Usama bin Laden: is he actually dead?

[PurpleStyle]

Forgive me for saying something that probably skirts the edge of blasphemy (as if that's new territory for me :lol ) but I'm skeptical of his sudden death. I'm not calling President Obama a liar, at least not directly. There's no pictures or video of anything. I also don't believe the claim that he was verified by DNA so quickly and then promptly buried at sea.

As one of my dearest friends put it:

Why didn't they nail him to a fucking cross and turn him into a display at ground zero? ( :lol I love her.)

 

[player 01]

Pics or it didn't happen, even then who knows.

The only one this benefits is Obama, I'm sure he'll totally play up he accomplished what Bush couldn't, and will try his darndest to make sure everyone believes the failures of Bush to be synonymous with the Republicans as a whole.

Doubt Al Qaeda will be affected, I'm sure they have all kinds of contingencies, money wired and successors lined up if this ever happened.

I also find it funny that western media plays up this as a Pakistani failing for providing intelligence so close to Islamabad, what about the CIA, ASIO, MI6, and a whole host of other intelligence agencies that were part of the war on terror since day 1? Why did it take them 10 years to catch one man? If the people in charge today are the same as the ones since 9/11, i wouldn't congratulate them, I'd have them all fired and take away their pensions and severance packages, that's if i were in a good mood, otherwise i'd have them all charged with treason on suspicion of collaborating with Osama, in which case they have a good reason to fail other than gross incompetence.

 

[Mash]

The only person who benefits from the death of a world-renowned terrorist is Obama? Really? How about the families of the people who died in 9/11? How about the families of the muslims he killed?

More importantly, how about the people he hadn't killed yet?

 

[Inverse]

All the soldiers here where I work feel similarly to Purple. It's an odd situation, the way this was dealt with is shifty. The disposing of the body does no favors to settling it either.

 

[Johnny lea]

Listening to conspiracy theorist Alex Jones doing a guest spot on British radio right now. His version is he was killed a couple of years back and was kept frozen until it was time to bring him out for political purposes. Hmmmmm.

 

[Spawn190]

Funny, I thought he died back in 2001.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,41576,00.html

 

[FeatherDaemon1]

I don't know on this one. I am no fan of President Obama. I think that he has been a total failure, but I am going to give him credit on this one. Not that he actually deserves any credit for personally doing anything. It was the foreign intelligence services that actually found him. But he pulled the trigger when it needed pulling.

I do believe that Pakistan was actively hiding him. Pakistan is a damn police state with a decent secret police of their own. You simply can't be that ignorant of such a figure living in your country. I fully believe that strong elements in the Pakistani military and political factions also knew. If the Russians or Chinese were hiding UBL then I suspect we'd have the same difficulty getting him. I hope that this finally nails the coffin to our dealings with those two-faced bastards.

I personally like the idea of Usama's corpse rotting at the bottom of the ocean. As much as it would be fun smearing him in bacon fat then drawing and quartering him at Ground Zero that may be seen as provocative to Islam. Not that I give a damn about Islam, but we can take the higher road at times.

Unless he is Jason Vorhees or a Bond villain I don't think we'll be seeing Usama bin Laden ever again. Good riddance to an asshole who was pissed off at losing construction contracts to infidels.

 

[U.N.Owen]

God, is there any end to this conspiracy BS?

You do realize that by calling Obama a liar, you're also saying the US military lied at every level?

And what's the point of releasing pictures? You'll all just say they're fake. There's no satisfying conspiracy mongers: every piece of evidence is just written off as part of the conspiracy.

 

[Stage Whisper]

I also think that the handling of Osama's death was a little strange. Considering what the man has done and participated in, you would think that someone would have gotten video or a photo somewhere proving his death before they buried the body at sea. I can understand why anyone would want to dispose of his body in that manner, but to do it so quickly is a little confusing.

That said, I do hope that it's true!

 

[jts963]

God, is there any end to this conspiracy BS?

You do realize that by calling Obama a liar, you're also saying the US military lied at every level?

And what's the point of releasing pictures? You'll all just say they're fake. There's no satisfying conspiracy mongers: every piece of evidence is just written off as part of the conspiracy.

There's no limit to the nonsense some ideologues will reach for when the evidence contradicts their world view (e.g., Obama "couldn't possibly" have gotten OBL when Bush couldn't do it).

http://www.tickletheater.com/showpost.php?p=624451&postcount=1136

 

[U.N.Owen]

There IS video and there ARE photos. They simply are reluctant to release them because of the reaction when they released photos of dead terrorists in the past.

Probably, some footage will be released in the coming days. But what difference will that make? The conspiracy nuts will just shriek, why did it take so long? They were faking it! And so on.

If the entire operation had been broadcast live in HD people would say it was all staged. I mean, the space program and moon landing is about the most photographed and filmed endeavor in human history, and people say it's all fake.

As Jonathan Swift said, "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into."

 

[jts963]

Funny, I thought he died back in 2001.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,41576,00.html

"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01

"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority. I am truly not that concerned about him."
- G.W. Bush, repsonding to a question about bin Laden's whereabouts, 3/13/02
(The New American, 4/8/02)

 

[PurpleStyle]

There IS video and there ARE photos. They simply are reluctant to release them because of the reaction when they released photos of dead terrorists in the past.

Probably, some footage will be released in the coming days. But what difference will that make? The conspiracy nuts will just shriek, why did it take so long? They were faking it! And so on.

If the entire operation had been broadcast live in HD people would say it was all staged. I mean, the space program and moon landing is about the most photographed and filmed endeavor in human history, and people say it's all fake.

As Jonathan Swift said, "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into."

Could we call people conspiracy theorists less and try to be more productive instead? I actually do believe that he is dead. All I said is that I wanted to see stuff. Nasty pictures can't possibly be more shocking than some of the stuff I've seen on rotten.com, or even Faces of Death. Sorry for the OCD skepticism, but that's just my nature. I want to see.

 

[jts963]

There IS video and there ARE photos. They simply are reluctant to release them because of the reaction when they released photos of dead terrorists in the past.

Probably, some footage will be released in the coming days. But what difference will that make? The conspiracy nuts will just shriek, why did it take so long? They were faking it! And so on.

If the entire operation had been broadcast live in HD people would say it was all staged. I mean, the space program and moon landing is about the most photographed and filmed endeavor in human history, and people say it's all fake.

As Jonathan Swift said, "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into."

More importantly, somebody else said "You can't make a man disbelieve something he gets paid to believe." The anti-Obama bandwagon is a profit center for some. They get money from books, speeches, T-shirts, etc. to push the myth that Obama can't do anything good and so for them perpetuating birtherism and Obama-is-a-secret-Muslim and other nonsense is a paycheck for them.

 

[jts963]

Could we call people conspiracy theorists less and try to be more productive instead? I actually do believe that he is dead. All I said is that I wanted to see stuff. Nasty pictures can't possibly be more shocking than some of the stuff I've seen on rotten.com, or even Faces of Death. Sorry for the OCD skepticism, but that's just my nature. I want to see.

I posted the link.

 

[U.N.Owen]

Could we call people conspiracy theorists less and try to be more productive instead? I actually do believe that he is dead. All I said is that I wanted to see stuff. Nasty pictures can't possibly be more shocking than some of the stuff I've seen on rotten.com, or even Faces of Death. Sorry for the OCD skepticism, but that's just my nature. I want to see.

The "conspiracy theorist" tag may not, then, really apply to you. But it sure applies to too damn many people. And it's not you the gov't is trying not to shock: many Muslims get hysterical over pics of bodies, and they're trying not to set them off unnecessarily.

More importantly, somebody else said "You can't make a man disbelieve something he gets paid to believe." The anti-Obama bandwagon is a profit center for some. They get money from books, speeches, T-shirts, etc. to push the myth that Obama can't do anything good and so for them perpetuating birtherism and Obama-is-a-secret-Muslim and other nonsense is a paycheck for them.

True enough.

I posted the link.

Actually, some legit outlets are saying that pic is an internet-made fake... which, ironically, is only fueling the conspiracy claims. Real pics are in gov't hands. Probably the less gruesome ones will be released in the coming days.

 

[PurpleStyle]

Yes, that picture looks shooped to hell. All that's missing is laser beams coming out of the eyes of his troll face.

 

[Inverse]

I actually find those who trust their government at face value just as legitimately silly as true conspiracy theorists. No offense, but there are few things in the world my family taught me to trust with simple faith. I'm not saying anyone is lying, but to put away the possibility from my mind would make me a fucking idiot. Thanks. This is a world with possibilities. This is a government that HAS, lied to its people~ many times before. This isn't like, breaking news. I'll have to accept the reality of the situation as it's presented because, well~ what choice do I have? But I'm not going to simply say something is true in the universe when all I have is the word of man to go by. That's my choice too.

 

[Rox_My_Sox1]

You know...we'll probably NEVER KNOW FOR SURE. We might as well accept that. As long as he doesn't show his face anymore, I don't really care one way or the other.

 

[jts963]

Exactly how do you people who doubt this death is real think it gets pulled off? Among other conspiracists, you'd have to include the entire Pakistani government, which looks damn bad for not detecting OBL right under their noses. He wasn't hiding in a cave, he was in a mansion less than a mile from the Pakistani Military Academy in a community full of military retirees. Exactly how does the US government "fake" his death in the middle of a nation we're allegedly allied with and makes that nation look either cartoonishly incompetent or OBL sympathesizers to boot?

Some conspiracy theories call for a huge disconnect from reality to hold on to them.

 

[jts963]

Could we call people conspiracy theorists less and try to be more productive instead? I actually do believe that he is dead. All I said is that I wanted to see stuff.

No that's not "all" you said. The title of this thread is Usama bin Laden: is he actually dead? Then you go on to say "I'm skeptical of his sudden death." Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

 

[jts963]

As one of my dearest friends put it:

Why didn't they nail him to a fucking cross and turn him into a display at ground zero? ( :lol I love her.)

Probably because they're smart enough to not turn him into a martyr. Hence the burial at sea. It's pretty hard to set up a shrine in the middle of a huge body of water.

 

[Mash]

The best way to destroy the legacy of a public figure is to destroy people's remembrance of him. Nailing him to a cross would not only invoke the ire of every last jihadist on that side of the Atlantic, but it would allow his name to be remembered far longer than just dumping him in the water.

I think they made the right choice.

 

[jts963]

The best way to destroy the legacy of a public figure is to destroy people's remembrance of him. Nailing him to a cross would not only invoke the ire of every last jihadist on that side of the Atlantic, but it would allow his name to be remembered far longer than just dumping him in the water.

I think they made the right choice.

Of course they did. I just hope somebody remembered to pour lots of chum into the body bag and slit it right before dumping so the sharks can do their work before some jihadist scuba divers try to retrieve their hero's body. :lol

 

[JackVanderson]

I do find this whole situation quite interesting aswell as fishy. But really I feel that the most important aspect of all of this is to realize the three main possibilities and of course the aftermath of this.

1. Osama's been dead for quite some time and used as a method to propell Obama to win next year's election. Either way he's dead, so who gives a fuck?

2. We actually got him. Okay break out the liquor, it's party time!

3. He's not actually dead/we have him and are interrogating/we fucked up and didn't get him. Either way the publicity from this still helps Obama UNLESS another tape is released showing and taunting us that he's still alive. (Of course a tape such as this could have been pre-recorded before hand and meant to be delivered to us after his death)

Now of course no matter which of these three it is here's the most important part. Arguing about this is pointless as hell. We're never going to know because our government is shady as all hell. Conspiracy theorists have JUST AS MUCH RIGHT to talk about their opinions as the overly trusting government backers and all inbetween.

That's because, yes we got our most hated enemy, but here's a newsflash, there's no way of knowing 100% he was indeed the "leader" of those terrorists.
Don't get what I mean? Think about this from a Mafia perspective: Does the Don go out and do the daily killings? Hell no, he has his "family" do it. Osama was a constant media drawer, that doesn't mean he was the number one incharge, what we need to do instead of bitching at one another like a bunch of castrated poodles is to instead keep vigilant because a counter attack could very well be coming.

So yeah, to those of you who can't handle an opinion from the other side: Stop ya' bitchin' :3