Umpire suspened for asking kids to speak English

[stdave1]

This may be a bit late but a couple of weeks ago or so an umpire in the States was officating a little league game when some kids on one team stated spaaking spanish. The umpire told them to stop and to speak english only during the game. The League suspended the umpire for the balance of the season. Any thoughts on this?

 

[morgandee]

rofl check their green cards rofl rofl

 

[Goodieluver]

Maybe umps should be suspended for how they call strikes because if a minority gets struck out, IT MUST BE RACISM!

 

[amywood]

If you lived in another country, they would want you to speak their language, right? It should go both ways.

 

[MistressValerie1]

Excerpted from http://sports-law.blogspot.com/2005/07/little-league-umpire-prohibits-spanish.html (emph. added):

Saturday, July 30, 2005

Little League Umpire Prohibits Spanish during Game

Believing that an assistant little league coach for Methuen (Massachusetts) was communicating "illegal" instructions to his players in Spanish, an umpire in the state's little league tournament for 13-14 year olds decreed that Spanish would not be spoken thereafter in the game, otherwise the offending team would forfeit (Silva & Mishra, "Team Forced to Listen to Umpire's Call," Boston Globe, July 30, 2005). This decree occurred when Methuen was leading 3-1 over Seekonk, and assistant coach Domingo Infante gave the following instruction to his team's pitcher: 'Tira lo bien!," which signaled to the pitcher to throw a good pick-off throw. Immediately after the pitcher failed in his pick-off attempt, the umpire called time-out and said, in effect, nadie puede hablar español en este juego, although I imagine his words were more like, "nobody can speak Spanish in this game."

This decree did not bode well for Methuen, since its pitcher spoke very little English. Perhaps not surprisingly, Seekonk went on to defeat Methuen .... But to make matters worse for Methuen, relevant little league rules only allow for formal protests to be filed during a game -- a rule which Methuen found out after the game, when it tried to file a formal protest.
....

(W)hat would have happened had the assistant coach been communicating through signs? Would the umpire have banned signs too? Along those lines, what is the difference between signs and a language that the other team may not understand? I don't see any difference. But I guess the umpire did, and he managed to offend a lot of people in the process.

 

[MistressValerie1]

Additional information from Reuters:

The coach, who was bilingual, gave instructions in Spanish to the team's 14-year-old pitcher and catcher, who are immigrants from the Dominican Republic and speak little English.

The coach claimed that the umpire's ruling banning the use of Spanish on the field demoralized his team.

Liitle League International spokesman Lance Van Auken said, "The umpire made an incorrect decision, for which there was no basis in the Rules and Regulations of Little League." The umpire was then suspended for the remainder of the season.

I think that the suspension may have been a bit harsh, especially if the umpire acted in good faith. I believe that he should have been reprimanded, at most, though I agree that his ruling was highly unusual for a baseball game.

 

[Kalamos]

There is an interesting degree of paranoia involved with foreign languages.
It is not always about racism - well, maybe nationality in this case. It is about expecting the worst when people resort to a different language.

Speakers of widely-spread langs rarely have to learn new forms of communication. They are, in a way, spoiled by their own widely-spoken language.
When dominant language meets national pride, trouble begins: people are expected to speak in the main lang; failing to do so is often met with disapproval.

It keeps happening, especially with the most widely spoken lang of western world.
"Speak english ya beaner!" - That's something I've read, online, more than I'd care to relate...

[Of course my usual answer is: "Learn English, you illiterate simian!"... But I'm rambling. Again...]

😀 😀 😀

 

[nessonite1]

Am I the only one who remembers it being against the rules to speak anything other than English on AOL?

Im old....

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Kalamos hit it on the button. Theres often times this unspoken barrier that people are either expected to clear or leave alone and it almost always sends mixed signals. You don't know whether to attempt to accomidate someone or deny them alltogether. Obviously this case is about that, and I don't think it was handled properly.

 

[Cbarton]

both sides overdid it...the ump should have been able to recognize the coach was trying to coach his players....the leauge way should have reprimanded but not a suspension...sheesh....what politically correct demon will pop up next? a discrimentaion lawsuit from it...

is enough to drive good coachs and umps away...but not me...

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Take me out to the ball game, take me out to the mob!

Buy me some lawsuits and misdemeanors!

I don't care if I'm o - ver - zel - ous!

So we root, root root for our kids that we're living through selfishly!

If they don't win then its WAR!

So its one, "hey you!", two, "your kid f*cking sucks! Get him off the plate!" three fists your down and out, at the old ball game!

Or wait a minute, this is about no speakums no englesh...nevermind.

 

[chickles_:)]

Hiya :wooha:

I can not believe in this day and age such paranoia could still exist. :shocked: Language is a means to facilitate communication between people. Any one of us should treat those who have ability to communicate in more than one language with greater respect not less so.

I think the ump was entirely in the wrong here. :sharp_tee
Sorry everybody, but honestly why should it matter what language someone is speaking? And what illegal info could be communicated anyway?? And suppose the coach did tell the pitcher to do something outside the rules - does one not know that such things happen regularly in the dugout -in english- anyway?
And just suppose that the pitcher did something against the rules as a result of an alleged directive. don't we trust that the ump, possessed with -presumably- "two good eyes" would, like, NOTICE??

Anyway, I also agree that leaping to a suspension without passing other stages of "correction" was definitely OTT.

What does this uni-lingual idealism say about that right, so often touted by Americans: the freedom of expression? -thankfully the authorities agreed that the ump was wrong to act in such a high-handed way.

Anyway, that's my rant for the day.
I'm sorry for getting so bold but - this kind of thing really boils my blood.

Many blessings,

 

[Goodieluver]

Where will it end if u allow to continue,make up new words and talk derogatory to signal to a fielder something?

Perhaps saying "Get your dick out of your ass" may mean "go on first contact"

An umpires' word means all in a game, my earliest memory is of little league when my father(coach) was ejected from a game, ump said "thats it, not another word from u" my father yelled "Aw jeez!" and was rung up and thrown out. If an ump said no spanish then no spanish, not the umps fault the kid knew little english, if he lives in this country, why DOESNT he know more of it

Im sure if i began livin in europe, id HAVE to learn some dialect of where i was living

 

[Kalamos]

If an ump said no spanish then no spanish, not the umps fault the kid knew little english, if he lives in this country, why DOESNT he know more of it
Im sure if i began livin in europe, id HAVE to learn some dialect of where i was living

That's an intersting point.
A point I'd disagree with, though.

Over Europe we have a fair range of different languages.
It's not about learning a new dialect. It's about learning a foreign tongue.
You could travel 100 miles and meet three or four different langs.
Over USA, you travel 100 miles and you still meet english-speaking people.

That's what I was referring to when I said "dominant" speakers were spoiled.
You *expect* everybody to speak the main language.
After all, if they live in a country, why don't they know more of it?

I am not saying that Europe is any more welcoming than other nations.
But with so many languages, we are more used to yield a bit.

The funny fact is, most people in Europe resort to English when dealing with foreigners - while England doesn't [usually] feel part of Europe...

...

Oh well, my point stands: if somebody *forced* me to speak a language, I'd resort to my own first tongue out of spite. 😉

 

[Timewarp]

I think if you speak a different language and decide to play baseball, at the very least you should learn a couple of phrases. Like "ball" or "hit the ball".

 

[Kalamos]

I think if you speak a different language and decide to play baseball, at the very least you should learn a couple of phrases. Like "ball" or "hit the ball".

Er... make it "if you speak a different language and decide to play baseball in USA"... 😉

 

[chickles_:)]

Hiya! :happy:

I have to agree about the ump having the "say" in a game. But that's not the issue. The issue is, i believe, he made an attrociously bad call. And when that happens, then the matter comes up for review.

I completely agree: it's not the ump's fault that a child playing a game doesn't have a masterful command of english.
But it is the ump's fault if he or she holds a child's native language or lack of facility of english against him.

I was just thinking too. Is it not true that other nations in north america seem to have learned a tolerance for different official languages? Surely therefore, it ought not to be so strange a concept for people in the U.S.

Also, Kalamos is entirely correct regarding other lands. In Europe especially, or for that matter most places in the world it is expected that people have familiarity and capacity of more than one language.

Odds are if one were playing a sport in some other land and using different languages on the field it would be considered only natural.

I hope this helps. It seems sad to me that the desire to communicate could cause so much fuss.

Many blessings,

 

[BigNorm]

it's simple and blunt. if your going to LIVE in a foreign country, legally or illegally, learn it's language. it'll make things easier on both parties, and it's just common ceurtesy, and if your in a country illegally, you REALLY should speak it's language, so ou seem more like a native, and not someone who just crossed the border.

but around the house and among friends, speak your language all you want.

if i'm going to live in Belgium, i sure as heck gonna learn at least some Belgiumese.

 

[-Kunoke-]

it's simple and blunt. if your going to LIVE in a foreign country, legally or illegally, learn it's language. it'll make things easier on both parties, and it's just common ceurtesy, and if your in a country illegally, you REALLY should speak it's language, so ou seem more like a native, and not someone who just crossed the border.

but around the house and among friends, speak your language all you want.

if i'm going to live in Belgium, i sure as heck gonna learn at least some Belgiumese.

Right. And people, it's not so much about fearing the worst. It's about not being able to know what they ARE saying. Just my opinion.

 

[coloman]

If you are going to live in the United States then you should be able to speak English. It's fine for someone to retain their own language as well but the ump had every right to stop the game and ask that English only be spoken. In my opinion the league went way too far in suspending the ump for the rest of the season. The kids on that little league team should have been able to speak English as well as Spanish. If I moved to a foriegn country I would make the effort to learn the language first, maybe not like a native but good enough to understand most of what I heard and fluent enough to make myself plainly understood.

 

[Kalamos]

I guess I am one of the few foreigners taking part to this thread.
I don't know about courtesy, law or whatnot.

I can say many soccer players, over my own country, and I am talking about first division, are barely litterate in our language.
Yet, nobody has issues with that: they are paid handsomely, as long as they can score and save the day. Sometimes, even when they can't anymore.

Ferrari's premier driver, Michael Schumacher, can't speak Italian for his own good. Yet nobody really complains when he races fast enough and wins.

So, what are we really talking about? A measly kids' division?
Or some ingrained habit about languages?

I keep posting my opinion: I think some American users take their own language for granted.
I guess nobody really cares about it, so I might as well stop saying that.

I am fluent in a couple of language. Had I lived, say, in Belgium or Switzerland, maybe I could have handled as many as four or five.
I can ask directions or order food in a couple more langs.
So I am not lost, even when facing a foreign tongue.

Maybe you never had to try hard and learn a different language.
I've been doing that since I was 10.

Maybe somebody told you that you have to love your country, your flag, your language, your religion and amen to that.
Anything but is evil.

I don't know much about that team of kids.
I don't know why they couldn't speak english.
I don't really care.

This thread is slipping somewhere else. I don't really know if I can and will keep up with it.

 

[Goodieluver]

Kalamos, you are referin to pro sport athletes who tour across nations to play teams and such, this is a different scenario

This person LIVES in america. Little league, although in some area's teams do travel, is mainly a inter state thing. Last i checked, the language for every state is english

 

[Kalamos]

-> goodieluver.

I usually try and think "what if I were in their shoes".
But this time I cannot pretend I understand.

You see... maybe Normie was joking about it, but Belgium has actually got three main langs: French, Dutch and German.
That's why I don't really get the big deal about making Spanish the second main language, over USA.

Either immigrants learn English, or the country learns Spanish.
After all you want citizens to understand the laws, don't you?
If a minority becomes a majority, then things have to change. People have to adjust.
That way nobody can cheat.

It don't know about history or tradition, but it seems more practical than forcing them to study something they couldn't or wouldn't learn.

 

[AphroditeRabbit]

Does it state somewhere that he really does live in the U.S. or is he a migrant workers child coming to participate in activites? (All I can see is it says immigrants. It doesn't say how recently they immigrated or anything else. It could have been just a month ago!) I work with those children every summer in the migrant program (it's a school specifically designed for those children who will be there for only the summer and are traveling with their parents who follow the crop picking seasons). When they come here they try very hard to learn things including English. Sometimes it's very hard for them as most of the parents don't speak an ounce of it and the only practice the child gets is in that school for one summer.

Who is to say he isn't trying to learn the language? You can still learn a language and respond faster with your own. Sports are supposed to make you think on your feet and make decisions quickly and move on. Perhaps it was just for the best to say what was said in spanish so the game could move on. It seems very silly to make such a big deal out of such a very small thing. Pick and choose your battles and all that jazz.

Not to offend you, but you seem to be a very harsh judge of the situation Goodie, I'm wondering where the hostility is coming from.

 

[Goodieluver]

-> goodieluver.

I usually try and think "what if I were in their shoes".
But this time I cannot pretend I understand.

You see... maybe Normie was joking about it, but Belgium has actually got three main langs: French, Dutch and German.
That's why I don't really get the big deal about making Spanish the second main language, over USA.

Either immigrants learn English, or the country learns Spanish.
After all you want citizens to understand the laws, don't you?
If a minority becomes a majority, then things have to change. People have to adjust.
That way nobody can cheat.

It don't know about history or tradition, but it seems more practical than forcing them to study something they couldn't or wouldn't learn.

The issue with spanish becoming the second language is, does this mean the natural citizens of the country need to learn spanish then?

Plus doesnt france have like 3-4 languages or is that belgium as you refered to(or isnt belgium considered in a way part of france, my french\european history is a bit forgotten on the subject