What Leo has learned from therapy.

[Leo tickles]

Since I'm over there bagging on Mitchell for his personal shit, I thought I'd leave myself open for somebody to set me straight, too.

So I went to see a shrink. She told me saying "fuck" was an angry response, no matter the context. According to her, "fuck" means anger. Really? I want to fuck her. I want to anger her. What?

Then she explained to me that all of my hatred for my mother comes from pent up hurt. And since my mom is a weak willed person who will never stand up to me, I take it out on her. That makes sense. Thank God for weak willed people, I guess. Still working on this one. 🙂

She then explained that my girl friend is not a dumb bitch, she is different from me, and she is there supporting me. When I brought out certain facts, she told me I should dump her. Pick a side, shrinky.

It's been brought to my attention that I put on a show for people, which I'm 50/50 on. I used to, then I decided nobody was watching, so I quit. So, either I've done it for so long it has become me, or I'm unknowingly doing it. When I asked what the point of this "show" was, she said to make me seem dominant and/or better than. When I said that if that was my goal I wouldn't be PAYING her to HELP me, she didn't know what to say.

Then she said I need to join the rest of the world. And I said no, why don't you all come join me instead.

 

[GQguy]

Funny exchange. But isn't this a show? To prove that you're smarter/quicker/wittier than the therapist or her methods?

GQ

 

[Leo tickles]

Funny exchange. But isn't this a show? To prove that you're smarter/quicker/wittier than the therapist or her methods?

GQ

You'd think so, but no, this is my genuine thoughts on the whole thing.

If I can say something to either make her shut up or prove her wrong, how is she right?

 

[GQguy]

Psychology is a "soft" science, no real right or wrong answers. The better question IMHO is "why is it wrong?" " how is it unhealthy?"

 

[Leo tickles]

Psychology is a "soft" science, no real right or wrong answers. The better question IMHO is "why is it wrong?" " how is it unhealthy?"

What she's saying isn't unhealthy in some regards. But if saying fuck isn't unhealthy either, why bother changing something that doesn't interfere with life either way?

 

[chicago]

She's got something right with that 'putting on a show' shit, but if you don't think she knows what she's talking about, why don't you find a new one?

 

[Leo tickles]

Working on it Annie, working on it.

 

[unclebill]

Did she mention anything about you possibly getting a haircut??

 

[Leo tickles]

Did she mention anything about you possibly getting a haircut??

Nah. I keep it around so I can get stereotyped by (some) old people. 😛

 

[Bohemianne]

Did she mention anything about you possibly getting a haircut??

May I auto-suggest now that bangs will not solve anything at all.

 

[Mitchell]

Leo, as we've bantered a lot in my out of control thread over the past week, I wanted to comment on this thread about your life.

Believe me, this is coming from someone who you know has a lot of problems.. but.. as i was in therapy for many years in my earlier life, I'll tell you what my shrink told me

First, he said. "You have to listen to me. I can sit here and keep taking your money, but, if you dont listen, you will never get better".

Second, as messed up as things are in my life, he taught me to stand up to my father. I used to be terrified of my father. One night when I was 18, I just lost it at him for the first time, and started throwing things. Since then, I've been either explosive, or very clinicial at him, when I am in communication with him.

My father never listened to any therapist he ever had, which is partially why my parents marriage failed, and my relationship with him failed.

You mentioned your mom being weak willed, and hating her. I can understand those emotions. I love my mom dearly, as you know, but, many times, she behaved weak willed as well

As for dumping your gf, that really has to be up to you. The shrink can tell you the facts, but you have to do what is in your heart. I knew things about my father, the "facts", yet saw him anyway. I did what was comfortable for me, to my detriment.

Again, I hope therapy works for you, that you can find the answers you want, and make changes you feel you need to. Good Luck.

Mitch

 

[WorkInProgress]

Okay, Leo...I'm up a little later than I had intended to be, so I'm going to keep this reply very short and may add to it a little later.

Point number one: The therapy relationship isn't about whether she's right about this point or that point; it's about growth, and that's something you have to be working on without waiting for your therapist to wave any magic wand. I'm not saying you're not working on it, just making sure you remember that that's the important component.

Point number two: The most important thing your therapist can do is provide you with an atmosphere of respect and empathy, in order to help you achieve two very important abilities: the ability to require respect and empathy from all people whom you let get close to you, and the ability to give these qualities in return.

Point number three: There's no universal rule about what's in your head and your heart when you use the word "fuck," but it doesn't take a shrink to tell you that you have a lot of anger. You know that already. Nothing's going to change that, either, at least for a while. But see point number two above, because again, that's what it's really about.

Point number four: The fact that you're in therapy at all is commendable. The really messed-up people are the ones who won't go. I'm not saying everybody needs to, just that there are a lot of people who need to, who don't.

I have a lot more to say, but I must get to sleep. To be continued.

 

[Comfort Eagle]

Sup Leo. Still lying about things on the internet for attention, eh?

Keep up the good work.

 

[Leo tickles]

Sup Leo. Still lying about things on the internet for attention, eh?

Keep up the good work.

Sup Beagle. Still trolling threads that you obviously know are bullshit?

Keep up the good work. 🙂

 

[Comfort Eagle]

no u r that thing u said

 

[Leo tickles]

no u r that thing u said

U r on manual ignore. As in you post= I nod, smile, and walk away. I don't need the last word. See, as therapy hasn't fixed me quite yet, I'm still narcissistic. I believe I am better than you. And by ignoring you, I cement you in history as Comfort Beagle. You are comfortable being a lap pet, and your bark is annoying. Goodbye Beagle, I will think of you as I rock myself to sleep tonight (after I finish up making random lies to make myself look cool on the net, because, you know, that's what I do, right?)

 

[Comfort Eagle]

How mad are you right now.

Really mad, I imagine.

 

[Leo tickles]

Okay, Leo...I'm up a little later than I had intended to be, so I'm going to keep this reply very short and may add to it a little later.

Point number one: The therapy relationship isn't about whether she's right about this point or that point; it's about growth, and that's something you have to be working on without waiting for your therapist to wave any magic wand. I'm not saying you're not working on it, just making sure you remember that that's the important component.

Point number two: The most important thing your therapist can do is provide you with an atmosphere of respect and empathy, in order to help you achieve two very important abilities: the ability to require respect and empathy from all people whom you let get close to you, and the ability to give these qualities in return.

Point number three: There's no universal rule about what's in your head and your heart when you use the word "fuck," but it doesn't take a shrink to tell you that you have a lot of anger. You know that already. Nothing's going to change that, either, at least for a while. But see point number two above, because again, that's what it's really about.

Point number four: The fact that you're in therapy at all is commendable. The really messed-up people are the ones who won't go. I'm not saying everybody needs to, just that there are a lot of people who need to, who don't.

I have a lot more to say, but I must get to sleep. To be continued.

I'm working on growth, it's the empathy and kindness thing that I'm not getting the grasp of. I want to do it, it sounds okay in theory but some people are just fucking stupid. Plain and simple. So who am I to tell them that? Well... the person they asked I guess. I'm getting that there are a lot of lines drawn out in the world and it's impossible to find a balance to please everybody.

Overstepping the line and they bitch, under step and you lie. What the fuck is balance? I guess my balance is what I see as the truth and if I'm overtly mean about it oh well? :-/

 

[Bothersome]

The problem with saying that 'people are stupid' is the fact that you're a person too.

 

[Leo tickles]

I'm not excluding myself.

 

[WorkInProgress]

You know what, Leo? Empathy is not about trying to please everybody. It's about building relationships of mutual trust and respect with others who are capable of it. The key is that you need to be one of the ones who are capable of it. Related to this, let me suggest something in your relationship with your therapist. When she gives you an opinion, there doesn't need to be a choice between saying she's absolutely right versus shooting it down. There's an art to saying "I see your point, and I agree with it part of the way, but might you consider that maybe...?" If she's any good, she'll listen and respect your opinion. I hope you don't have a therapist who tells you that you're showing resistance every time you try to express an opinion of your own. It's a matter of give and take, a matter of looking for common ground. And the reason your relationship with your therapist is important is that a good dynamic in therapy can help you know how a good dynamic feels, in both giving and receiving empathy. Again, empathy does not mean trying to please everybody.

 

[Bothersome]

In my honest opinion, a therapist is someone who should take your issues into consideration, and then comment on them, not someone who tells you what to do.

Also, in my honest opinion, I believe that a good friend is like a therapist that doesn't cost a nickel.

 

[WorkInProgress]

I'd rather have a therapist give advice when it's framed as advice. The alternative is sometimes what my analyst did to me a decade ago. He didn't claim to be giving me advice; he claimed to be pointing out the plain truth that he insisted I knew, in other words he was demanding that I sign on the dotted line. The issue, by the way, was that the woman I had just started dating had taken me the night before to a cheesy downtown S&M club in Manhattan, and my analyst was horrified and was demanding I admit that i knew I shouldn't have been there. From his horror, one would think I had told him I'd molested a child, and even then, in his refusal to even listen to me with my point of view, he would have been handling it the wrong way.

 

[Bothersome]

And that's why I'll NEVER see a therapist. I'm not going to pay some already-overpaid shrink to do what I could easily get for free.

Sure, a therapist is going to know which questions are the right questions to ask... but I think I'll take my chances. No amount of trauma is worth that kind of money to work through.

 

[WorkInProgress]

I respect your point, Bothersome, but therapy has helped me. It's only in this past decade that I've had any real social skills and any real self-awareness.

But I want to emphatically reaffirm a point that I made before to Leo. Leo: No amount of therapy is going to take the place of your own efforts at thinking and improving your own behavior, your own efforts at improving your social skills, your ability to form and maintain friendships, and your relationships with close family members. And when it comes to an intimate relationship, nobody but you can decide whether a relationship is right, and therapy at its best will help you to bring your own needs and feelings into clearer focus. Two goals of growth go hand in hand: the ability to give empathy and respect, and the ability to require it from others when they relate to you.