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World corruption, lying politicians and the tragedy of 9/11.

BigJim

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I begin this post with a certain amount of trepidation. It’s going to be challenging reading this; be warned! Probably more than it was to research and write it. For anyone to agree with any single component of it, would fly in the face of fundamental “facts” that everyone knows are true; such as America being the freest country in the world and the fairest country in the world. I think for that reason that non-American readers will find it easier to swallow, even where criticism of their country is implied. Europeans, Brits, Australians etc tend to be not less patriotic, but far less positive about their inherent national righteousness. This is also going to be touted as a “conspiracy theory”, but what the hell! It’s just information at the end of the day. There are too many people in this world that say that you have to agree with their perception of reality, so I won’t be going down that route. I’ll certainly get passionate about this information, but hopefully not bombastic.
As a sort of disclaimer I’ll say right off the bat that I don’t support or agree with evil and disturbed people like Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. Both of them are lunatics, robbers of human life and perpetuators of human misery. But there are also people who publicly demonise these two to hide their own crimes and misdeeds. So even though Osama and Saddam are head cases, there are those who are worse. And before anyone asks, yes I am talking about George W. Bush and Tony Blair. Not just about them, but they certainly feature prominently in this story.


Anyone who’s read any of my previous posts about politics or religion will be familiar with the theme I’m going to be taking. For a start, the “I-Word” will be featuring prominently in this story. (Illuminati) There have been several misconceptions of the meaning of this word in the context I use it though. Most people think of the “Illuminati” as some shadowy secret society that operates outside of the visible public arena and clandestinely controls events on the public stage. That is accurate to a certain extent, but not totally. To explain what I mean by the “Illuminati” I have to explain what me and my fellow equally derided conspiracy theorists call the Pyramid System. (No, it’s nothing to do with Amway.)
Each industry, profession and structure of society is built like a compartmentalised pyramid. Take banking for example. You’re a teller that works for Bollockhead & Squigley Bank PLC. You work on the desk, and have generally no idea what goes on inside the branch manager’s office. You’re just told the minimum you need to perform your job effectively and that’s it. Similarly the branch manager has little or no idea about what’s going on at regional level and they have no idea what’s going on at board level and they have no idea what goes on at international level. As you get higher in the organisation fewer and few people are involved and those in the lower levels have no idea about what is going on from the next level up. The same is true of the military, medical profession, politics, secret societies like the Freemasons and Skull and Bones Society at Yale University, everything. They are all the same. However, there is another pyramid that encloses the whole of society and goes to the point at the top. At the tope of this pyramid, the same people control every industry by delegating downline to their subordinates in each industry. These people control the banks, the newspapers and TV and radio stations, the armies and navies and the secret societies. These people are the ones I refer to when I use the term “Illuminati”. This means that the Illuminati are not “the Freemasons” or “the Shriners” or “the politicians”. They’re the ones at the top of the overall pyramid who control them all; in the vast majority of cases, unknowingly and probably unwillingly. These Illuminati are centred on some prominent families in the world who have been running things in all departments from time immemorial. If you find that hard to believe then consider that George W. Bush is a cousin of Britain’s Prince Charles and Queen Elizabeth the 2nd. Not only that but he’s the latest in a long line of cousins. George W. Bush is the 43rd man to be elected President of the United States of America. Out of those 43, 34 have been so closely related to European royalty that they can directly trace their heritage back to King Charlemagne, the monarch of medieval France. No wouldn’t it make sense that a country with close to a billion residents since it began and was a place where “anyone born tomorrow could grow up to be President”, would have a bit of genetic diversity in it’s leaders? It makes sense to me, but it’s not the way it’s ever been. President after President has been elected with close blood ties to European royalty and nobility. And they share with royalty and nobility the obsession about intermarrying and interbreeding with each other. The so-called “establishment” families of the north-eastern United States like the Kennedys; Melons, Bush’s etc are all related to each other by blood and are always rogering each other for mutual genetic benefit. Why? What is so bloody marvellous about perpetuating the DNA they inherited from their royal relatives in Europe? This is not even a very closely guarded secret, but simply a non-circulated one.
During the end phase of the 2000 presidential elections, Burke’s Peerage, the “Bible” of royal and aristocratic genealogy said exactly the same thing. In 1996 when Clinton was facing of against Bob Dole, Burke’s Peerage said that the candidate with the most royal genes had one every election since 1789 when George Washington was elected. On October 17th 2000, Burke’s Peerage stated unequivocally that Dubya and Al Gore were both of Royal descent with Dubya having the slightly bluer blood. Harold Brooks-Baker (publishing director of Burke’s Peerage) said in the Reuters report: “It is now clear that Mr. Gore and Mr. Bush have an unusually large number of royal and noble descents”. Not really, not if you know how the game has been played for centuries. He goes on to say: “In point of fact, never in the history of the Untied States have two presidential candidates been so well endowed with royal alliances.” He goes on to say even more. Indeed, he claims that there has always been a significant “royal factor” in those who set their sights on the White House. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Teddy and Franklin Roosevelt, Ronald Regan, George Bush (X2) and others all have significant blue blooded linkage. He mentioned that Al Gore, (a cousin of Richard Nixon incidentally) was a direct descendant of England’s Edward I and has direct genetic connection to the Holy Roman Empire via Emperors Louis II, Charles II and Louis I.
This does of course make Gore a descendant of Charlemagne, which in turn makes him yet another cousin of George W. Bush! Surprised? You ain’t seen nothing yet.
For those of you who feel offended that I’ve implicated Freemasons in this “conspiracy”, bear this in mind. If you know a Freemason, I would bet my pension that they’re no higher ranked than the 3rd Degree. Well there are 33 degrees in the Sacred Scottish Rite of Freemasonry and 10 in the York Rite. 3rd Degree (Master Mason) is roughly the equivalent of a platoon sergeant in the army. Such people have no say or knowledge of the agendas of the organisation as a whole. A book called The Deadly Deception, written by Jim Shaw, himself a former 33rd Degree Freemason reveals some interesting facts. A very prominent Mason was one Albert Pike, who died in 1891. He wrote a book called Morals and Dogma which were intended for people in the upper echelons of the organisation to know about, but Jim Shaw very bravely makes a passage public.
“The Blue Degrees (the first 3 in other words) are but the outer portico of the Temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the initiate, but he is intentionally mis-led by false interpretations. It is not intended that he understand them, but it is intended that he shall imagine he understands them.…. Their true implication is reserved for adepts, the Princes of Masonry.”
The reason I mention this is because I do not want an indignant earful from anyone who has relatives in Freemasonry who thinks I am accusing them of world corruption. People in the first three degrees of freemasonry are no more responsible for that organisation’s corruption, than tellers who work in a bank are responsible for that bank causing the death of millions of children through third world debt. Yanno?

I’ve heard it said a lot that it couldn’t be possible for an “Illuminati organisation” to control the world, because it would take too much organisation and they are far too disorganised to do it. Well not only is it possible, it’s a piece of smegging cake. For a few interbreeding “Illuminati” families to run the game without a ripple, all you need is for certain key institutions of “information” to be securely placed. There are not enough of them (the manipulators) to control us physically, so they have to mind-bugger us into controlling ourselves and each other. You want to rule the world, you create the mediums of media, you create the picture of what is considered “normal” and then you sit back and watch the masses fall over themselves to give control of their minds away. If you don’t conform to the idea of normalcy that is presented in the newspapers and on the TV, you are quickly branded a “freak”, a “nutter”, “weird”, or a “conspiracy theorist”. Not only do they control us, but they’ve created a system in which we control EACH OTHER! As soon as someone steps out of line, as soon as someone makes it obvious they don’t swallow the official version of “normal” their career prospects and street cred are shot to ribbons. If you’re a doctor who knows that the crap Eli Lily and Glaxo-Welcome pump out is poisoning patients more effectively than curing them (a prime example being AZT, the drug used for treatment of AIDS) then you either shut up and peddle the official line, or you get fired. Plain and simple. Same for the teaching profession, one of the most sacred professions on the face of the planet, if not the MOST sacred. You actually encourage students to think for themselves instead of swallowing blatant lies, and your career is over. If you don’t believe me, watch The Dead Poets Society with Robin Williams. It’s a classic example and it’s a true story as well.
Once you’ve established the norms in society, you create divisions in it. You create different religions, different political parties, different isms and ianities across the board and then you set the poor bastards in each one to war with each other. You give Muslims a reason to fear and hate the Christians and vice versa. While they’re busy knocking nine shades of shite out of each other, you sit back and smile happily, secure in the knowledge that they’re too busy fighting each other to concentrate on their real enemies. And shock! Horror! At the thought that people might wake up, realise they’ve got nothing against the other people they’ve allowed themselves to be manipulated into slaughtering and turn their attention to the people who’ve really been causing the misery. What makes this situation even more absurd is that the people fighting each other think their opponents are opposites of them. As I’ve catalogues in God knows how many posts about religion, religions aren’t only different, they’re stunningly similar, with different names for the leading characters and a different dress for the priest/vicar/rabbi/disciple to wear. These religions tell the same stories about the same characters with different names, but millions of people have never cottoned to the con and have fought bloody wars against anyone who didn’t share their vision of reality, purely because they allowed themselves to give control of their thinking process away.
So the primary methods of manipulation are as follows:
*You create a mind-prison doctrine with a fundamentally shortsighted vision of possibility and reality. Doesn’t matter what you call it. Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Republicanism, Democratism, Conservatism, Liberalism, patriotism…they’re all the same. They all create human servitude from the same basic script, while claiming to tell the only real “truth”.
*You encourage those who follow these rigid, dogmatic systems to impose them on others and make life very unpleasant and in some cases, unsafe for anyone who doe not conform to it.
You bring these different dogmas into conflict with each other, so making sure you create a “divide and rule” situation. Without that “D&R” you can’t control the masses, because HEAVEN FORBID!!!!!!! They might wake up and unite. So….. while the masses are busy fighting each other and trying to impose their belief systems on each other, they don’t see that the “Illuminati” have created and are pulling the strings of all of them. People with perfectly functioning minds will become like moths entranced by a light bulb; so mesmerised and taken up by their religious belief, the sports scores, the price of beer and who’s shagging who’s f***ing wife on the soap opera, that they don’t notice the preparations being made behind them to smash them across the back of the bloody head with a fly swatter.

Before I get into the specifics of the lies we have been told about 9/11 and The War Against Terrorism (TWAT for short--- Thanks Grippedchimp. J ) I need to explain about two of the biggest and most effective methods of manipulation that have been used against us. The first of these has been called by “conspiracy theorists”, Problem-Reaction-Solution. (Apparently it was formerly known as the Hegelian Dialectic, but I’ve never heard of that before yesterday.) The other is called the “stepping stones approach”.
P-R-S is the key to really understanding all the machinations behind 9/11. The way it goes, is like this………
You know that if you stand up in congress or parliament and propose removal of civil rights, start a needless war or centralise power behind an un-elected and unaccountable body, that people will be up in arms complaining that you’re screwing them. So you don’t openly and honestly say anything about it, instead you set Problem-Reaction-Solution into play. You create a problem; a country attacking another country, a governmental or economical collapse, a run on a currency (are you listening up there in Canada?) or a “terrorist attack”. Anything in short, that will create a massive public reaction and get them to demand a solution. At stage 2 you report the problems (that you’ve created) in the manner you so desire and in the way you wish the people to perceive them. Very importantly, you find someone to pin the blame on. You need someone like Lee Harvey Oswald, Timothy McVeigh or Osama bin-Laden. (No, I’m not denying that McVeigh was involved in Oklahoma, but simply that he was the public “fall guy” for the situation.) You get your spin-doctors to go into action and make sure a public frenzy of “something must be done about this” is created. These words are drops of honey for the ears of the manipulators because they open the gates to stage number 3. Stage 3 is the sting, the scam, the con, the proverbial shafting up the arse. You propose the very things you wanted to implement in the first place, but couldn’t because you knew the public would not stand for it. The thing is, by now the public are openly demanding you screw them and they think it was THEIR idea! These “solution” you offer are of course, centralisation of power, firing officials or politicians that are too honest for your agenda and are getting in your way and the removal of basic human freedoms.
April 19th 1995 was a classic and heart-breaking example of P-R-S. The bomb at the Alfred P. Murrah building was alleged to have been a fuel-fertiliser device in the back of a Ryder Truck. Independent bomb experts who have served for 20 years in the US army have sworn blind that the pattern of damage done to the building (which was specifically designed to withstand a bomb blast) could only have been done by sophisticated explosives like Semtex or C4, placed hard against the load-bearing pillars in the corners of the building. Yet ask anyone from anywhere in the world what happened there and they will trot out the official explanation, even though it has been logically demolished countless times. Why? Because within 24 hours of something like this happening, the official explanation is battered into the human consciousness through saturation of newsheets and news programs. So where are these more logical explanations circulated? In low circulation newsletters and privately run underground newspapers. Why isn’t it reported in the media if it’s so obvious? I mean, doesn’t America have a free press? Because the owners of newspaper groups like the Mirror Group, Hollinger Group and son on, are members of the same secret society networks that control the politicians. I’m sure you’ve heard me mention them before; the Bilderberg Group, the Council On Foreign Relations, The Committee Of 300, The round Table, The Trilateral Commission, The Royal Institute Of International Affairs etc. All the people in media power like Rupert Murdoch, Conrad Black and so on are members of at least two or three of these groups. The SAME groups that supposed political opponents like George Bush (X2), Bill Clinton, Tony Blair and Edward Heath are members of. It’s the overall pyramid again; the same people control all the organisations. Not only possible, but simple.
The “stepping stones approach” can best be exemplified by the European Union. You have an agenda you want to introduce, namely centralised control of money, politics and the military. You first use P-R-S to get the public to demand that something must be done to stop horrendous wars in Europe. After WW2 came the United Nations, the successor to the League of Nations. And hot on it’s heels comes the common market. “Nothing to worry about, it’s just a free trade area. There is no question of any member nation giving up any of their own sovereignty.” The common market becomes the EEC……a few years later with the treaty of Maastricht in 1992 it becomes the European Union. From a free trade area in which all were independent, it has evolved into an unelected quango, run by bureaucrats with no accountability to the people they fine if they weigh their bananas in pounds and ounces instead of kilograms. If you’d proposed the EU after the war, there would have been an outcry of “We’re not having that! I just fought for 6 yeas to stop that happening! No chance sonny Jim!” So the free trade area was brought in and by a series of apparently unconnected steps, it evolves into an unelected dictatorship, in which individual governments have only too happily given away their independence. The people get screwed by the “stepping stones approach”. The same will happen through NAFTA and APEC eventually. They will go from trading, to mutually sharing laws and finally they’ll be leaping into political bed with each other too.
Within 24 hours of the bombing at Oklahoma, Bill Clinton passed laws through congress that removed basic civil rights from American people, by giving the military more powers in the event of civil disturbance. This legislation went through without so much as a murmur of dissent? Why? Because any suicidally brave senator or congressman who dared to stand up and speak against it, would have been accused of being everything from un-patriotic to wanting to help criminals and terrorists. Classic manipulation. So what is the easiest way to get people to demand that the government take away their rights like Bill Clinton did after Oklahoma? The easiest way would be for a “terrorist group” to stage the most audacious attack in living memory and get the entire nation frothing at the collective mouth to go to war. Now you see where this is going? Thought you might. After seeing “9/11” in the title of this post, you must have been wondering when I’d get round to talking about it. Well very soon is the answer. But first, I need to explain something that you will find even harder to believe than a “conspiracy theory” about the WTC tragedy.


One of the biggest cons ever played on the people of the USA, is the notion of their “independence”. Ask any schoolchild about the War of Independence and they’ll trot out the official line about how wonderful heroes like George Washington, Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson secured liberty for their country and ensured that fair democracy reigned. Watch any cartoon that is supposedly just there for entertainment and you’ll hear cartoon characters talking about how Washington and Franklin were champions of freedom and two of the greatest Presidents the country’s ever had. Nothing about either owning hundreds of slaves of course or anything about Washington being a Colonel in the British Army or a Knight of the Garter in the English court. Strange that isn’t it?
When you take an objective look at history, it is staggering just how many hoops the British had to jump through to make sure they “lost” the war. Some of the staggering acts of incompetence that were required defy belief. And this is the army that produced generals and soldiers capable of destroying the best that Napoleon Bonaparte could throw at them. Uh? Confused? So was I.
When “independence” was allegedly gained, the British overtly withdrew from the country. They left behind them men like George Washington and Benjamin Franklin; men who were both 33rd degree Freemasons and very closely connected with English aristocracy. During the war, Benjamin Franklin was fighting or a fugitive. He parked his enormously well fed bum in a place called 28 Craven Street, which is1 in London, just adjacent to Trafalgar Square. It was from here that all his writings about the American war effort emanated and while he was busy with them, he hang around with friends like England’s Prince Regent at the Hellfire Club in London. Strange for a bloke who was supposedly masterminding political freedom for colonial Americans isn’t it? Yeah, I thought so too.
So independence is won, America is a free and independent country, right? Nah, you should know me better than that by now. Before the war broke out, the 13 colonies were controlled by an entity called the Virginia Company, which was the American equivalent of the British South Africa Company of Cecil Rhodes, which controlled South Africa for decades. This Virginia Company controlled colonial government, trade, licensing and everything else. This company was a private company and its major shareholder to the tune of about 80% was whoever happened to be the reigning British monarch at the time. The rest of the shares were in the hands of whoever was in favour enough at the time to be offered them. Following the war, this Virginia Company changed its name by the corporate equivalent of deed poll. (The method by which British people can change their name if they wish.) This company changed it’s name to…………… The United States of America. Prior to the war, America had been a private territory, owned and administered by a private company. After the war, nothing had changed except the name of the company. This hasn’t'’ changed between then and now. The United States of America is a private company and the idea of it being an “independent” nation is an illusion. The real sting is that the reigning British monarch is still the 80% major shareholder in this company. No, you didn’t read that wrongly. The most powerful “nation” on the face of the planet is a privately owned company, with the Queen of England as it’s major shareholder. Now you’re not going to take this crap off some loud-mouthed limey are you? Where’s the proof and what the f*** has this got to do with 9/11? Follow me…….. (If you’re still awake.)

Not only is the USA a private company, but it’s an insolvent one. I don’t think this legal state of affairs is solely confined to the US either, but at the moment I haven’t had the time or resources to research into this with any other “country”. Here however are some things that I consider proof to support what I’ve just said.
The bankruptcy apparently occurred between the years of the Geneva Conventions of 1928-1932. However it doesn’t appear that any volume containing the bankruptcy declarations was ever published. It is however entered in the United States Congressional Record on the date of March the 17th, 1993. (If you want to look for yourself, you can find it in Volume 33, page H-1303.) James Trafficant Jr. of Ohio told the house:
“Members of Congress are official trustees presiding over the greatest reorganisation of any bankrupt entity in world history, the US Government. We are setting forth hopefully, a blueprint for the future. There are some who say it is a coroner’s report that will lead to our demise.
It is an established fact that the Untied States Federal Government has been dissolved by the emergency Banking Act, March 9,1933, 48 Stat. 1, Public Law 89-719; declared by President Roosevelt, being bankrupt and insolvent. H.J.R. 192, 73rd Congress m session June 5, 1933- Joint Resolution To Suspend The Gold Standard and Abrogate The Gold clause dissolved by the Sovereign Authority of the United States and the official capacities of all United States Governmental Offices, Officers, and departments and is further evidence that the United States Federal Government exists today in name only. “
“The receivers of the United States bankruptcy are the international bankers, via the United Nations, the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund. All Untied States Offices, Officials, and departments are now operating within a de facto status in name only under Emergency War Powers. With the Constitutional Republican form of Government now dissolved, the receivers of the bankruptcy have adopted a new form of government for the United States. This new form of government is known as a Democracy, being an established Socialist/Communist order under a new governor for America. This act was instituted and established by transferring and/or placing the Office of the Secretary of Treasury to that of the Governor of the International Monetary Fund. Public Law 94-564, page 8, section H.R. 13955 reads in part; ‘The US Secretary of Treasury receives no compensation for representing the United states’……. (blah blah blah)”
….. “Why are 90% of Americans mortgaged to the hilt and have little or no assets after all debts and liabilities have been paid? Why does it feel like you are working harder and harder and getting less and less? We are reaping what has been sown, and the results of our harvest is a painful bankruptcy, and a foreclosure on American property,precious liberties and a way of life. Few of our elected representatives in Washington DC have dared to tell the truth. The federal United States is bankrupt. Our children will inherit this un-payable debt, and the tyranny to enforce paying it”.

James Trafficant was later imprisoned for alleged bribery and corruption. The Us corporation was created behind the screen of “Federal Government” when after the manufactured victory in the war of independence, the Britsh governments unknowingly exchanged overt control from London, for the 200% more effective covert control that has governed it ever since. What happened in efect, was that The Virginia Company, the company that controlled the 13 colonies and was owned by the British crown, changed it’s name to the United States and other related pseudonyms. Today, these include the United States, US, USA, United States of America, Washington DC, District of Columbia, Federal Government and “Feds”. The United States Corporation is based in the District of Columbia (a highly significant name if you go back into the Babylonian origins of the Illuminati) and the current CEO is George W. Bush. He is not the President of the people or the country as you are led to believe that’s smoke and mirrors. This means that Bush launched project TWAT ( thanks Chimp J ) on behalf of the private corporation to further the goals of the corporation, nothing more. It had nothing to do with “America” or “Americans” because these are very different legal entities. It is the United States Corporation that owns the US military and everything else that comes under the term of “Federal”. This includes the Federal Reserve which is not, as most Americans believe a government owned central bank, but a cartel of privately owned banks. The major stock controllers and shareholders of the FR are not even American for smeg’s sake! The FR was artificially created in 1913 and is the sole dictator of the US interest rate, which has a colossal knock-on effect with the rest of the world’s finances. As the saying goes, “when America sneezes, the rest of the world catches cold”. The current head of the Federal Reserve is one Alan Greenspan who is a member of guess what?…… The Bilderberg Group, Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission. Somebody tell me why this news doesn’t come as a shock? Greenspan’s predecessor was Paul W. Volker of……… the Bilderberg Group, Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission. Catch me before I keel over someone! All of the above can be double-checked by someone with an ounce of legal noggin, you don’t have to take my word for it. If you live near enough to DC, then take yourself into the Library of Congress. Failing that, hire a lawyer or navigate their web-site. But whatever you do, don’t take this lying down! Find out about it, question public figures about it! DO NOT let these conning bastards walk all over your freedom!
Here’s more proof of covert control from outside the US, before we get on to the anomalies of 9/11.
The US Corporation is the “holding company” if you will; which makes the 50 states its legal subsidiaries. This means that each individual state also declared bankruptcy, or had it done for them by the holding company. But the people of America were never publicly told this, were they? Other details that they weren’t/aren’t told is that when you register in any way, shape or form with the “Federal Government” by accepting a Social Security number, driving license, or any other official federal document, you are unknowingly agreeing to become a legal asset-employee of the US Corporation. From that moment on you become legally responsible for financing the corporation’s state of bankruptcy. When you pay a tax, court fine or parking ticket you are servicing the bankruptcy by sending that money to “government agencies” that are nothing more than debt-collectors for the creditor banks. The US court system operates officially under corporate law or the Uniform Commercial Code. Another name for this law is……… British Maritime (military) Law! Whenever you go into a US courtroom you will see gold fringes around the courtroom’s flags. You will also see the same in government building and federally funded schools. This isn’t just for decorative purposes; it’s a legally binding symbol that the court is sitting under British Maritime Law and the Uniform Commercial Code. (Military and merchant law, not common or constitutional law.) Under the Admiralty Law Of Flags the flag so displayed gives notice of the law under which the ship (or in this case, the court) is regulated. Anyone who enters that ship (court) accepts by doing so, that they are submitting to that law indicated by the flag. Judges refuse to replace the flag with one without a fringe when asked to do so by people who know the rules, because that legally changes the status under which the court is sitting. If you appear in a court with a flag fringed with gold, your constitutional rights are automatically and legally suspended and you are being tried under British Maritime Law. All of this shite was approved by the American Bar Association, which is legally a franchise or a subordinate branch of the British legal system and it’s hierarchy, based from Temple Bar in the City of London. (The square mile, not the Metropolitan area.) If the armchair legal-eagle in you is wondering just how the hell a court on land could be controlled by maritime law, then have a look at US Code, Title 18 B 7. It says that Admiralty Jurisdiction is applicable in the following locations. 1/ The high seas. 2/ Any American Ship. 3/ Any lands reserved or required for the use of the United States, and under the exclusive or concurrent jurisdiction thereof, or any place purchased or otherwise acquired by the United States by consent of the legislature of the state. In layman’s terms, mainland America. All of this is founded on law that originated in the Holy Roman Empire, because the “Illuminati” have been scamming things like this for centuries, wherever they have based themselves.
People who realise this and ask their courts for the name of the true creditor or recipients of the fines imposed by the “legal system” are ALWAYS refused this information by the judge. The reason for that is as heartbreaking as it is simple. The recipients are the creditor banks to which the US Corporation went bankrupt. It is because of this that more and more people in the US are refusing to register with the “Federal Government” in any way as news of this state of affairs circulated to wider and wider audiences. If the authorities were capable of keeping this secret of the Corporation since 1789 and the secret of the bankruptcy since the 1930’s, then you can appreciate just why they would be so confident about deceiving you about the mass of lies behind the official explanation of 9/11.

This is a problem. A large problem. In fact if you’ve got a moment, it’s a 12 storey problem, with a magnificent entrance hall, 24 hour porterage and a large neon sign on the roof saying “THIS IS A LARGE PROBLEM!!!” There are two positive ways I can see out of it. 1/ We can look for a solution within the existing framework. 2/ (Far more effective in my opinion) we remove the cause. I’ve gone into detail about that before, so please no-one bother saying that I’m suggesting we go for armed revolution or an uprising. The means are just as important as the ends, so anyone who tries to change something with a gun or violence is a simple-minded goit, who can’t see that they’d replace the old with a mirror image. I hear a lot of people say that the 2nd amendment is vital, because it’s “the way” to stop any government from taking too many liberties with them and that the government wouldn’t stoop to wiping out such people with special forces because the people of America wouldn’t stand for it. Oh really? And what do you think the white reaction would have been if the movement under Martin Luther King had decided they were going to use guns to stop the liberties the government were taking with them? The National Guard would have mown them down in their thousands and the public would have reluctantly applauded the government for acting. Luckily, Martin Luther King was a very intelligent man who knew that unarmed action was far more decisive and had longer lasting and further reaching results. A similarly motivated movement is the only way to make the “Illuminati” crumble away. No violence, no criminal acts, no undermining law and order and overthrowing the “oppressors”. Such action is dangerous and badly thought out. The most vital thing we have to do to address our problems is to stop allowing the Illuminati to divide us into different camps and faction of black/white, Christian/Jew/Muslim/Hindu/Buddhist, right wing/left wing etc. For God’s sake let’s stop fighting amongst ourselves in a global, arrogant bid for tribal superiority we will continue to be divided and therefore, ruled. And we’ll be ruled in a global version of Nazi Germany/Communist Russia. It doesn’t matter what your religion, race, creed or nationality is. So long as you stop trying to impose your beliefs forcibly on anyone else, it’s okay. God, wouldn’t the world be boring if we were all the same? But for everyone to be free, we ALL have to be free. Free to choose or not to choose. The murder of a child in Afghanistan or Iraq is no more or less important than the murder of a child in America or England and we have GOT to start seeing that. The power of the pyramid is at the bottom, not the top and those that seek to manipulate are only up there because we’re holding them up, by giving our minds away and allowing ourselves to be manipulated. But what we fight, we turn into and it’s vital that we don’t fight against the Illuminati agenda. We have to just walk away from it and cease to co-operate. Peaceful, united non-co-operation with the system of fascist/communist global control, is the only way we can dissolve it and actually live in the world we thought we did. Don’t fight the pyramids of control walk away from them and watch them collapse like a house of cards once we stop holding them together. Okay, now that’s over with….let’s move onto the Bush family, because they and their relatives (including the British royal family) are behind the biggest scams that have hit us. I’m going to post this now and then start a new post about the Bush’s and that will run naturally into the events of 9/11.
 
you conspiracy theorist you,lol,no doubt the "disagreeing is treason" brigade will rip it to bits but some very valid points that i can see mate....nice to know there`s still a few of us left that can see through the politician/corporation/vested interest bullshit!!.... 😉
 
t s s said:
you conspiracy theorist you,lol,no doubt the "disagreeing is treason" brigade will rip it to bits but some very valid points that i can see mate....nice to know there`s still a few of us left that can see through the politician/corporation/vested interest bullshit!!.... 😉

Disagreeing with it is one thing mucker, but I'd like to see someone disprove it. All that stuff from the floor of Congress is established, but little circulated fact. Thanks for replying! 🙂
 
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I read the first half, and sorta raced through the second half.
While reading the first half I was sitting here happier than a pig wallowing in shit.
While racing through the second half I was sitting here happier than a pig wallowing in shit.
I have no need for someone telling me I only think I'm happy, but I'm not really happy and there might be a 'better way' out there that would make me happier and make me know that I'm happier than I was before...knowing how fucked up history is and how it could have been handled diferently.

Maybe I missed something in the second half.

I'm still happy as a pig wallowing in shit and I like the shit that I'm wallowing in.

What do you suppose I'm doing wrong ??
 
TKpervert said:
I read the first half, and sorta raced through the second half.
While reading the first half I was sitting here happier than a pig wallowing in shit.
While racing through the second half I was sitting here happier than a pig wallowing in shit.
I have no need for someone telling me I only think I'm happy, but I'm not really happy and there might be a 'better way' out there that would make me happier and make me know that I'm happier than I was before...knowing how fucked up history is and how it could have been handled diferently.

Maybe I missed something in the second half.

I'm still happy as a pig wallowing in shit and I like the shit that I'm wallowing in.

What do you suppose I'm doing wrong ??



LOL Good point. Sort of along the lines of "ignorance is bliss". But wait till you read my second part before you decide if you're happy or not. If you're anything like anyone else I've told about this, you'll be sick with anger.
 
BigJim said:


LOL Good point. Sort of along the lines of "ignorance is bliss". But wait till you read my second part before you decide if you're happy or not. If you're anything like anyone else I've told about this, you'll be sick with anger.

OK big fella, I'll give it a shot. Quite a piece you produced there.

Yep I'm ignorant and I enjoy being ignorant.

Keeps me happy.
bonk.gif
 
TKpervert said:


OK big fella, I'll give it a shot. Quite a piece you produced there.

Yep I'm ignorant and I enjoy being ignorant.

Keeps me happy.
bonk.gif






LMAO!!!! Oh man, gotta love that smiley.

As for enjoying being ignorant, well if a hurricane was coming, it would frighten the shits out of you. If you turned away and buried your head in the ground, you would'nt have to face it and would'nt be afraid of it, because you could convince yourself that nothing was coming. Then of course the hurricane would arrive and rip your life to pieces, as it did for close to 3000 people on September 11th, 2001. Knowing that the official explanation for it has more holes than the Arsenal defence, I'd like to look that hurricane in the eye, so I could plan to deal with it. But hey, that's just me. No-one's obliged to have the same opinion.
 
Very interesting Jim! I didn’t know most of these facts, but I actually came across some of them when (a long time ago)doing a little research on the background of – SCIENTOLOGY!! Striking coincidence, isn’t it?

While I have neither the means nor the ability to either verify or contradict your theory, let me ask you a few questions for better understanding, and a little thought-provoking as well:

If I’m understanding you correctly, you think that this concept goes back very far into history. How far? How would you explain realms like the ancient Chinese or Japanese Empires? They are certainly not related to any European nobility, and they existed into the 20th century. Other historic events come into my mind: Genghis Khan, the original Roman Empire and its end during the Great Tribal Migrations, Cultures as different as the Chinese, the Egyptians, the Inca or Maya cultures. How do they fit in your theory?

And quite certainly your theory doesn’t fit for Hinduism, Buddhism, or all the animistic religions all over the world. They existed before they had any contact with each other, not to speak of European connections. They go back to a time when the peoples lived in small clans or large families, much further than any written history. This would only be viable if you adopted the theory of extra-terrestrians who genetically engineered the whole human race…

I guess most historians would say that those observations describe nothing but the natural course of history, based on the genetic and evolutionary character of mankind. Wherever there is power, there are people who have it and those who don’t have any, that’s the very principle of power. And there are people who use or abuse power for their personal advantage.

More religious persons could see this whole concept as Divine Providence, or as the clear sign of Divine Intervention, or simply fate (Karma, Kismet). Socialists would certainly say that Karl Marx saw through this giant con-scheme, that’s what his Historical Materialism says, and that’s why Lenin started the October Revolution.

My own personal opinion: I think that there is actually some kind of your “Illuminati” behind each and every power structure and political entity, but they are not necessarily interconnected; they can and do exist independently. I tend towards the ‘historical’ explanation: it’s all inherent in the human nature.

But I actually wouldn’t rule out the mere possibility of your ideas. I’ve seen and experienced too much in my life to think that only the plausible or the most probable is possible. Quite often, the least probable ideas are working best, as science has doubtlessly proved.

I’m looking forward to the continuation of your theories!
 
All I can say is WOW

These sort of theories are not new to me; a much beloved history teacher I once had( who was fired for his viewpoints, which were radical to say the least ,in our small narrow minded NJ town_ ) used to make many of the same points and inferences, wanting his students to actually THINK and discover instead of blindly preserving the status quo, following like "sheeple".
He was one of the first to help me to open my eyes to the non perfection and subjectivity of American history, and I thank him for it! (sure you are not related to a Boston-born Us history teacher who taught school in New Jersey,Jim?! LOL)
As to the post, I for one have often suspected that there was more than met the eye in so many of these outbreks of violence, disaster and discontent,like someone was DELIBERATELY trying to keep the "great unwashed" occupied with disease, war, famine , and keep them easy to control. And the more I listen to the news, the more sense it makes. I also like youe closing statements regardiong prejudice and standing together!
Wonderful thought provoking post Jim... makes me want to find out more AND to read your next posts on this subject!
Maggie( who is hoping HER post made sense as it is 2 am and she has been hitting the books all day)
 
Big Ballsy Jim! I've been discussing much of this with my tribe, prior to 9/11!

I'm poor at remembering names but I get the jist of things...

Freemasons and the Scotts-Some guy over hear recently wrote a book about how the great Scottsmen of early America influenced the way of life prior to the revolution.

The New World Order-New name,same brand of cornflakes.

Oklahoma-Some experts claim it was a series of explosions from the inside. Actual news footage has accounts of a mid-eastern looking fellow climbing out of the 'truck'. Later forgotten, of course.

Eli Whitney 'invented' the cotton gin'(I'll have a double!) JUST KIDDING!!! Actually...

Eli Lilly former board members-Bush and Bush (Don't know about future candidate Jeb,anyhow, He's still busy losing children down here in Florida.) Oh and Dan Quale's daddy was on the board too. Yes, it was a relief to know where Quales hail. Fast foward...

Currently two or three big wigs from Eli Lilly belong to Dubbya's
staff. By no coincidence ,Lilly is fighting to have a 'certain bill' relieve them of the responsibilty for poisoning and killing many americans by way of bad vaccines!!! You know , the kind laced with thimerisol ( mercury ), and phamaldihyde(for freshness!yum!).

Now let me be fair. There are other drug companies that did it too.
Lilly is merely the lion's share. It is sad that almost every american under forty to forty five years of age has this crap a'swimmin' in their veins.

It is linked to Autism. In fact the latest news is how there are alot of siblings with autism popping up. That's right,no more sibling rivalries- all the kids get a fair shake!

My friend's LOST their daughter but gained a QUEST...

www.CasiQuest.org

I apologize for not mentioning it sooner. I'm busy with my own private idahell...

I jump around alot,exuse me...How many of you have experienced seeing your baby vaccinated within 48 hours of birth like mine was? Yes, I know. For instance ,Hepatitus, which by the way a new born can only contract if the mother has it! FACT,JACK!

Insert SAM KINISON'S SCREAM here!!!


What was that big bill a few years ago, Big Jim? The one that says the government can force vaccines on americans during a outbreak. It includes new vaccines not yet developed of course.

SARS SHE BLOWS!!! ARRR!!!

But seriously...it reminds me of an old tribal legend...Once apon a time their were these native americans...as time passed, they encountered some mean spirited Spainiards,led by a red nosed goomba!
(I'm a goomba, so forgetaboutit.)Anyway,the Conquestadors had many ways to bludgeon the locals but, the deadliest by far,was when they coughed or sneezed apon the natives...

TACT
 
Haltickling said:
If I’m understanding you correctly, you think that this concept goes back very far into history. How far? How would you explain realms like the ancient Chinese or Japanese Empires? They are certainly not related to any European nobility, and they existed into the 20th century. Other historic events come into my mind: Genghis Khan, the original Roman Empire and its end during the Great Tribal Migrations, Cultures as different as the Chinese, the Egyptians, the Inca or Maya cultures. How do they fit in your theory?

Okay, this is going to run to some to answer, but answer I shall. "Civillisation" supposedly erupted into the world around 7000 BC in the Sumer/Babylon region of the Middle and Near East. Like many ancient civillisations, it erupted at the hight of it's sophistication and then slowly declined into extinction. From here the blueprint for "control by religion" was created. The main Babylonian deities were a mother,father, son combo, who were refered to as the Holy Trinity. These involved the father Nimrod, the mother Semiramis and the son Tammuz. Tammuz was conceived by an immaculate conception and walked on Earth as a king among men. He healed the sick and gave hopr to the desolate. His life on Earth ended when he was crucified on a tree with a lamb at his feet. His body lay in it's tomb for 3 days and when the rock at the mouth was found rolled back, his body had disappeared! Sound familiar? It should! From this start, there was a mass migration of religions from that part of the world, to all other parts. Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity and all the rest like the multi-theistic religions of ancient Egypt and Greece stemmed from it. All they did was change the names each time they invented a controlling religion in a different place.

Haltickling said:
And quite certainly your theory doesn’t fit for Hinduism, Buddhism, or all the animistic religions all over the world. They existed before they had any contact with each other, not to speak of European connections. They go back to a time when the peoples lived in small clans or large families, much further than any written history. This would only be viable if you adopted the theory of extra-terrestrians who genetically engineered the whole human race…
It fits for both of the above and all the others you could name. Hal, have you read any of my marathon posts about the origin of religions from all over the world, and how they warped and twisted spirituality for the purpose of controlling the people? I don't think you have, or at least you've forgotten them, because I answered those questions in those posts. If you've not read them, then you really need to, because an understanding of the worldwide religious con is fundemental to understanding the things I've outlined in this thread's original post. And just out of interest, why would an extra-terrestrial orign for mankind be necessary for this to work? Anyway....... I will copy and paste a large paper I wrote on another thread to save any having to go to the thread which was called "The Big Politics/Religion Thread". My big paper was at the top of page two.
Big Jim's explanation of religion, obtained through much blood, sweat, tears, study, research and agony. Please be gentle............
--------------------------------------------------------------------


Okay, here it is. I copied and pasted a few posts I made on a Spirituality forum, elswhere on the net. There is a total of about 6 hours writing here. --------------------




Okay, who am I talking about here? His father was the king of the spirit world/heaven. He was the only begotten son of the chief deity. He was born of a virgin as a result of an immaculate conception. He was born on earth on December 25th and walked among men as a great king. He was a threat to the established order of the time. He was brutally murdered, laid dead in his tomb for 3 days and then came back to life. He reapeared to his followers and then ascended to rule the heavens at the side of his holy father.

Sounds like a simple question I'm sure. I'm even more sure that every one of you would answer that I was talking about Jesus Christ. However, you would'nt be correct. All of the above have been attributed to an almost endless string of deities, of whom Jesus Christ is only one of the most recent. A few years ago, the Archbishop of Canterbury objected to having a Christmas tree in the cathedral because it was a pagan symbol. What makes that so funny is that the whole of the Christian religion is pagan! And not just christianity either. Islam, Hinduism, Bhuddism, Judaism and just about every pre-christianity multi-theistic religion are all exactly the same. They all tell exactly the same story about exactly the same characters. The only difference is the names they give them. Now you might think that would be a perfect corroberation of official religious history, but again you would'nt be right. For millenia now, religion has been nothing (according to what I've studied) but a forcible hi-jacking of human spirituality; for the purpose of controlling masses of people by fear and guilt. The figures you'd read about in just about any religious story are at the very best, loosely based on real people. Often they are flat out fictional and nothing more. What is even worse is that a slightly different version of events has been peddled to different peoples, with the express intention of making sure they hate anyone else who doesn't share their own desperatley limited vision.

To understand where the blueprint for control by religion came from, you have have to look very closely at the oldest pagan religions, of ancient civilisations. The main focus for these was the sun. Whether it was Apollo, Ammon-Ra, Helios, Sol Invictus or whoever, the sun god was always highly venerated because the sun was so important. There were two reasons for this. Firstly it was because of the obvious dependancy of civilisation upon the sun. It provided warmth and light; was directly responsible for how good the harvest would be. In all these ancient civilisations you had a trinity. A chief god, a female and a son figure, who walked amongst mortal men. In ancient Babylon these three were called Nimrod, Semiramis and their son, Tammuz. Tammuz was a "great king amongst men". He was murdered in his 30's by being hung on a tree with a lamb at his feet. They laid his corpse in a tomb and 3 days later the tomb was found open, with the body gone! I've definatley heard that somewhere before...........

And the thing is, that this supposedly happened five to six thousand years BC!!!!!! As time passed there was the same theme in Egypt. There the trinity was Osiris, Isis and Horus. Osiris had an evil broher rebel against him in heaven (called Set or Seth) who murdered him. His sister Isis miraculously conceived a son by him, ressurected him and then bore the infant called Horus. This Horus chap was called a saviour, ruled amongst men, cast down the evil Set and restored his father's kingdom on earth. Horus also had 12 followers and was refered to as "the Kryst". Everything that dated from Babylon and Sumer from about 6,000-7,500 BC miraculously transported itself across to Egypt for the Pharohonic period. The legends were identical, butthe names had changed. On a completely different landmass in Central America, you had an identical situation with Queztalcoatl and Tezcatlipoca. But there's more............

In Phrygia there was born a "Son of the gods" called Attis. He was born on December the 25th to a virgin mother. He was refered to as "the Saviour of men, the only begotten Son" and he died to save humanity. He was "crucified" on a Friday and his blood was spilled to redeem the earth. He suffered "death with nails and stakes". He was the Father and Son combined in a human body. He was laid to rest, went down into the underworld, but three days later on the equivalent of March 25th, his body was found missing. Later on, he was found walking about again. His body was symbolised as bread, which was eaten by his followers as a sign of taking him into themselves.

In India there was a godling called Krishna. He was born to a virgin mother on December 25th. His father was a carpenter. A star hovered over his birthplace and there were shepherds and angels of heaven there. The local ruler slaughtered thousands of infants to try to eradicate him, buthe somehow survived. He performed miracles, healed lepers, the sick, the lame and the blind. He died in his 30's, crucified on a tree or post. His close followers refered to him as "Jezeus" or "Jeseus" which translates as "pure essence". It is said in the writing of the Vedas that he will return on a white horse to judge the dead and fight the "Prince of Evil".

Then in Greece there was Dionysus/Bacchus. He was born to a virgin mother on December 25th; put in a manger and covered in swaddling. He was a teacher who travelled throughout the land performing miracles and healing. He turned water into wine. He rode into town on the back of an ass. (As did Seth from Egypt, funnily enough.) His monikers included the ram or lamb, God of the Vine, God of Gods and King of Kings, Only Begotten Son, bearer of sins, the Redeemer, the Anointed One (translated from the word "Christos") and the Alpha and the Omega. He was hung and crucified on a tree, but rose from the dead on March the 25th. He was worshipped in Jerusalem during the first century BC. A book called Antiquity Unveiled by J.M. Roberts says that "IES, the Phoenician name for Bacchus, offers the origin to Jesus." This chap reckonsthat IES can be broken up into I (meaning "the One") and ES. (Meaning fire and light.) When these two fragments are amalgamated then, it becomes IES which means "the one light". He then says, "This is none other than the light of St. John's Gospel; and this name is to be found everywhere on christian altars, both protestant and catholic,thus clearly showing that the Christian religion is but a modification of Oriental sun worship, attributed to Zoroaster. The Christians read the same letters "IHS" in the Greek text as "Jes" and the Roman Catholic priesthood added the terminus "us". "

And again, it doesn't finish there. Here is a slightly more complete list of deities and demi-deities, all of whom had similar or identical lives to "Jesus", or were involved in legends around the figure. Apollo, Hercules and Zeus of Greece; Adad and Marduk of Assyria; Buddha Sakia and Indra of India and Tibet; Salivahana of southern India and Bermuda; Osiris and Horus of Egypt; Balder and Frey of Scandinavia; Crie of Chaldea; Zoroaster of Persia; Baal (also known as Bel or Bil) and Taut of Phoenicia; Bali of Afghanistan; Jao of Nepal; Wittoba of Bilingonese; Xamolxis of Thrace; Zoar of the Bonzes; Chu Chulainn of Ireland; Deva Tat, Codom and Sammonocadam of Siam; Alcides of Thebes; Mikado of the Sintoos; Beddru of Japan; Hesus or Eros and Bremrillaham of the Druids; Thor, son of Odin of the Gauls; Cadmus of Greece; Hil and Feta of Mandaites; Gentaut and Quetzalcoatl of Mexico and Central America; Universal Monarch of the Sibyls; Ischy of Formosa; Divine Teacher of Plato; Holy One of Xaca; Fohi, Ieo, Lao-Kium, Chiang-Ti and Tien of China; Ixion and Quirnus of Rome; Prometheus of the Caucasus region; Mohammed or Mahomet of Arabia (only true Prophet, rather than Son); Dahzbog of the Slavs; Jupiter, Jove and Quirinus of Rome; Mithra of India, Persia and Rome.

The worship of the god Mithra pre-dates Christianity by literally millenia, but yet again tells the story that would later become Christianity in acute detail. It is even said that gold, frankincense and myrhh were offered as gifts to him. By the time that the character of Jesus was literally invented, the worship of Mithra and his rites were widespread throughou the Roman Empire. When they founded Christianity in Rome, they used the very symbols and rituals that had been the Mythric myth. Mithra's holy day of the week was Sun-day, because like Jesus he wasn't a real person, but a symbol that represents the sun. Mitra's followers called this "the Lord's day" and they celebrated their main religious feast on what is now Easter in our calender. Mithric initiations were held in a cave adorned with the signs of Capricorn and Cancer, being symbols of the winter and summer solstices. He was portrayed as a winged lion (a solar symbol or depiction in a lot of lands) standing within the coils of a spiralling serpent. The lion and serpent are and have been major symbols of power, religion and royalty all across the world, throughout the ages that humans have existed. The Roman church absorbed the Mithra Eucharist into it's rituals and supplanted the whole religion in that region. Mithra was also recorded as saying......"He who shall not eat of my body nor drink of my blood, so that he may be one with me and I with him, shall not be saved." Now that rings a very loud bell to me. The very site that the Vatican stands on was a massive site of Mithra worship. In a way it still is; they just re-named him Jesus.

So Mithra was a symbol for the sun and so was his christian counterpar, Jesus. (The light of the world.) Jesus walks on water. (So does the sun's reflection if you want to get picky. lol) Jesus started his Father's work in the temple at the age of 12 and started his main ministry at 30. (The sun reaches it's daily peak at 12 noon, hence Jesus was first known then, and it enters each zodiacal sign at 30 degrees, hence he starts his ministry at that age.) Jesus turned water into wine. (At the root of nature the sun does the same because it makes the vine grow.) There is soooooo much symbolism in these accounts and not least in the Bible itself; which is almost entirely pure symbolism. There are the fish, (Pisces) and the 12 disciples (sign of the zodiac) to name just two. To understand that last one, look at a picture of Da Vinci's painting "The Last Supper." We are very much talking two levels of knowledge here. In the most basic form, the people worshipped the sun because of it's effect on the crop; but the people in the know who were doing the manipulating worshipped it because they understood it's power over nature entirely. This is where we start talking about secret societies and conspiracy theories I'm afraid. Leonardo Da Vinci was very high up as an initiate of secret societies as they existed in his day, and he certainly understood what Jesus really was. When you look at that painting, you can see Jesus sitting in the centre and the 12 disciples gathered with 6 on either side of Him. Look even closer and you'll notice that the 12 disciples are gathered in 4 groups of 3 men. (They're actually huddled into these groups pretty obviously, so it isn't too hard to spot if you're looking for it.) The painting is wholly symbolic of the sun (Son) surrounded by the 12 signs of he zodiac! The reason they're gathered in 4 groups of three is because they symbolise the 4 seasons of the year, with three months in each one.

Then let's take the Pisces and fish symbolism even further. Jesus was refered to as the "fish" and the "fisher of men". Perhaps this may have been because at the time that he was alleged to have been born, the Earth was entering the sign of Pisces. Because there is so much symbolism for Jesus and all the other gods assosciated with similar tales througout history, we really can't afford to ignore any possible connection with fish-like or amphibious gods, of ancient peoples. The Nommo of the Dogon people and also the Annedoti were both like this. also, their respective worshipers claimed they came from the star we call Sirius.

And here's another part that makes a nonsense of religion. The most widely used, translated and debated version of the Bible, is the King James version. A survey by the church in the 19th century discovered that the KJB had, wait for it............NEARLY 40,000 TRANSLATION ERRORS!!!!! One of the most noticable of these errors was the translation of the word "Elohim". This was taken to be the singular "God". However the word for God was "Elo". The h-i-m part pluralises it, which means that the bible should have been refering to "the gods" instead of "God". Big difference. This makes more sense when you try to compare Christianity, Islam and Judaism which all have the same roots, with the much older, multi-theistic, pagan religions. (It also makes "the Son of God" into "the sons of the gods". Perhaps that refers to the Nephilim of the book of Genesis?) Another big-time translation error was the translation of "the end of the world". (Armagheddon.) The word for world was mistranslated from the Greek word " aeon" and refers to the end of an age, not the whole world. The "end of the age" refers to the earth astronomical/astrological progression from one sign of the zodiac to the other. We are soon to leave the age of Pisces and enter the age of Aquarius. I think this progression more or less syncs with the Mayan's prediction of the end of the age/world as they knew it in 2012. Expect big changes soon then! Perhaps this is why people are beginning to discover their spiritual abilities again, instead of living in fear and guilt?

The deeds attributed to Jesus christ are huge and momentous. Someone like him would have been a serious thorn in the side of whoever held the reigns of power at the time He lived. However, not all seems to gel on this point. Outside of the books of the New Testament, there is no record, sign or account of Jesus Christ anywhere. A brief mention in the words of a Hebrew scholar/historian called Josephus is a rather blatant and obvious attempt at the priesthood trying to cross reference their meal ticket. There are literally scores of writers, historians and philosophers who laid down the history of the Israel/Palestine area at the time Jesus is said to have lived and NOT ONE OF THEM mentions him in so much as a footnote. Philo was alive and kicking through Jesus' whole "life" and wrote extensivley about the Judeans. This covered the whole period. The man lived in or near to Jerusalem all througout the time that Jesus was born of immaculate conception, wowed the elders in the temple, performed miracles and healings,overturned he money lenders tables, drove out demons, nearly gave the local authorities multiple heart attacks, was crucified, returned to life and ascended to heaven. Quite a life. And what does Philo say about this larger than life character, who so dominated his time and place? ABSOLOUTLEY NOTHING!!!!!!! Not a jot! Nada! Naff all! Fuck all! Zilch! That's less likely than Mike Tyson turning vegetarian! It is exactly the same with all the very complete Roman records, and the work of all of Philo's prominent contempories. There is no simple answer, just a very blunt one from my perspective. These events never happened, because there was no "Jesus". The man himself is symbolic of the sun, and his deeds and miracles are symbolic of the sun's power because of it's importance in pagan religion. And the main reason that the hierarchy of these religions worshipped the sun, wasn't because of it's effect on the crop, although that is very important, obviously. It was because they understood the power of the sun's electromagnetism. After light and heat, this is the sun's most effective power on our planet. The sun is quite simply, boiling with electromagnetism. The earth itself it crisscrossed with electromagnetic meridians that were known as "ley lines" in the olden days. On top of that, every living cell on the planet is a conductor of electromagnetic energy. Now this is the power that makes that train in France levitate!!!!! Electromagnetism can do that! It can also transfer information via an electromagnetic wave through the air. Military communication do this all the time. (At least EXTREMELY important ones do.) Now if you can picture a human being who is so in tune with this process that his or her body can channel the energy in the same way that a train or transmitter does; you have scientific explanations for telekinesis and telepathy! Not myth! Not science fiction! Not hogwash! FACT! The sun vastly affects the earth's meridian grid all the time. Whenever two or more of these meridians cross each other, you get a vortex point of seriously intense energy. It's also at places like this that you'll find monuments like Stonehenge, Avebury, the Giza plateau and the temple at Ankhor Wat in south east Asia. These things were massive harnessing focuses for the earth's natural powers! So why havn't we still got them today? you might ask. We have. They're all over the world at points where energy meridians meet. And what's more they're even designed after the fashion of the old esoteric structures, because every shape has a vibration and a wavelength that affects this energy. Egypt is the most ready example to hand. The male energy was represented by an obelisk, symbolic of the penis of Osiris; which was severed by Seth's sword. The female energy was represented by a dome or bowl, symbolic of Isis's womb. Typical male/female energy representations. these symbols were the focused representations of the manipulated energy; the natural energy itself was often depicted as a river. Hence the Egyptians would often build an obelisk on one side of the Nile and a symbol of Isis on the other. Well one of the biggest "vortex points" in europe is in the British Isles, under the City of London. Now get this......near Oxford, the Thames river is refered to as "the Isis". Coincidence? Possibly. But follow it into the city and then stop when we get to the financial district. On one side of the river you have Canary Wharf, the biggest obelisk in the country and right across the river from it, (a stones throw almost exactly) you have the Millenium Dome. In the space of a few hundred square yards you have the river, the obelisk and the dome. The trinity. The father, mother and the product. Massive symbolism on a scarily modern scale. Why the hell would modern architects be following designs practiced in ancient Egypt? I would suggest the answer is because the people who designed the damn things knew perfectly what they represented. What we're talking about is knowledge on two levels, all over again! And I can feel the "I word" coming up pretty soon.

When I use the term "Illuminate" I'm not talking about any one group, or society. I'm refering to all of them as a whole. The whole upshot of this thread, is that these people knew the power of nature and the cosmos. If it's a power that gives normal, ordinary people the sort of abilities that this forum was created to promote, then it would frighten people who had created religion after religion on pure symbolism, and murdered anyone who didn't take it literally. Some of the people here are religious in the conventional sense. That's fine, I don't decry that at all. But when you get to the bare bones of any of the major religions, you see nothing but hate, murder, racism, damnation and fear. According to the Bible itself, the biggest and mosr prolific racist and biggot of them all was God Himself! It makes me damn angry to think that someone could twist Divine Spirit into such a horrible mis-representation. The people here who believe in Jesus, but promote the values of this forum, (patience, tolerance, pychic ability etc) are wonderful people, but don't fit the original mould of religion at all. It was the character called Jesus Himself who said "I come not to bring peace, but a sword!" Conventional religion was a deliberate creation. It was created to imprison humanity and disconnect it from it's infinte power and possibility. That's why so many poor sould were murdered in the name of "God". But it's ending, the stranglehold is breaking. The people who use this forum are the proof of that. Humanity as a whole can hear the ticking of some cosmic, spiritual alarm clock, that is waking them up. I think personally that is why so many people who think of themselves as christians (including me about 3 years ago) do not fit the description at all.

Before I sign off from this mammoth thread, here is one more point about Jesus the Son/sun of God/the gods that I would like to make. As is widely accepted, the sun was the focus of ancient religion and as I've said I believe, Jesus is symbolic of it; not a factual person. Well one of the biggest holy days of any pagan calender was the winter solstice. It was the holiest because it was the end of one solar year nd the start of the next. On December 21st-22nd the sun had reached it's nadir in the northern hemisphere. (Where most ancient civillisations were located.) The ancients said it had "died". By even the most rudimentary of observations/calculations it had begun it's journey back to life and it's full summer strength, by the time 3 days had passed. The pagan/ancients would then have a massive celebration of the sun's rebirth on their calender's equivalent of December the 25th. So let's re-cap...........
1/ The sun/Son dies.........
2/ It spends three days dead or in the underworld.......
3/ It then is re-born/born anew........
4/ And the sun's birthday would then have been on.........DECEMBER 25TH!!!!

That is why symbolic deity after symbolic deity was born on that date; in civilisation after civilisation; millenium after millenium. That is why christianity took all the festival dates from the pagan calender and that is why the Archbishop of Canterbury dropped a clanger when he said Christmas trees were pagan. Christianity IS pagan!

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The Bible alleges that St. Peter (the "Rock" as he is sometimes known) was the first ever Pontiff (Pope) and thus founded Christianity as more than just as side-sect of Judaism. This would have made it a religion in it's own right. However, given the compelling evidence of most biblical characters being fictional (One Babylonian myth tells the story of a chap called Sargon, who was found by a princess, floating in a woven basket on the river: he was subsequntly adopted by the royal familly!!! Scary eh?) I believe I do know who really created Christianity. This particular religion was largely written by the Levite preisthood, with large chunks of the gospels being written by the Piso familly. But there's more to come; as you mentioned one of the alleged deeds of one disciple, I'll go into several personal biographies of these and other, related characters. Before I do though, there's one thing I forgot to mention in the previous lengthy post. The main holy symbol of christianity is the cross. This is because Jesus was crucified on one, according to the gospels. I would however suggest a different reason. As I've already said, Jesus was, in my opinion, the latest in a long line of solar-related deities, who were symbolic of the power of the solar globe. So if you look at a depiction of the solar system, you'll see that each body in it, has a symbol. Earth is a circle with a dot, Neptune is represented by the trident with a slightly crooked stem. The sun is represented by another circle, overlaid with the symbol of....... A CROSS!!!!!! On top of this, look at any depiction, painting or statue of a holy figure. Nine times out of ten, they're depicted with a halo around their heads. However, Good the Father and Jesus the Son/sun both have a certain "uniqueness about their haloes. They are both decorated with......... A CROSS!!!! Now God the Father has nothing to do with the symbol. It's His son who is, because of the crucifiction tale. Yet both are shown with a (solar) cross in their haloes. I would suggest that is because of the sun symbolism in religion. It would also be worth mentioning that many cultures from the Babylonians, to the Phoenetians and the Sumerians depicted the sun as being symbolised by a cross. More than just a coincidence I would suggest. I would say that is the reason the cross features in the crucifiction story. Not because a man called Jesus was really nailed to one; but because of the solar sign in religion. On top of which, something else smells a bit funny about the crucifiction story. Jesus was crucified between two thieves, who were also crucified. This could NOT have happened, because crucifiction wasn't the Roman punishment for thievery. There were lawd alone knows how many different methods of execution in the Roman Empire, but crucifiction and larceny did NOT mix. Anyway, on to specific figures from the gospels.......


Mary(s): Mary is a very ancient name for the goddess who gives birth via a miracle to the saviour Sun God. There are several variants in different languages and cultures. Among them are Mari, Meri, Marratu, Marah and Mariham. In one aspect these names refer to the sea, ("mare" in the latin root) known as Mer or Mar and "Mary" itself refers to the feminine energy. This was often depicted as a goddess from the sea or waters, the moon or something else. The idea was that the feminine balanced the masculine power of the sun. But they also relate to the Dragon queens of Sumer, Babylon etc. Isis, the Egyptian moon goddess and virgin mother to Horus, was also known as Mother Mary or "Mata Meri" in the original. She was also called "The Queen of Heaven", "Our Lady" and "Mother of God". The goddess El in the Edda texts was also called Mary from time to time. The ancient Hebrews worshipped a god/goddess character called Mari-El, or "Mary-God/god". The "Mother Mary" of Christianity is just another regurgitated figure who was known as El, Isis, Barati,Ishtar, Brittania, Artemis, Semiramis and Diana. The Christian religon like it's bed-mate Judaism, sought to remove the feminine principle from the public domain, which caused the tried and tested trinity of father-mother-son to breplaced by father-son-holy ghost. An utterly grotesque suppression of women would follow, justified by the invented words of a mythical St. Paul. "Wives submit to your husbands for the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ is the head of the Church. Now if the church submits to Christ so should wives submit to their husbands in everything." This is also joined by, "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." Nice guy. I can imagine him and Germaine Greer having some very friendly chats over a cup of tea. Such words were written in truth, by the initiated priesthood to drip-feed suppression of the female into any culture that it was present in. What is even worse, is that this sexist attitude can still be seen today. Ann Widdicombe is one very messed up woman, who is a member of the government. When the CoE decided to allow women vicars, she left and joined the Roman Catholic Church! And this is the sort of person who claims to be intelligent enough enough to be a part of running our country? Excuse me, I need a bucket. The people in the know (the "Illuminate" if you will) set out to systematically remove the feminine principle from society. When you bear in mind that it's this energy that lets us (even men) connect with our higher levels of being and our true spirituality, it becomes understandable. Unrestrained male energy is overwhelmingly present in the physical world and without the feminine to balance it, it becomes isolated from it's deeper levels of being. Someone being described as a "Macho Man" is typical of this. But behind the scenes, there has been covert worship of this for many a long year. Symbolised in Freemasonry as Isis or the Dragon queens, because the people in the know, really do know the true power of the female energy. Mary Magdelene is another good example. This Mary was a reformed prostitute and is another classic example of goddess symbolism. She is alo portrayed as the Great ***** of Babylon. (Or Mari-Anna-Ishtar) A ritual involving a "Sacred Harlot" or high priestess annointing a saviour-king-godling goes back to Sumer and Babylon. If you believe in Atlantis and Lemuria, then symbolism of it is found there too. It was a pagan priestess who pronounced the ressurection of Osiris, Attis, Dionysius and Orpheus, just as Mary Magdelene would go on to be the first person to see (and hug, so he was again depicted as being solid and not spirit) the ressurected Jesus Christ. It's all symbolism from the ancient multi-theistic religions and it was used to create a mythical hero and heroine for a manufactured prison-religion.
The Three Wise Men & The Bright Star: I'm sure that even the non-christians amongst us will know this one. The Bible tells of a bright star marking the place of Christ's birth. Exactly the same story was told in ancient Egypt, using the star Sirius. (Which is the brightest star we can see from Earth, from any place, at any time of the year.) Ancient Egyptian religious texts say that when the highly significant constellation of Orion (for them in particular) appeared above the horizon, it presaged the arrival of Sothis or Sirius; the star of Horus and Osiris. (Also assosciated with Isis in Freemasonry, who refer to it as "The Silver Star".) Further symbolism of the "three wise men" is that the Magi were sun worshippers. Gold, frankincense and myrhh were the traditional gifts by Arabian Magi to the Sun and that's why you have 3 wise men giving these gifts to Mithra and Jesus in different versions of the same myth. The birth of Jesus in a cave (and indeed being laid to rest in one) is one that is repeated through many if not all, of the solar religion myths. The cave represents the "dark place" where the sun goes between the winter solstice and the night of December 24th. This is also symbolic of Jesus going down to the underworld when his physical body was lying in the tomb for 3 days. That's where the whole story comes from.
Being Tempted In The Wilderness For 40 Days: This is a VERY common theme for solar gods. A researcher called Albert Churchwood writes that the Egyptians guess-timated it took 40 days after grain was "sown" before it appeared through the soil. This would be a period of fasting and scarcity. So Jesus is depicted as fasting in the wilderness and "Satan" challenges him to turn stones into bread. The batt;es between the light and the darkness and also when Jesus defeated the darkness is symbollic of the time in the sun's cycle when there is more darkness each day than there is daytime. The 40 years the Israelites were supposed to have spent in the desert is more grain symbolism turned into a manufactured and allegedly "historical" text.
The Words Jesus Spoke: They weren't in any way original for a start. They were repeated from a whole line of similar solar deities. Horus delivered a Sermon on the Mount in Egyptian myth and the version with Jesus in is just an updated version with the same sayings. Some of them even come from earlier texts IN THE SAME BOOK! The books of Enoch for example. Change parts of them into a narrative and you've got the gospels to a tee.
The Crucifiction: Many of these mythical solar deities were crucified to save the sins of the people. It is a very old ritual, predating Christianity by millenia. Jesus on the cross represents the sun at the spring equinox in one way and the dying god, Balder, in another. The crown of thorns is symbolic of a halo, which ancient cultures have always depicted around the heads of their solar deities. (A standing stone in England with a Sumerian/Phoenician depiction of Bel/Bil on it springs to mind.) On top of this, the cross being a religious symbol, was not unique to Christianity at all. It was used thousands of years before 1 BC. Even Jesus said to his disciples "pick up thy cross and walk" before the idea of crucifiction had entered the scene at all. Indeed the idea of a religious man/godling nailed to a cross was so familiar to pagan religions that early Christians rejected the idea! The god from Central america, Quetzalcoatl, was depicted nailed to a cross many times. The cross is symbollic of the equinox when day hours and night hours are equal, and the sun is about to win it's victory over the darkness. At the moment Jesus dies, according to the Bible, the land became dark. So it would have done if the son had "died". (As it was symbollically doing.) As for the ressurectuion after three days, well we've covered that before in great detail. In Persia (long before 1 BC again) there was a ritual when a young man, apparently dead, was restored to life. He was called the Saviour andhis sufferings were said to ensure the salvation of the people. The priests would watch the tomb until midnight on the equinox, when they would cry "Rejoice, O sacred initiated! Your god is risen. His death ad suffering have worked your salvation." The same was said in Egypt of Horus and in India of Krishna. Both religions pre-date Christianity by ages. And going back to the two thieves. This is symbolism again. As I've already said thieves were'nt crucified in Rome anyway; they are probably symbolic of Sagittarius and Capricorn, which swap over at the winter solstice. Thus, the sun "dies" between them.
John The Baptist: This guy was a recreation of a dude called Anup, who baptised Horus in Egyptian legend. LIke john, Anup lost his head. Indara/Thor of royalty in Sumer was also known as "Bil-The-Baptist" on Sumerian seals and was also known as Ad or Atum baptising the infant crown prince on Egyptian sculptures. Baptism was introduced by the Sumerians, bot the Christians. It appears to have originated in the post cataclysmic era in the Phoenician/St. George area of Cappadocia. John the Baptist and his assosciation with water further cements his relationship with the water sign, Aquarius; the sun travels through there to be "baptised" according to myth. The sun enters Aquarius at 30 degrees and Jesus gets dunked by John at 30 years old. The zodiac circle of Greek fame was renamed Crown Of The Circle Of The Holy Apostles (zodiacle representations) by medieval monks and they placed John the Baptist where Aquarius is located. King Arthur and the 12 Knights of the Round Table are also sun and zodiacal symbolism, as is Horus and his 12 followers. In the Julian calendar of the Romans, John the Baptist dies on the 29th of August. In the bok Christianity Before Christ by John Jackson, he says "On that day, a specially bright star, representing the head of the constellation of Aquarius, rises while the rest of the body is below the horizon, at exactly the same time as the sun sets in Leo (the kingly star-sign, representing Herod). Thus the latter beheads John, because john is assosciated with Aquarius, and the horizon cuts off the head of Aquarius!" The reference to the "man carrying the water pitcher" in Luke's Gospel is more Aquarial symbolism, John the Baptist is an exact duplication of Bala-rama, the fore0runner of Krishna. No big suprise.

The 12 Disciples: As David Icke, that much villified and ridiculed author, says in Children Of The Matrix, "Is there a universal law that all deities must have 12 disciples or followers?" However much people laugh about the interview with Terry Wogan, that is a very pertinent question. Jesus had 12, so did Buddha, King Arthur(at any one time- there are more than 12 knights named in the legends of course), Mithra too, Dionysus and so did many other symbols of the sun. There were the 12 sons of Jacob, 12 tribes of Israel, the 12 chief gods of the Greeks, Romans, Egyptians and Persians. this fixation with 12, develops again and again from solar symbolism; with their disciples and followers representing the months of the year and the signs of the zodiac. Indeed, the Romans openly symbolised the sun as a man's face and the zodiacal signs as his followers. During summer the man's face would be pictured as long haired, representing the strong rays. During the winter, they'd be cut short. Remember the story of Samson? The bloke who was a Nazerite and was strong when his hair was long, but weak when it was short? You know what "Samson" translates into crude English as? The "son of the sun god". For Samson, read Sam-SUN. His story goes wrong when he enters the house of Delilah. this is symbolic of the house of virgo, which the sun enters as Autumn approaches in the northern hemisphere. It ends when he pushes down the twin pillars in the temple. Twin pillars are heavy Freemasonic symbols. Nearly as much so as the "all seeing eye" you can see on a USA $1 bill. Ever wondered why most of the world's economy was stretegised from the NYTC? Picture the place in your mind, (as it was before 9/11) and then back off. Notice anything about the design, that is relavent? Thought you might. Another example of sacred architechture in modern civillisation. The Canary Wharf/Thames/Milenium Dome is another one I mentioned earlier. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John after whom the gospels are named represent the four cardinal signs of the zodiac. They are also symbolised in cathedrals as a man(Aquarius), an ox (Taurus), a lion (Leo) and an eagle(Scorpio), together refered to as the four creatures of the apocalypse. In a book called Forgery In Christianity, Joseph Wheless says... "The Holy Twelve had no existence in the flesh, but their "cue" being taken from Old Testament legends,they were mere names-dramatis personae-mask of the play-of "tradition", such as Sheakspeare and all the playwrights and fiction-writers create for the actors of their plays and works of admitted fiction." In ancient versions of todays secret societies (which are known to go back at least to Egypt and probably further) the spokeperson for the god was called a PETR. (Pronounced Peter.) This translates as "rock". I can imagine the vicar choking on his tea right now. In the Egyptian "Book Of The Dead", the name of the doorkeeper of heaven is Petra. Careful vicar, you'll spill it all over the carpet.
St. Paul: This seems like a viscious circle. The only single record of the existence of anyon called St. Paul or Saul of Tarsus, is within the New Testsment. It's the same with Jesus, the same with the lot of them. (Inluding the leading lights of the Old Testament.) The Roman historian Seneca was the brother of the Achaian proconsul when "Paul" was alleged to have spokent there. But, although Seneca noted many incredibly mundane things (by comparison) he doesn't mention a smegging word about Paul's public crusade. Okay, it's quiz time again. Who am I refering to? He lived in Tarsus (a part of asia Minor) as a young boy; he travelled to Ephesus where he spoke in front og enormous crowds and performed miracles; before travelling on to Athens and Corinth. Then he went on to Rome, where he was accused of treason, before going on to what is now Spain, then Africa. He then returned to Sicily and Italy. He was then dragged off to Rome and imprisoned; a place from which he heroically escaped. Sounds just like St. Paul right? Nope. This was a story told about a Greek figure called Apollonius of Tyana. (Who oddly enough, was refered to as a "Nazarene" in some accounts.) In the latin language, his name translated into Apollus and Paulus!! Scary eh? Aslo the scary journey that Paul had by sea on the way to Rome, was a duplicate of what allegedly happened to a Jewish historian called Josephus. This story has been repeated time than The Towering Inferno.

Phew! I'm sure there's more I'll remember or dig up, as this thread progresses, but for now I'm too tired to try. It's 1 AM and I've been on this post for 3 hours. I would really like some insightful comments from other people here. If you do believe in the Bible story (even if you reject organised religion, as a lot of you do) please tell me what the flaw in my research (and the research of the authors I researched) is. Tell me why you think I'm wrong.

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The "don't question God" or the "because it's in the Bible" responses are much like the "because I said so!" response you get when you're a kid and you ask an adult a problematic or complicated question. It usually means the person saying it is too narrow-minded to think of anything intelligent to say. Either that, or there is literally NOTHING to say, because what they're defending has been demolished by logic. (Or at least what we perceive as logic.) It's a natural and very healthy human instinct to question and probe into things that we don't completely understand, and it would be deeply saddening if your experinces stopped you doing that. From the limited info you gave us, it sounds like your mother is deeply institutionalised into strict, fundemental Christianity. Now I would'nt reccomend that you deliberatley try to force your opinions down her throat, because that will only drive a wedge between the two of you. If the views that you eventually form are too contradictory to hers, then just try to avoid discussion of the subject. One of the biggest pleasures there are in life, are the bonds between us and our close familly. I'd hate to think of anyone being ostracised from either of their parents; so try to keep the waters calm. But that doesn't mean you should give your mind away and become an automaton either! You should always question yourself about what you believe and think about spirituality a lot. I think some people would believe frm reading what I wrote that I'm saying there is no such thing as spirit or spiritulism. Nothing could be further from the truth! Spiritualism is the biggest power each, individual, human being has. Connection to it, is the thing that can free any human, frmo ANY bond; spiritual or physical. I talked a lot about the power of the sun's electro-magnetism earlier; well the etheric body is PURE electro-magnetism! That's why a living human has an electro-magnetic charge and a corpse doesn't! We know that you can't destroy energy, only convert it into another expression, so where does that energy go when someone dies? Into other planes and dimensions of existence I would suggest.
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Okay 46and2, that's what I found of my previous scribblings in about 20 minutes. there might be more on other threads, but I think it would be all variations on the same theme. All the previous legends of Christ like figures in pagan religions, weren't prophecy of something to come, as Omega claimed. They are unequivocably religions set down in the distant past, when they were being worshipped. In other words, they'd already reputedly happened. I don't think there can be any evidence more damning about how we've been robbed of our spititual power, by being hounded into these prison-religions. As their hold on the people weakened, conventional "science" was brought in to replace them. This "science" doesn't explain human spitituality truly, any more than religion does. It's just another pathetically limited attempt, to rob us of what it is our free-born right to know!
 
tactillianlover said:
Big Ballsy Jim! I've been discussing much of this with my tribe, prior to 9/11!

I'm poor at remembering names but I get the jist of things...



The New World Order-New name,same brand of cornflakes.

Oklahoma-Some experts claim it was a series of explosions from the inside. Actual news footage has accounts of a mid-eastern looking fellow climbing out of the 'truck'. Later forgotten, of course.

Eli Whitney 'invented' the cotton gin'(I'll have a double!) JUST KIDDING!!! Actually...

Eli Lilly former board members-Bush and Bush (Don't know about future candidate Jeb,anyhow, He's still busy losing children down here in Florida.) Oh and Dan Quale's daddy was on the board too. Yes, it was a relief to know where Quales hail. Fast foward...

Currently two or three big wigs from Eli Lilly belong to Dubbya's
staff. By no coincidence ,Lilly is fighting to have a 'certain bill' relieve them of the responsibilty for poisoning and killing many americans by way of bad vaccines!!! You know , the kind laced with thimerisol ( mercury ), and phamaldihyde(for freshness!yum!).

Now let me be fair. There are other drug companies that did it too.
Lilly is merely the lion's share. It is sad that almost every american under forty to forty five years of age has this crap a'swimmin' in their veins.

It is linked to Autism.
I jump around alot,exuse me...How many of you have experienced seeing your baby vaccinated within 48 hours of birth like mine was? Yes, I know. For instance ,Hepatitus, which by the way a new born can only contract if the mother has it! FACT,JACK!

Insert SAM KINISON'S SCREAM here!!!


What was that big bill a few years ago, Big Jim? The one that says the government can force vaccines on americans during a outbreak. It includes new vaccines not yet developed of course.

SARS SHE BLOWS!!! ARRR!!!

But seriously...it reminds me of an old tribal legend...Once apon a time their were these native americans...as time passed, they encountered some mean spirited Spainiards,led by a red nosed goomba!
(I'm a goomba, so forgetaboutit.)Anyway,the Conquestadors had many ways to bludgeon the locals but, the deadliest by far,was when they coughed or sneezed apon the natives...

TACT




Yup, all of the above is true. The medical profession is forcing vaccination that are neither safe, nor effective (or at least effective in the way we would mean it) and threatening all kinds of shit on parents who refuse to cave in to this psychological terrorism.
Modern vaccines are the biggest cause of damaged immune systems in thw world and are also linked to bowel disease and autism, as you mentioned above. They are also the biggest cause of AIDS, through the damaging of the immune system. Shocked? You bloody well should be. But not as much as when I tell you that HIV doesn't cause AIDS. Yup, you heard that right, HIV DOES NOT CAUSE AIDS PEOPLE!!!!! The medical profession (who are supported by corrupt companies like Eli Lily and Glaxo-Welcome) contest that HIV causes AIDS by destroying T-Cells in the blood. Absoloute crap! HIV is what is known in the medical profession as a "retrovirus", which means that it is NOT cytotoxic. (It doesn't kill cells.) Even it if was cytotoxic (which it isn't and NO retrovirus is incidentally) it only infects about a hundredth of the cells needed to cause AIDS. YOU'VE BEEN HAD PEOPLE!!! And you know why? Because Eli Lily and Glaxo-Welcome enjoy peddling poisons like AZT to HIV and AIDS victims. AZT is a "wonder drug" that supposedly boosts the white cell count of the blood. Not suprising really. AZT is such a virulent poison that the body's natural reaction is to pump as many white blood cells out as possible. Of course, in the process it exhausts itself and makes the patient even iller. What they don't tell you, is that AZT was a chemotherapy drug for cancer years before, but it was so toxic it had to be withdrawn. Years later, they bring it back out the cupboard and introduce it to AIDs patients. Killing many more of them than need die from the disease in the first place.
The most telling fact of all is that a large percentage of AIDS victims don't have and have never had, the HIV virus!!!! So how can it have caused the depleted immune system? It didn't because it can't! HIV is a weak virus that like many retroviri, can exist in the human body and cause little or no illness ever!
So how does this tie in with innoculation programs causing AIDS? Well in the 1960's AIDS amongst gay men wasn't a big problem at all. Then in the early 1970's the homosexual communities of Los Angeles, Chicago, New York and San Fransisco were given mass Hepetitis B vaccinations. Two years later they were all riddled with AIDS. Why? Because the toxic, dangerous and utterly useless vaccine had destroyed the immune systems of the communities. The same is happening with our children on a lesser scale. Oh and you know that Africa has a big AIDS problem? Not suprising really when you consider that thousands upon thousands of well-meaning Red Cross and Red Crescent officials are pumping toxic vaccinations into African children and adults every day. And who benefits? The people who own the big pharmeceutical companies, not least the father of the current President, George Bush.

This is such a vitally important topic, that I'm going to make a whole new thread about it. There is so much more to be told than I can tell in this thread, because it would detract from what this thread was started for. I will present all I know about the medical profession in a new thread. Hopefully in the next week.
 
kurchatovium said:
Have any theories about Area 51?🙂

Opinions on Area 51 are like assholes. Everyone's got one. lol

Yeah I got a few opinions, but I don't have the degree of proof about them that I have with other things. On top of which, Area 51 is becoming like Roswell. A chewed-over tit-bit that detracts from new information emerging in the field, because people won't move on. I don't think there's much to be gained from talking about something that has become so foggy.

Interesting that you mention the same subject as Hal though Kurch. Maybe the subject will resurface later.
 
Haltickling said:
But I actually wouldn’t rule out the mere possibility of your ideas. I’ve seen and experienced too much in my life to think that only the plausible or the most probable is possible. Quite often, the least probable ideas are working best, as science has doubtlessly proved.


That is why the much repeated dichtom of "Occam's Razor" is so fundementally flawed Hal. The saying goes "whatever solution is the most likely, will usually be the true one".

The trouble is that "likely" has to come from the conditioned view of reality, which I think I've gone some way to proving is utterly false. It's the "likeliest" based on what you've been taught, told and indoctrinated with all your life. And yet, it's remarkable how little digging it takes to start tearing down the blinds that have clouded our vision.
 
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"Universal theory?"

Jim, you seem to be presenting a theory as a fact. While I concede that your theory might (!) apply to all the cultures which had contact with Sumer/Babylon (Jewish/Christian/Muslim, all the religions of the Middle East etc.), I’m afraid that your conclusion is invalid for most of the Asian/American/Early Europe cultures (Chinese, Incas, Celts etc.). Their cultures developed independently from what you see as the root of all civilization. A few examples:

You’re right that many of the old legends carry similarities. The Vedes and the Krishna Legend are among those. But the basic concepts of Hinduism and Buddhism are diagonally different from the other Middle East religions. In fact, the differences are much more striking than the similarities. There is no power structure for the “clerical circles” of Hinduism and Buddhism. The latter is even called the “Religion without God”, as Buddha was never seen as God. They have a completely different concept for life after death, not in the least comparable to the Babylon-based religions: constant rebirth.

The triangle as a symbol for divinity exists also in Hinduism, but its explanation is merely reflecting life itself: Brahma (creation, birth), Vishnu (conservation, life), and Shiva (destruction, death). In my eyes, this explanation is much nearer to the real roots of any religion: mere observation of nature. Buddhism sees the same as a dual principle: Yin/Yang, male/female, day/night, life/death, which also adds up to observation of nature. It’s quite interesting that Buddhism has no concept for the duality good/evil, which is one of the fundamental Jewish/Christian/Muslim principles.

Let’s leave the religious aspect for a moment. An even more important fact can be found in anthropology: The myth of one common origin of human civilization is no longer accepted by archeologists/anthropologists. Most of them still agree that the earliest traces came from Africa. One part of the population there migrated to the Middle East, another part to Northern and Central Europe. But no tracks lead to East Asia, and there were no connections between them once they had reached their farthest-possible destinations. There must have been several independent developments of the Homo Sapiens. Remember the Peking Man? A lot of archeological findings have proved that he must have existed in that area some 2 million years ago. If there were any connections, they must have happened long before the Babylonian culture erupted. Are you saying that the “Illuminati” already existed then? If so, that leads us back to the theory of Aliens.

Which brings us back to other religions and cultures beyond Mesopotamian influence: What about the tribes in the jungles of Central Africa, the Aborigines in Australia and their relatives in Papua-Niugini and Melanesia, the Ainu in Japan, the pre-Columbian cultures in North and South America. Their cultures had no connections to Mesopotamia at all. The same applies to the Northern European tribes like the Vikings and the Celts. They all had (some still have) their own religions, although some of the sagas mentioned by you may have influenced them later. Hell, there is even proof of Neanderthals burying their dead, which implies some thoughts about an afterlife. You don’t seriously believe they were guided by “Illuminati” too , do you?

No, I still think that the root of every civilization and culture is in the very nature of humans. They have a natural curiosity, an urge to explain things, so it’s no miracle or common influence that made them think about the sun and the moon, rain and draught, winter and summer, life and death. Some areas were more densely populated than others, and the people there were forced to find some social structures for co-existence. That’s where the big civilization centers emanated. Those structures demanded some control on a higher level, by fellow fallible humans who had greed, ambition, and all out other character flaws in them, as a result of their genes and the evolutionary pressure. If ever, a more intricate system like your theoretic “Illuminati” came as a result of civilization, not as its origin. In the other regions which haven’t developed great cultures, nature prevented a dense population. That’s a very viable theory, don’t you think so? And much more uncomplicated than yours.

And this is where we get to Occam’s Razor, Science, and your evaluation of it. I think you’ve misunderstood the concept by seeing only the verbal explanation. Let me rephrase it and give you a practical example: If there are several theories which all explain every single observation of the same issue, science applies Occam’s Razor to choose the least complicated explanation as a future working hypothesis, as long as no other observations are discovered that are not explained by it. Then the system gets revised. The example:

If you wish, you can still explain our planetary system as a geocentric model, at least as far as astronomy is concerned. The problem: all planets move on extremely complicated paths around the Earth. It’s simply easier to calculate the planetary movements with a heliocentric concept. If you include the rest of the universe into the picture, the planetary movements are irrelevant because of the much larger scale. So scientists stick with the heliocentric model which also correlates with the laws of gravity.

And science has brought up some highly implausible theories as well which are untouched by Occam’s Razor: The whole complex of quantum physics for example (Heisenberg’s Uncertainty Principle, the ‘spin’ aspect, or the tunnel effect which keeps our sun burning). As I said: Implausibility does not equal impossibility.

But your theory can’t sufficiently explain all the different cultures of the whole world. There are some factual observations that do not compute with your theory. However, I’m ready to accept your theory for a restricted area of civilization, and for a restricted period of time. But not as an explanation for everything.
 
Jim, please keep in mind that what I'm about to say is said out of concern for you and not an attempt to either prove or rebuke your theory.

Was this your research or was it culled from a few books you read on the topic? I don't ask to be a wise-ass, I just hope you haven't spent that much time and energy in your life trying to prove that the whole world is a wicked place with no hope for any of us to lead constructive lives.

Here's the problem I have with this and most other massive conspiracy theories. Given enough time and energy, enough research and and a large enough library of history and facts...you can pretty much connect everything to everything else. Like a global game of "Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon", you know? If you wanted to, you can connect the bombing of the USS Cole to the Louisiana Purchase. You can even make it very plausible.

You can't honestly believe that a world you claim can't get along can be involved in a cover-up on a global scale. That there will be no dissenters in the ranks that would blow it wide open. And if it's so vital to their survival that this concept of multi-layer espionage and secrecy remain intact, when can we expect your "mysterious" dissapearance for blowing the lid off of it? I mean, "They" monitor everything, right?

Yes, I'm being sarcastic...but you get my point. 😀

Your claim that everyone who doesn't believe this is preferring the "ignorance is bliss" approach is a bit vague. You can still lead a productive life without being ignorant. In America (and England and other civilizations with some form of democracy or another), it is not only your right to question authority, but your responsibility. Many of us take this very seriously. With so many people on the planet that think this way, it's almost mathematically impossible to keep anything like what you're implying rolling for very long.

Again, I choose not to argue every point of your claim, as that would only lead to more of the same "they're out to get us" philosophy. I have honest concern for those who spend thier lives living under an invisible threat to thier existance. It leads to paranoia and a general mistrust of everyone, which can only deepen the rifts we already have.

Just my 2 cents. 😎
 
Hi BigJim. I find Area 51 interesting in that many people who don't go in for conspiracy theories seem to go in for that one. I think maybe its partly due to the desire to not feel we are alone in the universe. Partly also due the fact it makes for a grand tale as well. I agree though that probably it has been chewed over so much that any real info is to foggy to decipher.
 
Re: "Universal theory?"

Haltickling said:
Jim, you seem to be presenting a theory as a fact. While I concede that your theory might (!) apply to all the cultures which had contact with Sumer/Babylon (Jewish/Christian/Muslim, all the religions of the Middle East etc.), I’m afraid that your conclusion is invalid for most of the Asian/American/Early Europe cultures (Chinese, Incas, Celts etc.). Their cultures developed independently from what you see as the root of all civilization.

I'd say the middle and near east was responsible for most of the things that came to pass on the Eurasian landmass. I'm very glad you mention some of the others though, as they are pertinent points.
What happened to most of the ones you mentioned that were independant of the influence I'm talking about? Yeppers, they were burnt, shot, torturred and exterminated by the apread of the main influence throughout the world. The Australian aborigines, the native Americans et al were systematically victimised and murdered for holding different beliefs. I would hazard a guess and say that these peoples had a firmer grasp on spirituality than Christianity, Judaism, Islam or anything else major. However, the Incas had altered versions of religion similar to the Mayans, Toltecs, Incas etc. These were because we have a more than slightly doctored version of history, when it comes to the influences of people's navigating the seas. There is a COLOSSAL amount of evidence for peoples like the Phoenicians travelling to the far-flung corners of the world, waaaaaaay before Christopher Colon. (The name "Columbus" is an Illuminati symbol in itself, because it refers to the symbol of the dove, which was in itself a symbol of Semiramis in Babylon. This is why you see depictions of this all over the place as Illuminati symbolism. It's also where you get this District of "Columbia", University of "Columbia" and "Columbia" Pictures stuff from. It's got bugger all to do with a south American producer of nose-candy. It's all a reference to the dove symbolism. This alone would require another massive post to report on.) I believe the central American cultures were "influenced by this (which is probably why they report white visitors to their shores centuries ago. The Phoenecians were white) and anything that was even remotley true to spirituality was exterminated.



Haltickling said:
You’re right that many of the old legends carry similarities. The Vedes and the Krishna Legend are among those. But the basic concepts of Hinduism and Buddhism are diagonally different from the other Middle East religions. In fact, the differences are much more striking than the similarities. There is no power structure for the “clerical circles” of Hinduism and Buddhism. The latter is even called the “Religion without God”, as Buddha was never seen as God. They have a completely different concept for life after death, not in the least comparable to the Babylon-based religions: constant rebirth.
No he wasn't seen as God, but he was born 3 days after the winter solstice, walked among men as a healer, was crucified on a tree, was called the "lamb" and vanished from his tomb after 3 days. He was also said to return on a white horse to judge the dead and do battle with "the Prince of Evil". Like Mahommed in Islam, he wasn't so much a God as a divine human. As opposed to Jesus I guess, who was only half-human.

Haltickling said:
The triangle as a symbol for divinity exists also in Hinduism, but its explanation is merely reflecting life itself: Brahma (creation, birth), Vishnu (conservation, life), and Shiva (destruction, death). In my eyes, this explanation is much nearer to the real roots of any religion: mere observation of nature. Buddhism sees the same as a dual principle: Yin/Yang, male/female, day/night, life/death, which also adds up to observation of nature. It’s quite interesting that Buddhism has no concept for the duality good/evil, which is one of the fundamental Jewish/Christian/Muslim principles.
The triangle is as close as Hinduism gets to the Holy Trinity concept, so vital to most religions, whether pagan or modern. Buddha I would see as another equivalent of Jesus/Horus/Tammuz/Dionysus/Bacchus/Quetzalcoatl etc. There are going to be some differences, because these guys do need to go war with each other them; IF my theory is correct. I would say Hinduism and Buddhism are definatley more different to Christianity and Judaism etc, but there is definatley some influence there.

Haltickling said:
Let’s leave the religious aspect for a moment. An even more important fact can be found in anthropology: The myth of one common origin of human civilization is no longer accepted by archeologists/anthropologists. Most of them still agree that the earliest traces came from Africa. One part of the population there migrated to the Middle East, another part to Northern and Central Europe. But no tracks lead to East Asia, and there were no connections between them once they had reached their farthest-possible destinations. There must have been several independent developments of the Homo Sapiens. Remember the Peking Man? A lot of archeological findings have proved that he must have existed in that area some 2 million years ago. If there were any connections, they must have happened long before the Babylonian culture erupted. Are you saying that the “Illuminati” already existed then? If so, that leads us back to the theory of Aliens.
I'm saying that the "Illuminati" AND rank and file humanity existed then. I think mankind has existed in various forms for a lot longer than "science" will willingly admit. A slight clue to that is rock strata containing the joint footprints of humans and species that have been extinct for 30 million years or more. I do agree with you that there was "civillisation" before the Babylonian and Sumerian "eruption". I don't think that was the emergence of civilisation so much as the "re"emergence of it. There's a lot of geological evidence that suggest a massive catastrophe or series of them between 10,500 and 12,000 years ago. Not just on Earth, but on Mars as well, so maybe it was something like a humungous comet? Something like that could also explain why Mars once had an atmosphere, water, life and a magnetic field, but has no longer. A near miss by a comet would have had more devastating long-term effects than a direct hit. I think Earth probably took the direct hit and survived long-term, while the removal of the Martian magnetic field resulted in an irradiated planetary surface.

That would explain to me why cultures like Sumer, Babylon, Egypt etc. came into being at the height of their sophistication and then declined. It suggest a massive infusion of knowledge at the very beginning which indicates that the chief honchos of said culture, were educated elsewhere. Doesn't automatically mean it was outer space, but I rule nothing out. After typing stuff as outlandish as this is from the conditioned point of view; I'd be a hypocrite to, would'nt I?
I think it indicates a worldwide culture a some point.
As for the "Aliens", do you believe in them Hal? I do believe that there has been influence on this planet from outside, but for what it's worth, I believe that the "Illuminati" originated from here too. Which is not to say that they're totally the same as us of course. Makes you wonder why they interbreed so incessantly doesn't it? There's gold in that thar DNA!!!

Haltickling said:
Which brings us back to other religions and cultures beyond Mesopotamian influence: What about the tribes in the jungles of Central Africa, the Aborigines in Australia and their relatives in Papua-Niugini and Melanesia, the Ainu in Japan, the pre-Columbian cultures in North and South America. Their cultures had no connections to Mesopotamia at all. The same applies to the Northern European tribes like the Vikings and the Celts. They all had (some still have) their own religions, although some of the sagas mentioned by you may have influenced them later. Hell, there is even proof of Neanderthals burying their dead, which implies some thoughts about an afterlife. You don’t seriously believe they were guided by “Illuminati” too , do you?

No, I don't think anyone has to be guided by anyone to have a concept of the afterlife. Spirituality is something common to all sentinent being with the capacity for thought beyond where the next meal is coming from, or where it can get a shag. But then I never claimed that Hal. I've not suggested that EVERYTHING that has ever existed on the face of the planet came from "Illuminati" sources; only the most dominant 80 or 90%. If I inferred otherwise, then it was a mistake. You have to admit though, that the major centres of what I've described as "Illuminati" power made a damn good job of annihilating anything that was remotely independant of them. I mentioned a good few of your above examples in the paragraph I typed earlier in this post. Aussie aborigines were slaughtered by the bucketfull. As were Native Americans, as were Central Africans, as were Central Americans, blah blah blah. But I think that with minimal digging, the evidence of of seafaring nations thosands of years befor Christopher Colon is quite heavy.

Haltickling said:
No, I still think that the root of every civilization and culture is in the very nature of humans. They have a natural curiosity, an urge to explain things, so it’s no miracle or common influence that made them think about the sun and the moon, rain and draught, winter and summer, life and death. Some areas were more densely populated than others, and the people there were forced to find some social structures for co-existence. That’s where the big civilization centers emanated. Those structures demanded some control on a higher level, by fellow fallible humans who had greed, ambition, and all out other character flaws in them, as a result of their genes and the evolutionary pressure. If ever, a more intricate system like your theoretic “Illuminati” came as a result of civilization, not as its origin. In the other regions which haven’t developed great cultures, nature prevented a dense population. That’s a very viable theory, don’t you think so? And much more uncomplicated than yours.
Viable certainly, less complicated, definatley. Only if you go without the direct evidence of the Illuminati's existence and machinations though. Don't fall into the trap of believeing that what is in this thread is my only evidence. It's just the only evidence I've had time to compile. The initial post in this thread took over 4 hours to write *8000 words?* and the one on religion that I copied and posted took closer to 6 hours. The day after I wrote the intital post here, I went into a string of 12 hour shifts, which is why I havn't had time to write this 2nd post which deals in the criminal affairs of the Bush family and their contribution to and to events like, 9/11. This thread has only been the opening chapter and while the debate has been informative and enjoyable (not offence to anyone else, but from YOU especially it has been very enjoyable Hal) it's only been discussing an incomplete part of it all. I originally intended two posts of about 8,000 words length. I think It's more likely to stretch to 3 or 4 more posts of that length to cover all the subjects that have been brought up by people like you. (A good example being a demonstration of how various apparently unconnected cultures, have been very much connected and another being the rather esoteric symbolism that the "Illuminati" (God I hate that word, but it's the only one I can think of) use all over the world.

Haltickling said:
And this is where we get to Occam’s Razor, Science, and your evaluation of it. I think you’ve misunderstood the concept by seeing only the verbal explanation. Let me rephrase it and give you a practical example: If there are several theories which all explain every single observation of the same issue, science applies Occam’s Razor to choose the least complicated explanation as a future working hypothesis, as long as no other observations are discovered that are not explained by it.

Uh-huh, that's very true, but this is where the magical expression "conditioned view of reality" comes into the discussion again. Occam's Razor is only useful where there is no definitive proof to suggest that one of several explanations is the correct one. In this I believe I've come across a large amount of "proof" that has been deliberatley witheld from the public arena. The very act of keeping this stuff secret is suggestive of a massive conspiracy, even if you can't conceptualise one as big as the one I'm saying exists. When it comes down to the bottom line, no-one is obliged to agree with me. I just believe that as large amount of people as possible should have access to this information. It's been denied for millenia and I think that's wrong. It would also be wrong though, to expect you all to fall into line with my view of "reality". What anyone does with the info is up to them. Hal we've just had a very in-depth and fascinating discussion that would not have taken place, if it weren't for the fact that you had questions and disagreed with some of my points. I hope that I've proved that I am open to discussion; not just of stating something and expecting everyone to adopt it.
 
Dave2112 said:
Jim, please keep in mind that what I'm about to say is said out of concern for you and not an attempt to either prove or rebuke your theory.

Was this your research or was it culled from a few books you read on the topic? I don't ask to be a wise-ass, I just hope you haven't spent that much time and energy in your life trying to prove that the whole world is a wicked place with no hope for any of us to lead constructive lives.

No probs mate, I appreciate both your concern and the points you raise. As I said to Hal about 5 minutes ago...without questions and disagreement, this thread would be very boring and one-sided.
This is a mixture of my own research and books I've read; although it's not so much a "few" as two or three dozen. I think I listed the authors who motivated me to continue studying this subject in the "origins of religions" passage somewhere.
Now what is for the most important part of your reply is the " I just hope you haven't spent that much time and energy in your life trying to prove that the whole world is a wicked place with no hope for any of us to lead constructive lives" bit. I think that like Hal, you've assumed that most of my content that I intend to post is in the first post of this thread. As things snowball I'd say that first post is a quarter to a sixth of the stuff I intend to post. A VERY (probably the most) important part of this writing, will be why it's actually a wonderful time to be alive and why there is most definatley not "no hope for any of us to lead constructive lives". The whole aim of this project for me is to enlighten, not depress and destroy. Don't forget, the depressing crap you've just read is only a part of what I want to share.

Dave2112 said:
Here's the problem I have with this and most other massive conspiracy theories. Given enough time and energy, enough research and and a large enough library of history and facts...you can pretty much connect everything to everything else. Like a global game of "Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon", you know? If you wanted to, you can connect the bombing of the USS Cole to the Louisiana Purchase. You can even make it very plausible.

I've never heard of "6 degrees of Kevin Bacon" so I would'nt know. Is this an American thing?😀 I know Kevin Bacon is an actor, but that's it. I guess what you're saying is like Jim Garrison's view of theoretical physics. "It can prove an elephant can hang from a cliff, with it's tail tied to a daisy."
All I can say is that this is just information. I will present what I've researched and read. I'll also present what "evidence" I have to back it up. When the curtain drops, you'll have a wider picture of everything I've wanted to talk about. If you still don't believe it's possible or feasible, well hey mate that's your free choice. The whole world is free to make a choice about anything and I certainly don't have any right to force you to accept my perception of history and events. All I'll ask is that you read it all. I'll post links to all posts in the series as I put up the new ones, so it'll hopefully be easy enough to cross reference what I'm talking about. If you don't agree with my thoughts mate, I'll live I'm sure, and hopefully we'll still get to share a beer one day. 🙂

Dave2112 said:
You can't honestly believe that a world you claim can't get along can be involved in a cover-up on a global scale. That there will be no dissenters in the ranks that would blow it wide open. And if it's so vital to their survival that this concept of multi-layer espionage and secrecy remain intact, when can we expect your "mysterious" dissapearance for blowing the lid off of it? I mean, "They" monitor everything, right?

Yes, I'm being sarcastic...but you get my point. .

I don't claim that "a world you claim can't get along can be involved in a cover-up on a global scale". I claim that the people of the world have been manipulated into not getting along. The leaders of the countries that have gone to war with each other over the years have all been controlled and by the same people. The grandfather of your current President for example(one Prescott Bush), was a major financier of Adolph Hitler's rise to power. It's also true that major banks in the City of London and Wall Street funded both sides in both world wars, and then lent them even more money to re-build afterwards. Dissenters in the ranks? Yup, there's been a few. There have been people within the "Illuminati" framwork itself that have been very threatening to the continued existence of the agenda. Two former US Presidents for example have threatened the monopoly of the private banks to create money out of thin air and then charge countries and individuals interest on what was nothing more than figures on a screen or paper. These two Presidents had conceived and begun to introduce a system where the government would take over the production of money. This system would have meant the government would not have to pay crippling interest to the private banks, and therefore the people who borrowed it from the government would only have to pay small administrative charges, instead of having to pay for three houses to buy one. These two Presidents were Abraham Lincoln and John F. Kennedy.
Then there was also a young lady who although bon into an "Illuminati" family, was not in the usual mould. she was actually threatening to take public support away from them and she actually showed "ordinary" people how wonderful and heartfelt she could be. And the lady I'm talking about? Diana, Princess of Wales.
As for my "mysterious disappearance", :blaugh: well more public figures than me have spoken against this and are still around. Although they are too prominent to knock off publicly (JFK and AL don't apply here, because their killings were blameable on something else at a time when the I-Word hadn't even been heard by most people) you'll find their characters are slaughtered instead. I'll probably be laughed at by most people who read this and labeled a "conspiracy theorist" ( Oh God, not another conspiracy theorist!!! :disgust: ) for my views. But I hope I've shown by the detail that I've gone into, that I'm not just so saddo who's leapt on a conspiracy-theory bandwagon because it looks "cool". I've done a hell of a lot of backup to my views and I presented a lot of "evidence" (whether you'd consider it circumstantial or not) to substantiate the claims I made in the original post. I'm not just a guy searching for a "religion" to lean on. (As Myriads once told me when he compared me to Scott.) The things I write about I have no wish or desire to believe in. I just cam across them comparitivley recently and have a desire to share the information.


Dave2112 said:
Your claim that everyone who doesn't believe this is preferring the "ignorance is bliss" approach is a bit vague. You can still lead a productive life without being ignorant. In America (and England and other civilizations with some form of democracy or another), it is not only your right to question authority, but your responsibility. Many of us take this very seriously. With so many people on the planet that think this way, it's almost mathematically impossible to keep anything like what you're implying rolling for very long.
You've mis-quoted me there Dave. I never claimed that anyone who didn't believe his was searching refuge in "ignorance is bliss". That comment was in response to TKpervert saying he didn't give a shit about any of this, because he was happy and that was that. (I'm paraphrasing TKP, but that was the gist of it.) I replied that that was "ignorance is bliss", not anyone who didn't believe me. I was also being slightly tongue in cheek when I said it; because I also said that it was better to confront something to ignore it. If he reads this, decides I'm talking crap and he doesn't believe it, then that's cool. He's free to believe that life is imaginary and we're all really glands up a dog's arse if he wants to. 😎 He never said he didn't believe what I said, just that he didn't care? Yanno?🙂

Dave2112 said:
Again, I choose not to argue every point of your claim, as that would only lead to more of the same "they're out to get us" philosophy. I have honest concern for those who spend thier lives living under an invisible threat to thier existance. It leads to paranoia and a general mistrust of everyone, which can only deepen the rifts we already have.

Just my 2 cents. 😎

Awwww Dave, you've wounded me! :sadcry: 😛 No it would'nt lead to more "they're out to get us" philosophy, because I argue my points on what I perceive as logic and things I've researched from various sources; not desperatley defending an illogical and undefendable dogma. ( I'll leave that to the politicians! :blaugh: )
And thanks for your concern, but I don't spend my life doing any such thing. Part of my philosophy on life is that no-one should be too spiritual. If they are, then they float off into the clouds and forget their reason for being on Earth in the first place. I have as healthy a life as most 24 year olds.(25 next month! Yay! 😀) I watch sport with friends, shoot the shit with colleagues at work (that's slang for discussing things) do my Tae Kwon Do and get blindingly drunk with mates in nightclubs; under the intoxicated impression that it makes me look amazingly attractive to women. Oh and of course, there's always time for meeting UK gals from the community too! I've met three lovely ladies from the TMF so far. I don't say that to boast about my virility like a stand-up comedian Dave, but to show that I'm not a pimlply-faced geekazoid who is glued to his PC monitor and turns into dust at the first hint of sunlight.

I'm also not falling into the trap of "I have honest concern for those who spend thier lives living under an invisible threat to thier existance. It leads to paranoia and a general mistrust of everyone, which can only deepen the rifts we already have."

You may have that impression, because I've only written about depressing material so far, but there's positive stuff to come eventually. It's just that I have to wade through shit to do it.
If anything, my search has taught me how to love and trust more, because we've been given such an excellent example of what happens when hate and paranoia rule the world. Perhaps we should be thanking the "Illuminati"? I think you've deeply underestimated me in your last 2 lines. After all IF me and people like me are right, then it'll be just as well that we listed human freedom under our hobbies. Part of the deal in confronting this "conspiracy", is learning not how to blast it to death with a gun, but how to deal with it peacfully and lovingly. If we try to confront this with a gun/bazooka/armed march then all we'll end up with is twice the violence. Martin Luther King had the right idea. That was a man who has my utmost respect and admiration.
Put into a framework that you and I as Star Wars fans would understand, it's like Luke refusing to fight the Emperor with the Dark Side and so avoiding falling into it. (Not only that, but turning Anakin back away from it!) That's my goal philosophy really; that the means are just as, if not more important than the ends.
 
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Sorry Jim, you haven't conviced me with your reply. It's only more of the same theory with which you're trying to prove your theory.

But I refrain from a lengthy reply now and wait till you've unfolded your theory completely. Be prepared for a VERY lengthy reply then! 😉
 
Ok, several of my questions answered.

BTW, I'm aware that you haven't posted everything you have on this, I was just resonding to what you have so far.

"Six degrees of Kevin Bacon" is a game based on the concept of "Six degrees of Separation", in which we can all be connected by six or less other people. However, the game is that you can connect any actor in the world to Kevin Bacon in six movie roles or less.

The point was that you can make connections anywhere you want to make them, like a spiderweb. By the time the web is done, you can follow any of the strands, take a turn on any of the others and reach the same center. But when the web covers half a cornfield (you should see some of the ones captured on film in South America....truly magnificent), you're following a lot of strands. All lead to the same center. Someone starting on the other end gets to the same place, but by a different route. It doesn't mean the other strands don't exist.
 
I'll Tell You What's Sad..

And I know many of you will find this odd coming from me. I do believe war is necessary at times, but given a viable additional options war should always be the last.

Much of war is just a bunch of old men getting off because they can send young men to do their bidding. Nothing more than that..

Give the old men guns, put them into a room and let the best man win.

The rest of us should watch cartoons 🙂


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