Vatican spreads rumors: „Condoms have holes!“

[Haltickling]

Today I heard a shocking piece of info in one of the main German TV News: The Vatican spreads rumors that condoms have “small holes”, especially in countries with a high AIDS rate. This fits well into the current catholic dogma that no form of contraception is acceptable.

The Cardinal for “Family Affairs” in Rome, Alfonso Lopez Trujillo: “As condoms are by no means impermeable for sperms, how can they be safe against AIDS-Viruses which are about 450 times smaller than an sperm?” The Archbishop of Nairobi, Raphael Ndingi Nzeki even airs the opinion that “condoms help spreading the AIDS Virus, as they tempt the people to live a promiscuous life.”

The WHO is highly irritated about those rumors: “These false statements about condoms and HIV are dangerous. This is a worldwide epidemic which has caused more than 20 million casualties. Currently at least 42 million people are infected with the virus.”

According to WHO, condoms can reduce the risk of HIV infection by about 90%. A condom can rip or burst, but they definitely haven’t got holes. They are afraid that thousands of people could be endangered by these false rumors from clerics, because they might have sex without condoms in the future.

BBC One will broadcast the report “Sex and the Holy City” on Sunday (Oct 12) which reveals these clerical lies.

(Source: http://www.tagesschau.de/aktuell/meldungen/0,1185,OID2396306_TYP6_THE_NAVSPM11174_REF3_BAB,00.html )

Personally, I find this behavior of the Catholic Church revolting. To endanger their believers just to further a political doctrine about contraception is - in my eyes - comparable to cold-blooded mass murder!

 

[WraithTickler]

Condoms do a better job protecting against impregnation more so than AIDS. Why? The phage for HIV is a few microns smaller than a sperm cell and signifigantly more likely to permiate the condom. Even if there are no holes in the conventional sense, this happens on a molecular level.

The church's statment makes it clear that while condoms are not a surefire way to prevent the spread of AIDS and other diseases, not to mention pregnancy. Abstinance- which is the main thrust of their anti condom argument, is 100% guaranteed to work and also what they are trying to promote as opposed to failible contraceptive devices which are ment to be just that- contraceptives to prevent pregancy- not the spread of viruses.

The only politics I would associate with murder in this case is not the Catholic church, but several of the governments in AIDS infected countries which have tried to hush information on the spread of AIDS to avoid panics. That comes close to, if not being murder in the mass and cold blooded sense.

 

[Moses25]

Religion vs. Reality = Oil vs. Water

What a bunch of hooey.

If any of the prophets were alive today, they would run for their lives, curl up into a fetal position and seclude themselves in caves...

Sort of like Osama!! 😛 (not that he's prophet, yo...stop reading so much into my lame-ass jokes)

Seriously, though, when do we get to live in a world that is not controlled by ancient texts?

Move on. Let freedom reign.

Cheers.😀

 

[WraithTickler]

Seriously, though, when do we get to live in a world that is not controlled by ancient texts?

Do you wish me to answer that- being both a History and Political Science major? Okay, but be preapred for a looong winded asnwer my friend.

History and the choices of our forebearers are very much a part of our lives, the written texts reflecting those decisions and providing a stable framework upon which our culture is based.

Speaking as an American, I can say that I would not abolish the ancient text of the Constitution or that principles of the self evident truths laid down in the Declaration of Independence. Would abandoning the Bible be any better? Because something is ancient, does it make it any less true, or does it not settle in as a fundamental building block or cornerstone for future construction?

We are not controlled per say by the texts, but by common agreement to conceed to the framework and principles laid down by above texts as well as interpetations there of- both secular and non. We by choice make concessions of certain freedoms for the greater good- the basis of laws that protect us.

In this case, the Catholic Church is against contraceptives, not only from the Bible, but based on tradition, interpetations of natural law, and on magisterium. It is using those in a real, rational sense, warning that contraceptives are not fool proof. There is a religious backing, with their beliefs on birth control, but the point they are made is still wholly relivant, and not solely dependent on the good book for answers.

 

[Haltickling]

Condoms do a better job protecting against impregnation more so than AIDS. Why? The phage for HIV is a few microns smaller than a sperm cell and signifigantly more likely to permiate the condom. Even if there are no holes in the conventional sense, this happens on a molecular level.

Excuse me, WraithTickler, I don't buy that statement. Why would doctors use rubber gloves for all medical treatments if not to prevent germs getting through?

As far as I know (and what I've learnt at school), rubber is an amorph material which prevents osmosis (the molecular level you mentioned). It's not a semipermeable membrane. Even the smallest virus consists of several thousand molecules, and I find it highly implausible that the physical/chemical structure of rubber allows penetration by such a comparatively big object. All this refers to an intact condome, of course.

But maybe you could back your statement by a source I can access through the internet? I'm always eager to learn something new...

 

[WraithTickler]

Admittedly, problems with permeation are small (2% of cases with the water leak test), but there are two important factors to consider- 1) What happens to those 2 percent affected by a life or death virus? and 2) The statistics are driven from people who use condoms correctly.

The second point draws up the fact that without correct usage and education there of, condoms can be wholly ineffective and are more likely to draw holes and secure. If education is missing, as it is likely to be in many third world countries, people are better off abstaining.

There is an assumption that while no visible holes means no leak, but sometimes small ones do exist. AIDS is on a larger end of the virus scale and it itself is not as likely to go through, but smaller microphages are still very capible of going through. For a bit more info on this, consult here:

http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/ost/ostannrpfy98.pdf

 

[amk714]

It's true that abstinence is the only sure way of not getting AIDS, but if you're going to have sex, aren't condoms better than nothing? And if education is the problem, that should be encouraged, not suppressed.

 

[ticklebutton]

GENEVA (AFP) - The World Health Organization rejects claims from Roman Catholic leaders that condoms were ineffective in halting the spread of AIDS.

"From a scientific perspective, anyone who claims that a male condom does not protect against AIDS is wrong," WHO spokeswoman Fadela Chaib said Friday.


It's ironic. The Vatican, which has so contributed to overpopulating the world, now is encouraging its masses to sicken and die.

Button

 

[Haltickling]

WraithTickler, thanks for the link. It proves that you need for virus transfer either a defective condom or somebody who deliberately punches holes through it. True is that much smaller holes are sufficient for virus transmission than for semen leaks. But please read the passage shortly before the article about the "holy" (pun intended) material on page 50:

"... This is interpreted that there are few, if any, pores or holes through unstretched latex films large enough to allow virus passage in a reasonable time.

This is consistent with previous findings that latex comdoms are effective barriers over longer test periods at much higher pressures and that latex gloves are also effective barriers. ..."

They didn't find any holes in a complete experiment series with the condom material stretched to 9 times the original size. Quod erat demonstrandum... 🙄