, he'd have a new, younger apprentice. It was also a test, just to make sure Vader wouldn't turn on him, by pitting him against his son.

Either way, it was a win-win situation for Palpatine. If Luke wins, he has a new apprentice. If Vader wins, then Vader's loyalty is proven and theres theres no more threat to his power since I doubt Leia would ever have developed in the Force without Luke's help.

I'm sure though, that even in his vast knowledge and foresight Palpatine didn't forsee Luke rejecting the dark side or Vader betraying him to the point where he'd actually kill him.

As far as the war was concerned, Palpatine didn't sense the presense of the Ewoks. And really, its ironic to believe the smallest and most meek of creatures would end up being the downfall of an empire.

Even so though, people tend to forget that the Empire isn't defeated at this point, its just been broken and scattered. Basically, the situations are now reversed, with the Empire being scattered to distant planets and the Alliance now holding the core sectors in the galaxy like the Empire was, namely Coruscant, the Imperial Captial system.

The Skywalker family story isn't over yet, and Palpatine isn't dead.

But then again, thats only if you follow up on the movies by looking at the novels and comic books, particularly Dark Empire, wherein the aftermath of Return of the Jedi is apparent.

 

[alchemy1]

Nope...ain't right.

Alright, I KINDA get the whole before he turned to the dark side thing, but it still doesn't make sense. And I wouldn't say that the Jedi did not have something against aging. Obi-wan lamented the fact that in episode 4, he had "grown too old for this sort of thing." Yoda did as well by stating "Sick have I become. Old and weak." Let's face it. Even Jedi don't like to get old. In fact, Anakin looks like he was the smart one. All you have to do is turn to the dark side at your ideal age, stomp around space ships blowing up planets, torture princesses and smugglers, and simply remember to say
"the dark side, who needs it" right before you bite the big one and bing bam boom, INSTANT ETERNAL YOUTH! 😀
______________________________________________________

Do you want the moustache on or off?
...TOO BAD! - Captain Murphy

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I'm sure their lamenting their age had nothing to do with the Force or being a Jedi, but the natural order of aging itself. No one likes getting old. Not because of the age, but because you are less capable of doing the things you do.

I'm sure that even Palpatine laments his handicaps as being an old man. But in his case, he has people doing all the work for him, so it probably wouldn't bother him that much, and as the single greatest power in the galaxy next to the Force itself, his age isn't a handicap at all. And when he comes back resurrected in a young clone body in Dark Empire, theres nothing for him to worry about. He has his youth back and is all the more deadlier for it. That, and he has the largest and most powerful warship in the galaxy, his command vessal- the Eclipse.

 

[alchemy1]

Aaaah...Eclipse ShmEclipse. Now the Executor...that was a ship.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Umm, you do know that the Executor was a Super Class Star Destroyer, right?

The Eclipse is an Eclipse Class Super Star Destroyer, the first of it's kind.

The Eclipse was twice the size of any original super star destroyer ship, that includes Lord Vader's Executor.

That makes the Eclipse 10 times the size of any Imperial Class Star Destroyer.

The damn thing was so huge and its hull was so heavily reinforced and the shields were so powerful it could actually ram enemy ships without hesitation. It had enough firepower to take on entire New Republic fleets, without any escort or back-up. It also had gravity well projectors to keep enemy ships from fleeing into hyperspace.

It housed about 3 times as many fighters than any super class model destroyer, it carried more prefabricated garrison bases, more walkers, and it even had a super laser on it dude. A SUPER LASER, just like the one on the second Death Star, although it was only powerful enough to crack the crust of a planet rather than destroy it outright. Still, against capital ships it was devestating, destroying them with one shot no matter how powerful the shields might have been. Against rebel bases, it did it's job fine from orbit, since it could basically kill anything on the surface and below, rendering the planet un-inhabitable.

It was solid black, and it had a cool design. Actually measurements show that the Executor was only about 4.7 miles long. If you think thats huge, the Eclipse dwarfed it at about 10.2 miles long.

Really, you should do your ship knowledge homework before you make a statement like that. I have pictures of the ship, and I remember there being a poster or diagram of all the Imperial capital ships, and they were to scale. And the Eclipse made the super classes look small, like they would be escorts or guard ships, and the standard destroys really small, like standard frontline ships, when in fact by galactic standards the Imperial II models were considered to be top of the line ships, the best to be had. The mere magnitude of the Eclipse was to unfathomable, totally disregarding any boasting even the New Republic might have made about their own new Calamari ships.

As a matter of fact, I'll get the "Essential Guide To Vehicles And Vessals" out of the garage sometime, so I can give you word for word the Eclipse's bio and stats. The material therein is offical and approved.

 

[alchemy1]

I'm just messing with ya man. Trust me, i'm quite familiar with the eclipse and yes, it's quite a ship. Since i'm new here you guys don't know my personality yet. Basically, assume that I'm kidding about half the time and totally out of my mind the other half (or maybe it's the other way around). Anywho, sure the eclipse could give the Executor a bad look and it would blow up (or crash into the nearest Death Star), but what can I say...I'm nostalgic for the old days when ships were real ships and men were real men and cyborgs were real cyborgs and droids were real droids and small slug-like spotted slime creatures were real small slug-like spotted slime creatures and...well you get the picture. It's out of pure nostagia that I like the executor over the Eclipse.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I was really taken back when I read about this ship. I was like "no way, this isn't physically possible! Its too damn huge!"

But then I got to thinking Palpatine is a smart man. He always has a back-up plan. And I suspect he began contruction of the Eclipse long before the second Death Star was even thought up.

By the battle of Hoth it was known that about 4 super star destroyers existed, but there could have been more. As for the Eclipse, it would have taken possibly several decades to build it. So chronologically, I think the emperor started construction on it right after the first super class destroyer was out the door. If Death Star II were to be destroyed, then Palpatine would have the next best thing- the Eclipse.

The standard super star destroy models, despite their awesome size and firepower were easy targets because like the imperial destroyers their deflector shield generators were exposed and located right on top of the bridge. Admiral Ackbar didn't have that much of a difficult time taking out the Executor, and if that A-Wing hadn't crashed into the bridge, all of those rebel cruisers against this one target which no longer has it's shields would have meant the Executor would have been destroyed either way.

This wouldn't have been possible with the Eclipse, since it's shield generators are located everywhere on the ship, in clusters, and the design teams were smart enough to put more laser and turbo laser batteries near these locations. Even if the shields could have been taken out, I doubt the rebel's weopons, even the better New Republic ones would have been strong enough to puncture the armoured hull of such a huge ship. It was a flying fortress.

In fact, the only way it ended up being destroyed was by the Force. No enemy ship would have been able to destroy it, not even an entire assault fleet. Not unless the New Republic voted for the Star Wars equilvent of Weopons of Mass Destruction.

 

[alchemy1]

Well, the force or the Sun Crusher...providing that the Eclipse is in the system preferable right next to the star being exploded and it's navicomputer is experiancing errors. ...I'd go with the force myself.
"Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignifigant next to the power of the force" - The Darth Man

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I'm just messing with ya man. Trust me, i'm quite familiar with the eclipse and yes, it's quite a ship. Since i'm new here you guys don't know my personality yet. Basically, assume that I'm kidding about half the time and totally out of my mind the other half (or maybe it's the other way around). Anywho, sure the eclipse could give the Executor a bad look and it would blow up (or crash into the nearest Death Star), but what can I say...I'm nostalgic for the old days when ships were real ships and men were real men and cyborgs were real cyborgs and droids were real droids and small slug-like spotted slime creatures were real small slug-like spotted slime creatures and...well you get the picture. It's out of pure nostagia that I like the executor over the Eclipse.

Oh, I know what you mean, I really do. For example, I still like the vintage dreadnaught class battleships we used in the world wars. I'm a big fan of the dreadnaughts. True marvels of machinery, the best we had to offer at the time.


I still like the standard super class models. I like the designs for them. The super classes were still awesome ships, also capable of engaging Alliance fleets with only several support ships needed. I think the only reason the Executor didn't make it through the batte of Endor was because the Imperial officers didn't expect the Alliance fleet to make such a desperate move and engage their fleet at point blank range like that. Like with Palpatine, they failed because of their arrogance.

Really, this has always been the part of Star Wars that interested me the most after the whole Jedi/Sith thing, was the actual capital ships. I like the tactiful warfare aspect of the fleets and ships too, and wished the battle Endor would have been more about the fleet battle than the Ewoks and such.

And its a shame that in all the Star Wars games that have come out, they don't include ships like the Eclipse. That would be so cool.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Well, the force or the Sun Crusher...providing that the Eclipse is in the system preferable right next to the star being exploded and it's navicomputer is experiancing errors. ...I'd go with the force myself.
"Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignifigant next to the power of the force" - The Darth Man

Yeah, even so though, if an eclipse class destroyer could move away from the shockwave of the star after it exploded, theres a fair chance the ship would still be in one piece but would be heavily damaged.

With my idea, even if the New Republic could have come up with some sort of nuclear missle I doubt that even if fired in volleys it could destroy the ship.

Think of Independance Day, when the fighters fired their missles at the alien battleship when the shields were down. The damage was only superficial and equivelent to the size of the blast. How do you create enough torpedos that are powerful enough to destroy a 10 mile long ship? You might handicap it over time, but I doubt there would any ships left to do that. Unless you massed produced these weopons and outfitted every ship with them I don't see how it would be effective at all. You might disable or destroy parts of the ship, but the hull and superstructure would keep the ship in one piece. And if the weopon systems on the ship are still active, even if the power is dimimished, an eclipse destroyer would probably still win and would be the last ship standing, so to speak. Though it would have suffered heavy damage in the process. But then again, all that can be repaired. The bill must be out of this world, pun intended.

And if you managed to destroy an entire fleet, then that sets them back farther than it does you, especially when you're just talking about maintainance and repairs as opposed to having to create new ships entirely. Where would you get the money to do that if you are the New Republic? The ships could be replaced over time, but what a loss.

Although repairs for an eclipse destroyer are probably so ridiculous that with that money you could build several smaller ships, or maybe even a small defense fleet.

Fortunately for the New Republic, Palpatine no longer had that much weath as he did when he held control of the galaxy. The Eclipse was indeed a large investment, and without the ship there wouldn't have been enough funds left for the remaining imperial factions to create and muster up enough ships to stand up to the New Republic. While the ship was huge and undefiable, it was also necessary for Palpatine, as he didn't have anything else left at that point save for a guard fleet. Although even what he had left was good enough to take over any planet or even a sector and hold it. He just didn't have the manpower and widespread deployment like he did with his empire. He can't be everywhere at once.

If I would have been him I would have made one last attempt at taking Coruscant back. He could have done it, and possibly turned the tide again. That planet represents more than just the capital of his former Empire and the New Republic's democracy, it represents the heart of the whole network that keeps the government running. The senate is there, the Jedi Temple is there, everything is on Coruscant. All roads, in this case, lead to Coruscant. If he would have taken back that planet, he'd of been direct control again.

That should have been his top priority, not hunting down the Skywalker family. He could have done that later, after he restablished his grip on the galaxy.

 

[nessonite1]

I have the VHS trilogy before the special edition as well, and I appriciate both versions.

Same here, vlad. I just wish Lucan would release the originals on DVD so I didn't have to settle for aging, full screen, video tapes.

Beyond that I can't copntribute. The Star Wars dorks ( I mean FANS) have taken over! Just a question though...are they done making movies after Episode 3 or are they making episodes 7, 8 and 9? I thought I heard something to that effect.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I'm actually not that big a "dork" myself, though I do pride myself on knowing more about the ships than anything, and specific characters and their history and story. There are people, whom I'm sure, know a hell of a lot more than I do. Like Dave on the TMF for example.

As for Episodes 7, 8, and 9, they were mentioned in that recent interview with Mark Hamill. I downloaded the interview. Its all audio.

Want me to upload it here?

 

[alchemy1]

Hey, that would be cool. Sure I admitt it. I'm a bit of a Star Wars dork, but I differ from the "fans" that line up in front of the chinese theater. How? So glad you asked.
1. I don't wait in lines years, months, weeks, days, or even hours before a movie opens.
2. I try to be resonable about it.
3. I have never been made fun of by Triumph.
You can be a fan of Star Wars and still be a real person.

 

[nessonite1]

I don't go to the movies if I feel there will be a line more than 15 minutes. 😛
In fact I plan to see movies weeks after they are released, in the middle of the week, during school hours.
Nothing I hate more than a crowded movie theater.

This combined with my chronic procrastination means I havent seem a movie in the theater in years. I think the last film I saw on the big screen, come to think of it, was Episode One.

Vlad if you could post that interview that'd be awesome if its not too much trouble. My hubby and I both would be very interested to hear it!

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

I'm confident enough in myself as a person with a life that I wouldn't let what other people think of me for liking Star Wars to the degree that I do bother me. Its sort of how I'm very secure with my masculinity, so much so that I don't worry if people think I'm sort of feminine or whatever for having long hair, having a few girlish mannerisms, and talking to women more than men.

In fact, it brings me closer to the ladies for it, whereas it would probably make them feel insecure and jealous and thats why they might react that way, which I'm assuming is presumptional. I've never had a problem with a guy telling me anything like that about anything. I have no problem hanging out with guys either. In my experience I've learned that women respond well to a man that will listen to them and share their interests. I don't have to act like a troglodyte to be a man. And since I'm not interesting in getting into their pants or skirts, I know I have their respect whereas my male peers may not.

A real man isn't concerned with the pettiness of others and what they think about them.

Heres the clip you two, enjoy. ^__^

Mark is funny and has a good sense of humor. ^^

I opted to put it in a zip file since it was giving me a problem when I tried to rename it to a valid file extension TT can use.

It should only take a few minutes to download if it downloads properly. The interview is 5 minutes and 3 seconds long.

 

[alf1]

I can't understand why they release the first three Star Wars movies ( 78 or so ), and years later three others saying it's not still over
( it's the end/beginning/middle ???? of the serie ) .
There are still three to come i think . So it's a nonalogy...........i wonder if all movies were made in 78 and director decided to show them evry 10 years or so.
Anyway i saw 2 episodes of it and find it really crap. Not to be talked for years mean.
It's my point of view though.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Provided you understood what you listened to, which it seems you might not have, let me clarify-

Lucas, when he first made New Hope already had the entirety of the series written but none of it was tangible like the original trilogy was at the time, since it was being shown first.

Chronologically, everything is in order but was presented to us with the present first, the past second, and the future third. The future is 7, 8, and 9, if George ever makes them, which it seems officially he won't according to recent interviews. Or, its that he will make them, but the Skywalker story arc is finished and done.

Remember, when Mark told us that George asked him if he wanted to be in Episode 9 that was way back when they were filming New Hope. Now, here we are in 2004 and Hamill has had his fill of the series, and apparently Lucas may not continue it.

When Mark said "theres a beginning, a middle, and an end, and then its over, even though its never over", I think it was made as joke refering to the fact that Lucas has changed his mind in the past about things when he seemed pretty set about not doing them, and also its because of the Expanded Universe, something alchemy and myself were talking about earlier with Palpatine and the ships, etc.

If Lucas does do 7, 8, and 9 I think working off of Dark Empire would be the way to go. The series of events in that story arc would fit well as the finale and with some tinkering could round up the end of the series in a satisfactory way, Luke becoming a Jedi Master and training new jedi, Leia realizing her potential and herself becoming closer to her roots as a Skywalker and starting her jedi training, Palpatine coming back to settle to settle the score, etc.

Theres also rumors of a Star Wars tv series, so keep your eyes open for updates and rumors about that.