Why do people NOT buy tickling clips?

[The Tickle Room]

I just shoot what I can but i understand so many producers can pump out better. I just go for genuine girls off the street. But your points are totally valid

 

[weezl]

I have spent way too much money on tickling videos, and got burned way too often. For every 100 videos/clips that I bought, 2 or 3 were actually worth keeping. Yeah, I am an idiot. Even though everything is available for free online, I genuinely believe that a person should get paid for their work, especially if I enjoy the product or service they provided me. And I have bought several clips and videos from every producer that ever existed.

 

[GQguy]

The subscriptions that producers are starting to put out makes more sense for me.

When tickling vids were rare and a 20MB collection was HUGE it made sense to sell each clip individually.I also had more free time to check things out. Now i've got WAY too many clips. It would take years to watch them all. I don't need any new stuff. A $15 a month subscription however works by giving me access to a bunch of clips but also charging me more than I would be willing to pay per clip on a monthly basis. Honestly it's likely i'll just forget I subscribed! Their price scheme has to change with the times.

 

[TripleH1]

If they are free online, I won't pay. It's that simple, regardless of the morality. I DL music and movies for free too.

 

[Raytheon]

Maybe don't use your company credit card?

My god, what a brilliant idea! Is that why my mortgage repayments keep getting flagged too?

Having seen other fetish communities totally collapse and break up from pirating and pass leeching, I tend to flag videos for copyright when I bump into them. The balloon fetish community had upwards of 20 pay sites, Emma from emmasballoons had 6 sites by herself and the fetish regularly featured on playboy tv. Clips4Sale came along and videos started to be pirated as soon as they went live, the financial incentives dropped out he bottom of the market an the fetish collapsed. Now theres 2 forums and a few dedicated amateur clip producers. Pirate off billionaire media corps not the dude with a spare room and a few lights

 

[Seerzors]

I just shoot what I can but i understand so many producers can pump out better. I just go for genuine girls off the street. But your points are totally valid

I just want to say I'm a fan of the earlier videos you shot as they are so genuine and realistic, I can actually see it being real as opposed to other sites shot for fake laughs. I also like the way you interview them before and after it just makes the whole setup more believable and more enjoyable and their responses to your questions are a great touch as well.

 

[Seerzors]

The subscriptions that producers are starting to put out makes more sense for me.

When tickling vids were rare and a 20MB collection was HUGE it made sense to sell each clip individually.I also had more free time to check things out. Now i've got WAY too many clips. It would take years to watch them all. I don't need any new stuff. A $15 a month subscription however works by giving me access to a bunch of clips but also charging me more than I would be willing to pay per clip on a monthly basis. Honestly it's likely i'll just forget I subscribed! Their price scheme has to change with the times.

I'm kinda in the same boat as you as I've got a clip collection as well but subscription services allow me to see the ones I dont have and dont cost a lot, although I go on c4slive and see that stores with a $30 or $40 fee have almost no views. I think the owners have all but given up on running those stores but if the price was lower I might subscribe and i'd bet a lot of others would too

 

[Seerzors]

My god, what a brilliant idea! Is that why my mortgage repayments keep getting flagged too?

Having seen other fetish communities totally collapse and break up from pirating and pass leeching, I tend to flag videos for copyright when I bump into them. The balloon fetish community had upwards of 20 pay sites, Emma from emmasballoons had 6 sites by herself and the fetish regularly featured on playboy tv. Clips4Sale came along and videos started to be pirated as soon as they went live, the financial incentives dropped out he bottom of the market an the fetish collapsed. Now theres 2 forums and a few dedicated amateur clip producers. Pirate off billionaire media corps not the dude with a spare room and a few lights

as long as there is the internet there will be piracy of course but I still think there are plenty of people who pirate because the prices are so high, and if they were lower they would buy the great and the good clips to support the producer. Though everything is of course theoretical and we won't know until they try but for me I think it would work

 

[Docsoul]

Personally, these clips or videos never get old for me. I've been buying vhs, dvds and now clips since the 90s. I tend to like the sites and clips that feature girls next door and amateurs looking to make a few extra bucks. I love it when they realize that getting tickle tortured is a little more than they expected. It is wonderful to see them genuinely struggling when they get in over their head. The professional models tend to have prettier faces and nicer figures. The only problem is that many of them tend to ruin the fantasy of tickling them with over exaggerated responses to tickling. I'm real cautious about buying clips the feature the usual suspect models.

The prices and costs of videos really haven't changed much in the last 15 plus years. California Star was charging about $60.00 dollars for a VHS back in the day. FM concepts was typically $30 dollars per video. I like the idea of subscription services to help keep the costs purchasing individual clips lower. The piracy is ridiculous and ruinous for producers. For most consumers free is an unbeatable price. If clips were 10 cents a minute, it would still be too much for cheapskates who expect that everything to be free.

 

[AlexEmpire]

I'm a big believer in changing with the times.

I am willing to go pretty far to watching something I want to see in a legal way that compensates the producer. I currently pay for netflix, hulu plus, amazon prime, and have HBO Go. I will also seek out a TV shows website to watch something on their site. But if I can't find their movie/show/whatever online and at a reasonable price then I will resort to pirating. It isn't my preference, but at that point I feel I've given them ample opportunity to allow me to access their media in a way that suits the modern consumer.

Clip producers are, obviously, very different in that they are a much smaller production force. One person (or occasionally a couple) work together to provide the light, sound, videography, editing, pay the models, etc. Piracy hurts them a lot more than it hurts sony. But I can't help but agree that clip prices are very high. If I'm unwilling to pay $20 to buy a feature length film, it seems reasonable that clip buyers are less frequently willing to pay $15 for a 15 minute video.

If I film a 10 minute video that I paid a model $100 to sit for, I need to make at least more than $100 to break even. Let's say I want $150 per video. If I sell it at $10, I need to sell 25 copies of it. Remember Clips4Sale keeps 40%. If I sell it at $5 I need to sell 50 copies.

My question is, if producers lower their prices will all of the people who claim that clip prices are too expensive really start buying? If they cut them in half will the sales double? If they cut them down to a quarter of the price will sales quadruple? Will those of you who claim to pirate or watch tubesites because of the high price of clips actually start paying for clips at such rates? Enough to make it worth it to the producers?

And equally importantly, will you jump ship from C4S to a site that allows producers to set their own prices? Would this start a trend of ever increasing undercuts until producers undercut themselves out of the business because they can't afford to continue operating?

 

[Comfort Eagle]

You know it also seems like you ca't find 5 or 6 dollar clips anymore. It's rare to see anything priced below $12 and while I can rationalize dropping $5 here and there every so often, dropping $12-20 on a video every so often is something I need a bit more incentive to do.

 

[RavensFan52]

I'm a big believer in changing with the times.

I am willing to go pretty far to watching something I want to see in a legal way that compensates the producer. I currently pay for netflix, hulu plus, amazon prime, and have HBO Go. I will also seek out a TV shows website to watch something on their site. But if I can't find their movie/show/whatever online and at a reasonable price then I will resort to pirating. It isn't my preference, but at that point I feel I've given them ample opportunity to allow me to access their media in a way that suits the modern consumer.

Clip producers are, obviously, very different in that they are a much smaller production force. One person (or occasionally a couple) work together to provide the light, sound, videography, editing, pay the models, etc. Piracy hurts them a lot more than it hurts sony. But I can't help but agree that clip prices are very high. If I'm unwilling to pay $20 to buy a feature length film, it seems reasonable that clip buyers are less frequently willing to pay $15 for a 15 minute video.

If I film a 10 minute video that I paid a model $100 to sit for, I need to make at least more than $100 to break even. Let's say I want $150 per video. If I sell it at $10, I need to sell 25 copies of it. Remember Clips4Sale keeps 40%. If I sell it at $5 I need to sell 50 copies.

My question is, if producers lower their prices will all of the people who claim that clip prices are too expensive really start buying? If they cut them in half will the sales double? If they cut them down to a quarter of the price will sales quadruple? Will those of you who claim to pirate or watch tubesites because of the high price of clips actually start paying for clips at such rates? Enough to make it worth it to the producers?

And equally importantly, will you jump ship from C4S to a site that allows producers to set their own prices? Would this start a trend of ever increasing undercuts until producers undercut themselves out of the business because they can't afford to continue operating?

I personally would buy. Despite how much is available for free there is still plenty that's not on the free sites. Ive sen many preview clips that I would like to buy and if it's really good I go to clips4sale to possibly buy but then I see the price and I pass on it. I'd go as far to say I can think of at least 10 clips that I'm dying to see the full version of but I can't see myself paying the crazy price for it. But that's just me.

 

[GQguy]

I'm a big believer in changing with the times.

I am willing to go pretty far to watching something I want to see in a legal way that compensates the producer. I currently pay for netflix, hulu plus, amazon prime, and have HBO Go. I will also seek out a TV shows website to watch something on their site. But if I can't find their movie/show/whatever online and at a reasonable price then I will resort to pirating. It isn't my preference, but at that point I feel I've given them ample opportunity to allow me to access their media in a way that suits the modern consumer.

Clip producers are, obviously, very different in that they are a much smaller production force. One person (or occasionally a couple) work together to provide the light, sound, videography, editing, pay the models, etc. Piracy hurts them a lot more than it hurts sony. But I can't help but agree that clip prices are very high. If I'm unwilling to pay $20 to buy a feature length film, it seems reasonable that clip buyers are less frequently willing to pay $15 for a 15 minute video.

If I film a 10 minute video that I paid a model $100 to sit for, I need to make at least more than $100 to break even. Let's say I want $150 per video. If I sell it at $10, I need to sell 25 copies of it. Remember Clips4Sale keeps 40%. If I sell it at $5 I need to sell 50 copies.

My question is, if producers lower their prices will all of the people who claim that clip prices are too expensive really start buying? If they cut them in half will the sales double? If they cut them down to a quarter of the price will sales quadruple? Will those of you who claim to pirate or watch tubesites because of the high price of clips actually start paying for clips at such rates? Enough to make it worth it to the producers?

And equally importantly, will you jump ship from C4S to a site that allows producers to set their own prices? Would this start a trend of ever increasing undercuts until producers undercut themselves out of the business because they can't afford to continue operating?

I can't say I would buy. Few producer's get me excited enough to even watch their free previews....let alone buy a full clip. And then never watch it again. I actually dropped $50 on a clip just before I last deployed knowing I would have minimal internet access and nill access to members of the opposite sex....even then I watched it once when I downloaded it in the states.

The market is oversaturated with mediocre stuff.

I feel like clips fall into two categories:

1)Those that are made to sell

2)Those meant to offset the cost of indulging one's fetish

I don't think it's realistic in the least for all producers to think their material is worthy of selling. But some are truly geniuses when it comes to appealing to the masses.

 

[Darth Sidious]

Threads like this have popped up over the years and this time around I was preferring to stay out of it, but after reading some of the comments I saw, I can't let this go.

I agree with some who suggest the market is over saturated with mediocre stuff - it is! People who clearly didn't put much effort or thought into quality or anything (both model and video in general) have openly been posting junk in the Video Clips section and it's frustrating for both viewers and producers alike. I trully wish there was a better filter or control for that and perhaps with time some of that will fade, we'll see.

Everyone knows how I feel about the piracy issue and how aggressively I have fought it in the past and continue to do so by holding offenders accountable. That's exactly what needs to happen to curve that as it hurts everyone. How? Easy... you will see less and less quality emerge as you effectively harm the business all around. Without proper revenue, these videos cannot be made, plain and simple. Quality costs... and it takes a lot of resources to put a geniunely good product out there. When people pirate, it shows both a lack of respect and impedes the ability of companies to keep content coming that we all have come to enjoy over the years. Something to think about for those of you who think it's ok to do. It's not... and I encourage more producers to be very aggressive on this in terms of holding those who perpetrate it accountable!

Those who openly admit they will pirate are part of the problem and I'm sad to say I have seen an increase in people in this forum over the years with a false sense of entitlement. Those are probably the same people guilty of perpetuating the piracy of this niche content to begin with. Let's not forget, this isn't mainstream music or movies, it's our special niche, and we simply do not have the resources to absorb a piracy hit like they can. That's just being realistic.

As far as the pricing goes... I see both sides of the fence here. I don't feel that a good clip should be priced at say, $5.00...that's just silly to me and it doesn't work in this saturated market. The company would never make it. There has to be a balance between providing value and fair market value for quality work. Like anything, quality costs. It's a difference between say, a generic tire and a performance tire. If you want a quality video, you ought to be prepared to pay for it, it's that simple. Still, there becomes a point where pricing can get too exaggerated, and I'm not for that either. I purposely price mine below $30.00 and do my best to offer as much quality as possible for the price paid. For example, including the interview footage for free and not inclusive in the cost. I also will mark down a video more if its a bit lengthier than usual but getting a little too high in price within reason. The same is true for a video that was off the mark in any way on the quality standards. I just feel that's the right thing to do.

In those latter cases, I'm up front about it and ultimately its up to each consumer to decide what they are comfortable with and not on their spending tolerance. That's each persons right. If people stop buying...you'll simply see less and less quality content... or worse, companies stopping all together. All fruit for thought as we move forward.

 

[meangry]

It's hard to quantify what makes a good clip because clip tastes are, at the very least, divergent. I think companies that offer a variety of different tastes within their umbrella are more apt for success, as can be seen with subscription based pricing models as proposed by Tickle Abuse and Czech Tickling, who seem to be profitable enough that this isn't simply a hobby for them, but rather a primary revenue generation source. There is also the fact that a flooded market within the given framework with small samples that show a very minute part of a production might not be the most effective strategy, as, like most capitalistic media entities, creative editing can give a consumer a view of a product that is very different than the reality of it, as well as issues with an antiquated delivery method for media which makes piracy seem like a more viable access platform. That doesn't make it correct to do so, and price complaints ring hollow to me as pricing for content is at a level that is in tune with fair market value, from production and model costs.

What is problematic is that piracy and the like damages the capital the consumer has, now more than ever, in content control and getting more of what they actually want to see. Again, divergent tastes, but spent income, even if it is for one clip, is a vote toward more of that kind of content. There is the aspect of editing and disappointment when it comes to purchasing such products, but with the video forum so flooded with material, buyers should feel more empowered to voice their dissatisfaction, rather than simply give glowing praise or trolling criticism.

Then again, my passion is more towards the art side of the community, where this aspect of controlling content is pushed to the maximum.

While I understand commissioning artists and producers is steep for some, that aspect of this fetish is also at an all time high, and perhaps having a direct handle on helping fund the content you wish to consume is the best step.

 

[Hee_Hee]

It’s actually refreshing to see people being really honest about their reasons, even if that means admitting that piracy fits their needs. I have read every post in this thread and have decided to share my honest opinion as well. This especially because nobody else has yet spoken about my reason for not purchasing clips anymore. It won’t be popular, especially around here, but I figure honesty is the only thing that’s going to truly help this community, or vendors, where this situation is concerned.

To illustrate my reasons, I am going to tell you a quick story about this very subject. A few months ago (probably 6, my sense of time is horrible), a producer put out a scene that I REALLY wanted to see. However, the producer in question is one of these type that heavily favors feet footage over everything else. Inasmuch as I am so sick of the over-saturation of foot-related material in this community, there was no way I was going to pay $11 for an eleven minute clip, which literally had maybe 2-3 minutes of the actual content I want to see.

I actually PM’d the producer and probably went over the top and put them off in my PM, as I wrote it very shortly after realizing the situation and was still kind of pissed off. I suggested to this producer that there was no way in hell I was going to pay $11 for 2-3 minutes of content and that if they wanted to be smart about this, they would think about splitting up the UB content from the foot stuff and offering just the UB clips. That way I would be paying $2-3 instead of $11 for the footage I want, a deal which I would absolutely accept. Again, hear me when I say “I’m not paying ridiculous prices to get the tidbit I want from a full clip which is mostly foot tickling.”

To make an even greater point here, I actually came across this clip that I wanted so badly all those months ago just last night, sitting there ripe, ready to be picked off of one of the usual pirate sites. Of course, I downloaded it. You know what I found in watching it? The preview was actually better than the full UB footage from the clip. I would have been REALLY pissed if I had actually bought this clip at the over-inflated price it was offered.

These reasons, in a nutshell, are why I rarely if ever buy clips anymore. And, when I do buy clips on those rare occasions, it is only from producers who do not treat UB fans like the red-headed stepchild. Seriously, so many producers seem like they only care about that one area, and the only reason they shoot UB stuff is so they can double-dip on UB fans. That’s my feeling anyway.

I understand how pervasive this foot fetish thing is. Nonetheless, I can’t abide how one part of the body (especially that one), has usurped the entire rest of the body in this fetish. It’s ridiculous, and I won’t be party to it, at least where my money is concerned. I didn’t start out a foot-hater, but after watching the tickling community largely turn into a foot fetish community, I can honestly say if I never see another foot tickling scene, it would be too soon.

Let the hate flow. I’m ready for it.

 

[turtleboy]

This is a good topic, and an important one so kudos to Mabus for raising it in the first place. Like Darth, I wasn't going to join in this one but there are a couple of points that I feel a need to chime in on.

There have been some really good comments and important points made - particularly Myriads' post about the way people judge current clip 'quality' (or lack of) according to their own preferences and experiences. People often post about how clips were great back in the day and how they all suck now...this is usually supplemented with generalisations about how all clips are the same, it's all just porn, all the reactions are fake etc, etc, etc. If you actually look back a little way, I think that clip production has moved so far forward in all respects that customers really are spoilt for choice now. Video and audio quality has improved vastly, there are more models than ever of all varieties (and from many countries) - amateurs, pinup models, porn models, fetish models etc, etc. There are clips with themes or story lines and clips without, role-plays, straightforward tickling, bondage devices, playful tickling, clothing, nudity, tickle porn, gang tickling M/F, F/M, F/F, FF/F, standard def, 720p, 1080p you name it, it's available.

Go back a few years to the mythical era of greatness when tickle videos were 'real' and you have...Cal Star? FM Concepts? Feather dusters, bad acting and guys dressed as doctors or vampires - honestly, those clips are still around if you like that sort of thing. Of course there were good videos produced and as Myriads rightly pointed out, many of the popular companies disappeared through lack of sales - even though the clips are still on sale.

The thing that I find depressing about many of the comments here is not the admission of piracy. I see piracy all the time and like other producers, feel the effects of it. What I really don't get is this idea that clips are way overpriced now. A typical clip is between $5-$15, often around the $10 mark. Is this really so much money for specialist content? Think about how much you spend when you go to Starbucks or buy something on iTunes?

The standard default clip price on C4S is $1 per minute and as far as I'm aware, most tickling companies follow that. You actually can't discount your clips past a certain point (i.e. you can't sell a 15 min clip for $3) as clips4sale wants to make money for hosting the clips. Clips4sale takes 40% of every sale, so a $10 clip makes the producer $6. As some others have pointed out, tickling is a niche market. It relies on a smaller customer base to buy clips in order for producers to make any money at all. There's a lot of speculation here suggesting that if we sold clips for $1 or $2, the people currently pirating clips would suddenly start buying. They wouldn't, and no producer could survive on a margin or $1 or less per clip in any case (not that you could exactly sell at such a low price on C4S anyway)

Producing clips is an expensive business. Despite some of the earlier theorising on this, models don't do shoots for 10 minutes at a time. In my case, I'm generally paying for models 3 or 4 hours shooting as a minimum + travel costs (the travel alone is typically at least $50-$100) The overall cost is then doubled for an F/F shoot, tripled for FF/F etc. And then there's the cost of leasing a studio, buying equipment, paying taxes, bills etc. Monthly running costs for the larger producers run into the thousands. Knowing how many people actually buy clips, the idea of selling clips at next to nothing just to try and persuade some illegal downloaders to actually dig out their credit cards is not likely to work sadly.

Given the high cost of running a tickling company (and even the amateur-type stores have costs to meet), I just can't get my head around the concept that people are being overcharged nowadays. If clips were suddenly retailing at $50 each, I would agree but they're not. They're just the same price they've always been - the same with membership sites. Shorter clips at $5 or $6 still exist and for people that complain they would never pay $10 or more for a clip - can you honestly say you've never paid $10-20 for a pizza? Or cinema tickets? I have and I haven't liked every film I've ever been to see or enjoyed every meal I've eaten out, but if I felt really shortchanged I'd probably complain to the company concerned and get a discount next time. I wouldn't start running out of restaurants without paying because I felt entitled to do so. It's this sense of entitlement that I don't get - this idea that it's ok to rip stores off because you bought clips in the past that you didn't like, and so you don't buy anymore. Those clips that you didn't like may have been someone else's favourite - and honestly, if you really feel that tickling clips aren't worth paying a few dollars for then you should find another hobby. Saying that they suck and then spending hours searching out the same clips for free is just hypocritical. Expecting producers to invest a lot of money and time making clips to virtually give them away is both unfair and unrealistic.

Meangry made a good point that if you actually put some of your money into buying the stuff you do like, you can influence producers to make more of what you like to see. If people don't put money into buying clips (because they think piracy is a better option), then there won't be anything much left to choose from in a few years - even on the tube sites.

Sorry if this seems like rambling but it is an important subject. I salute those people that continue to buy clips and don't post them all over the internet - you're the reason that new clips are still being made

 

[MrTicklefeet]

Generally I've been avoiding these belly aching threads, as there seems to be so much of them lately at a time when we have more tickling producers than ever before. "I don't like this, I don't like that, prices are too high," and on and on. Where did these people come from? They weren't around before. We have entered the belly ache decade.

For me, maybe my age is somewhat of a benefit, as I rarely see the things these folks complain about so much. Then again, I stopped buying clips a while back. I started sending away for VHS tapes back in the 90's, and then the TMF opened, and it was like a horn of plenty. Back then it was mainly people sharing their experiences, dreams, and had been a much calmer place. I then started buying clips, and was fortunate enough to catch the Lena series from French Tickling, Nurse Lisa from Tickle Abuse, and that one fellow who's name I can't remember who gave us a free ten minute clip of Madison for Christmas. Such joy to be had.

Then in '07, I got a small inheritance, invested 5 grand on getting the car fixed up, then wondering what pleasure I could subject for myself, decided to get a camcorder and start posting adds on Craigslist looking for models to shoot home made tickling videos. Yowsa Bob, the women that turned out that I would have never met on here, and I've met a few personal favorites who would keep coming back multiple times. I did that for two years, and since then, I haven't been inspired much for buying clips any more. I've got more video content than I know what to do with, plus I've also edited favorite stuff onto my own DVD burner for prosperity. Ah, the joyous music of laughter that has filled this apartment.

Now we seem to be more about consumerism, and some of those armchair football critics who are producer wanna be's that don't want to go out and have their own experiences, but would rather complain that the world should produce something exactly the way they want it without them wanting to pay for it. I don't get that. I feel like growing up in the analog age gave me a few more benefits than some of these currant kids with their IPads obsessing over how much free tickling they can saturate their brains with, without having any actual experience. Maybe I'm reading into that, but I was happy with the sharing community this place once was, and still is to some extent.

 

[oldgeezer]

My main reasons...
Tasha stopped doing nude / erotic scenes and Samantha never started.

 

[weezl]

I think it's kind of an amusement that producers argue that we are spoiled with tons of content now, which I think is a load of horse shit. We got a ton of crappy content that isn't worth the price of admission. It is really hard for me to find videos that are geared towards exactly what I personally enjoy the most. None the less, producers typically try to focus on what sells the most.

I don't mind paying for videos, but after having bought so many video's that absolutely sucked, I feel I have a right to complain.

 

[CTS Film Crew]

I don't always purchase clips because I usually find a lot of videos are beneath my personal standards for laughter. I mean, it literally sounds like some of these models are orgasming, rather than actually laughing.

If I used a site like Pornhub or Youtube or Dailymotion, then I could browse through hundreds of videos that do not meet my standards, and find what I'm looking for. Just last night, I found two videos that I'd been looking for since I was about fifteen, by Tropical Tickling. They don't have these videos on their clip store anymore, and several attempts on my part to get in contact with them to get copies of those videos ended with no response.

Whereas if I used Clips4sale, I would have lost over 500 dollars seeking what I'm looking for. Which is why I make previews that have enough time to enjoy it in general. You know what you're getting before you pay.

 

[RavensFan52]

This is a good topic, and an important one so kudos to Mabus for raising it in the first place. Like Darth, I wasn't going to join in this one but there are a couple of points that I feel a need to chime in on.

There have been some really good comments and important points made - particularly Myriads' post about the way people judge current clip 'quality' (or lack of) according to their own preferences and experiences. People often post about how clips were great back in the day and how they all suck now...this is usually supplemented with generalisations about how all clips are the same, it's all just porn, all the reactions are fake etc, etc, etc. If you actually look back a little way, I think that clip production has moved so far forward in all respects that customers really are spoilt for choice now. Video and audio quality has improved vastly, there are more models than ever of all varieties (and from many countries) - amateurs, pinup models, porn models, fetish models etc, etc. There are clips with themes or story lines and clips without, role-plays, straightforward tickling, bondage devices, playful tickling, clothing, nudity, tickle porn, gang tickling M/F, F/M, F/F, FF/F, standard def, 720p, 1080p you name it, it's available.

Go back a few years to the mythical era of greatness when tickle videos were 'real' and you have...Cal Star? FM Concepts? Feather dusters, bad acting and guys dressed as doctors or vampires - honestly, those clips are still around if you like that sort of thing. Of course there were good videos produced and as Myriads rightly pointed out, many of the popular companies disappeared through lack of sales - even though the clips are still on sale.

The thing that I find depressing about many of the comments here is not the admission of piracy. I see piracy all the time and like other producers, feel the effects of it. What I really don't get is this idea that clips are way overpriced now. A typical clip is between $5-$15, often around the $10 mark. Is this really so much money for specialist content? Think about how much you spend when you go to Starbucks or buy something on iTunes?

The standard default clip price on C4S is $1 per minute and as far as I'm aware, most tickling companies follow that. You actually can't discount your clips past a certain point (i.e. you can't sell a 15 min clip for $3) as clips4sale wants to make money for hosting the clips. Clips4sale takes 40% of every sale, so a $10 clip makes the producer $6. As some others have pointed out, tickling is a niche market. It relies on a smaller customer base to buy clips in order for producers to make any money at all. There's a lot of speculation here suggesting that if we sold clips for $1 or $2, the people currently pirating clips would suddenly start buying. They wouldn't, and no producer could survive on a margin or $1 or less per clip in any case (not that you could exactly sell at such a low price on C4S anyway)

Producing clips is an expensive business. Despite some of the earlier theorising on this, models don't do shoots for 10 minutes at a time. In my case, I'm generally paying for models 3 or 4 hours shooting as a minimum + travel costs (the travel alone is typically at least $50-$100) The overall cost is then doubled for an F/F shoot, tripled for FF/F etc. And then there's the cost of leasing a studio, buying equipment, paying taxes, bills etc. Monthly running costs for the larger producers run into the thousands. Knowing how many people actually buy clips, the idea of selling clips at next to nothing just to try and persuade some illegal downloaders to actually dig out their credit cards is not likely to work sadly.

Given the high cost of running a tickling company (and even the amateur-type stores have costs to meet), I just can't get my head around the concept that people are being overcharged nowadays. If clips were suddenly retailing at $50 each, I would agree but they're not. They're just the same price they've always been - the same with membership sites. Shorter clips at $5 or $6 still exist and for people that complain they would never pay $10 or more for a clip - can you honestly say you've never paid $10-20 for a pizza? Or cinema tickets? I have and I haven't liked every film I've ever been to see or enjoyed every meal I've eaten out, but if I felt really shortchanged I'd probably complain to the company concerned and get a discount next time. I wouldn't start running out of restaurants without paying because I felt entitled to do so. It's this sense of entitlement that I don't get - this idea that it's ok to rip stores off because you bought clips in the past that you didn't like, and so you don't buy anymore. Those clips that you didn't like may have been someone else's favourite - and honestly, if you really feel that tickling clips aren't worth paying a few dollars for then you should find another hobby. Saying that they suck and then spending hours searching out the same clips for free is just hypocritical. Expecting producers to invest a lot of money and time making clips to virtually give them away is both unfair and unrealistic.

Meangry made a good point that if you actually put some of your money into buying the stuff you do like, you can influence producers to make more of what you like to see. If people don't put money into buying clips (because they think piracy is a better option), then there won't be anything much left to choose from in a few years - even on the tube sites.

Sorry if this seems like rambling but it is an important subject. I salute those people that continue to buy clips and don't post them all over the internet - you're the reason that new clips are still being made

I understand your position. Respectfully I'd like to reply to some of your points if I may

Firstly 1$ per minute is not good value in my opinion. I honestly think maybe producers should look for another option instead of clips for sale if you a forced to sell it at a certain price. That limits the ability to do stuff like sales and deals. That's what people do everyday. Thats why people buy 10 news papers at the dollar store to get the coupons out. Or waiting to buy certain things when their on sale, Or waiting to buy new technology until the price drops. Thats just what people do, in these economic times that what you have to do. Now back to tickling clips.. I understand that clips are expensive to make but if Im being 100% honest with you it's not really my concern. That may sound harsh but that's just how I feel. I have too many other things to be concerned about then that. The fact that there a legitimate reason for the price doesn't mean Im willing to pay it if I don;t feel the value is worth it. You can't compare the value of hanging out with friends at the movie theater or the value buying a pizza so my wife doesn't have to cook to porn. It just doesn't work. Also I think I speak for most when I say tickling is not a hobby.. it's a fetish. A addicting fetish so we can't just find another hobby. If I got to tickle women and make any money or hell I'd be more then happy to break even. I would not get into a porn industry expecting to make a ton of money as we know piracy is out there. I'd just enjoy the hell out of it and let the chips fall where they may as again there no way I'd make that my main source of income.

I think a good idea would be more subscription service sites where you pay a monthly fee for unlimited access. I havn't pirated a single music album in a while. Why? Cause I have spotify. I happily spend 9.99 a month for that as it good bang for my buck. Maybe a service where alot of the older clips are available on a site like that and still sell newer clips at the regular price. I dunno if this is even doable but that just something that would spark my interest. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.

I again want to reemphasize everything I said Im saying respectfully. I don't want a flame war Im just giving you my perspective.

 

[turtleboy]

I understand your position. Respectfully I'd like to reply to some of your points if I may

Firstly 1$ per minute is not good value in my opinion. I honestly think maybe producers should look for another option instead of clips for sale if you a forced to sell it at a certain price. That limits the ability to do stuff like sales and deals. That's what people do everyday. Thats why people buy 10 news papers at the dollar store to get the coupons out. Or waiting to buy certain things when their on sale, Or waiting to buy new technology until the price drops. Thats just what people do, in these economic times that what you have to do. Now back to tickling clips.. I understand that clips are expensive to make but if Im being 100% honest with you it's not really my concern. That may sound harsh but that's just how I feel. I have too many other things to be concerned about then that. The fact that there a legitimate reason for the price doesn't mean Im willing to pay it if I don;t feel the value is worth it. You can't compare the value of hanging out with friends at the movie theater or the value buying a pizza so my wife doesn't have to cook to porn. It just doesn't work. Also I think I speak for most when I say tickling is not a hobby.. it's a fetish. A addicting fetish so we can't just find another hobby. If I got to tickle women and make any money or hell I'd be more then happy to break even. I would not get into a porn industry expecting to make a ton of money as we know piracy is out there. I'd just enjoy the hell out of it and let the chips fall where they may as again there no way I'd make that my main source of income.

I think a good idea would be more subscription service sites where you pay a monthly fee for unlimited access. I havn't pirated a single music album in a while. Why? Cause I have spotify. I happily spend 9.99 a month for that as it good bang for my buck. Maybe a service where alot of the older clips are available on a site like that and still sell newer clips at the regular price. I dunno if this is even doable but that just something that would spark my interest. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.

I again want to reemphasize everything I said Im saying respectfully. I don't want a flame war Im just giving you my perspective.

I get what you are trying to say but I think you are missing the point in a few places.

Firstly 1$ per minute is not good value in my opinion. I honestly think maybe producers should look for another option instead of clips for sale if you a forced to sell it at a certain price. That limits the ability to do stuff like sales and deals.

Firstly, producers do offer sales and deals (I had one running last week) we just have to be more creative to work around the limitations of C4S. $1 per min may not seem cheap but it is reflective of the production costs involved in supplying a product for a niche fetish market. C4S is by far the largest fetish clip vendor around and is I'm afraid, a necessary evil if producers are to reach the relatively small group of potential customers out there.

You can't compare the value of hanging out with friends at the movie theater or the value buying a pizza so my wife doesn't have to cook to porn. It just doesn't work. Also I think I speak for most when I say tickling is not a hobby.. it's a fetish. A addicting fetish so we can't just find another hobby. If I got to tickle women and make any money or hell I'd be more then happy to break even. I would not get into a porn industry expecting to make a ton of money as we know piracy is out there. I'd just enjoy the hell out of it and let the chips fall where they may as again there no way I'd make that my main source of income.

The reason I make that analogy (and believe it is valid) is because tickling vids are entertainment. They are a luxury, not a necessity - like getting a pizza, watching a movie, buying an album or some apps for your phone etc, etc. Tickling may not be a hobby but watching clips is just another form of entertainment - and it is a choice. You can choose not to watch clips and to read a book or go out with friends instead, or you can choose to buy clips. Some people choose to spend their time pirating them instead and that is also a choice.

The fact that you personally feel you would be willing to work for free and to run a business that makes no money, just because you could get to tickle women does not apply to other people. Of course producers expect to make a living of some sort and if they can't because there isn't enough of a market, then they will shut up shop. It isn't a charity, although I think collectively we do put out a hell of a lot of free content.

I think a good idea would be more subscription service sites where you pay a monthly fee for unlimited access. I havn't pirated a single music album in a while. Why? Cause I have spotify. I happily spend 9.99 a month for that as it good bang for my buck. Maybe a service where alot of the older clips are available on a site like that and still sell newer clips at the regular price. I dunno if this is even doable but that just something that would spark my interest. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.

I get the point but again, lots of producers already offer membership sites like this - Tickleabuse, Czech, French Tickling to name a few. I also have one although I keep it seperate to my store and produce seperate content for it. You know what gets pirated the most heavily? The membership site. Why? Because people can download everything for one low price and then post it everywhere...and so people stop signing up. This is why porn has generally been moving away from the subscription site model towards the pay-per-view model in recent years. That's the problem with mass piracy - it has a way of killing off things that worked pretty well before. The other problem with subscription sites is the cost - your average adult membership site build will set you back somewhere in the region $3000-$6000. Of course, you then have to pay for all that space to host all those vids and the bandwidth to cover all the users. And then you have to pay a % of each sale to your payment processor. This is why sites like clips4sale enable producers of niche fetish material (like tickling) to exist.

I agree that services like Spotify are great, but bear in mind that Apple has about 10 billion, billion customers - all buying iPhones and computers. They could probably offer Spotify for free and still make a fortune.

 

[CTS Film Crew]

For those saying that 1 dollar a minute is not a good deal, consider this:

You may spend about 8 or 10 dollars to get a sandwich from subway, which may last about 15 to 20 minutes.

You can spend 5 dollars for 5 good minutes, and you'll have it forever.

You spend more on a train ticket sometimes, than you do on these videos. You spend more on a lot of things than you do on these videos.

In a way, yes, the consumer is quite privileged, however in a way the consumer is not.

Much of the content is monotonous, save for a few producers who generate new material with new people consistently. This monotony can make ANYONE irate.

There should be a comprimise.

 

[MalevolentCha0s]

A typical clip is between $5-$15, often around the $10 mark. Is this really so much money for specialist content?

Well...yeah. At least at the higher end. It's all about the most bang for your buck.

I can spend $15, and get 15 minutes of content. This is assuming that the entire video is tickling, which is often not the case..but let's give the benefit of the doubt.

Or I can spend $30 on a monthly sub to TA or Czech, browse through a catalog 100+ pages long, and download 20 hours of content. I can then cancel the sub and get all of that for $30, or if I'm getting more than 30 minutes of new content a month, keep it active. Either way, I'm getting more from my money than I am at C4S.

To use a real world application of this, I often find a model that I really, really enjoy, and want to see more of. Now, if I want to buy all of the clips that a producer has of that girl, and there's 10 clips....that could run me anywhere from $50-$150. Or I can go buy a $30 sub at their membership site, download all 10, and then cancel the sub. Which makes more financial sense?