Being Politically Correct versus Being Accepting of Others

[Sunriseticklee]

I didn't reply to the bit about your wife in the classroom because it didn't directly apply to what I was asking in my original post.

I did mention the following quote....

Plain and simple, it is wrong. You know that, I know that. I call it being accepting of others. You call it being courteous. Others call it being politically correct.

Which I feel covers what you said after you spoke about your wife. I respect your wife's job. I teach ALL the students and have to deal with all of them before and after alternative school. I think it is great that she is fair to all of her students. Good teachers should always be.

I hope that makes you feel better in a way.

It is wonderful that you are Jewish as well. Then of course you understand that the idea of a master race discriminated against many ethnic and religious groups, not solely your own.

Also unless I have flamed you in anyway, the feelings you receive through the microchips of cyberland are your preception of how you think I feel. What you believe about that is up to you.

If you have anything else to contribute to my thread that has nothing to do with my subject in question, you need to address it in a private message. The feelings and tone you interpret to what you have read are not on topic and they will not be addressed here further than this point or I will ask that they be removed.

Feel free to comment on the subject at hand- political correctness vs. being accepting of others- as much as you like.

Thank you
Sunrise

 

[Deleted member 2452]

i'll just say this then leave you, and your clip in peace

political correctness in just a catch phrase, to mask an attempt at controling the thought, and speach of others.

as i said, people who are jerks, are jerks. if people want to go around making fools of them selves by speaking in a rude manor, or using insulting words/phrases, to discribe others that are different, i say let them, because then we know who to avoid. and truely, they are only hurting them selves.

i would rather people be up-front about their ignorant biggotry, than have them be two faced, closet biggots! the kind that smile, are polite, but call you kike, or spic, or gook, or spade, behind your back.

we are never going to rid ourselves of this blight, so i'd rather it be in the open, so as to avoid these "people".

you're right, the germans killed some 11 million in the death camps. many is the time i think what may have become of those peole if they weren't slaughtered so un-justly.
steve

 

[Sunriseticklee]

Re: i'll just say this then leave you, and your clip in peace

political correctness in just a catch phrase, to mask an attempt at controling the thought, and speach of others.

as i said, people who are jerks, are jerks. if people want to go around making fools of them selves by speaking in a rude manor, or using insulting words/phrases, to discribe others that are different, i say let them, because then we know who to avoid. and truely, they are only hurting them selves.
steve

But that is not so.... They are hurting more than just themselves. They are poisoning society with their views, spreading lies and ignorance, demeaning and cutting others with their words as well. And that hurts. To anyone who has felt different, unaccepted, cast aside, no one can tell them that the pain isn't real.

Let's not forget that there are people who feel this way, speak this way, and they are also politicians and law makers who are running the country.

So it does effect us.

 

[kurchatovium]

I suppose ultimately it comes down to semantics but being courteous does give me the right to tell you things that you may not agree with without being called bigoted or racist or politcally incorrect. That is the problem I have it with politcal correctness. It is when it interferes with the very thing the world needs which is communication then it is a problem and not a solution. Courteousy is a better term it allows the freedom of expression without the name calling and vile prejudicial language.

I am glad you do not tolerate rude behaviour in your students believe me I am a firm believer in etiquette and respecting the feelings of others. However I think communication between peoples of different backgrounds is equally important. I feel that we must feel at ease with one another enough so we can voice our opinions without fear of making the slightest little mistake and insulting the other party. I suppose there is a grey area there between disagreement and insult but let me share with you something that my aunt told me once. She said to me "I never make it easy for anyone to insult me. If you are trying to insult me why should I make it easy for you. If you are not then there is no problem and why should my feelings be hurt.". In my humble opinion there is much wisdom in this statement.

 

[Prime]

I thought your response to me was good.....until i got to the part where you said maybe i have more clout then you. If i were the kind of person who took things to litterally i might be offended by that. What have i done to deserve anything over anyone..so i post a few pics..big deal so do others. I want to be treated like everyone else and i believe i am. I dont know all the politics that go on here. I cant even pretend to know. Its fairly obvious that somewhere along the line you think you got a raw deal. If i felt that way i would be angry as well...but i would'nt use it as an excuse to call out the mods everytime i got a chance to..Being a school teacher like your are i would have expected more from you. Its like maybe you disciplining one of your students in class then that student takes it upon him or herself to make your job hard because they think they got a raw deal. Even if they may have. They shouldnt act in in front of the rest of the class.

Either way im fairly sure what i'm saying here is not going to sway anyones thinking one way or the other..sometimes i dont know why i even bother to post replys. Guess i'm a glutton for punishment.

Lastly your right i won't hold the door open for you or anyone else.
This is suppose to be a time of gender equality..so everyone can get the door for themselves. 😛

 

[Sunriseticklee]

Darn! No more holding doors?

And I thought you were still a gentleman. Holding doors is just common courtesy. I hold it for whoever is behind me regardless of gender because it's polite. 😛

Sure, I have students who give me a hard time. I love those. I consider them a challenge and without them, my classroom would be very very very dull. *HONESTLY, SCOUT'S HONOR* But I love all of my students. (this year 😛 )

My students also always let me know whenever I have messed up or made a mistake, (That's how kids are!) and since I am not perfect, it does happen every once in awhile, sometimes every day. Once again, I'm glad they let me know so I can change it.

I even set aside a time for my students to come and talk to me about anything that they feel was unfair or they don't agree with. I listen to their concerns and explain the rules.

And to show that I am not threatened by "change" or improvement or even opposition in a way, I gave out parent/student surveys so I could hear what I need to improve on.

The fact of the matter is, I don't hide, deny, blow up, delete, block, whimper, scamper, and explode on my students or their parents for seeing things differently.

Yes I "scold" them when they "hurt" someone, praise them when they are working hard, guide them when they are heading the wrong direction, and encourage them when they aren't trying their best. And yes a "strong hand" is always needed.

The fact of the matter is, whenever someone speaks up against the norm on this forum they are treat badly. If someone complains about something, unless it is about a company or a person everyone generally seems to hate, that person is shot down.

When mistakes are pointed out, they are told to go make something better themselves. When things are shoddily handled or poorly done they are told, that "We can't be everywhere at once. We can't handle every problem. Sorry, quit trying to cause trouble." If they find some need for improvement they are told to shut up and leave if they don't like it. Sounds like bad costumer service to me.

And if we agree with the "opposition", the minority, we are being "closed-minded", destroying the "community", etc....

Now, you've turned the tables on me... imagine this

I am teaching your child. She gets jumped (beat up) in my classroom.
You ask me what the HELL I was doing when all of this happened. And I say...

"Hey, I can't be everywhere or do everything. I'm doing the best I can! I can't break up every fight all of the time!"

or

What if some kids are bullying or taunting your child endlessly.

"Hey, I don't want to kill my students' freedom of expression. Sure some things get out of hand, but hey, I'd rather let the conversations run their course before I decide to pull or stop anything."

or

What if your child is being sexually harassed by a kid at school?

"Hahahahaha! Oh no worries. That person harasses almost everybody. He/She is just like a little puppy dog. Everything will be just fine."

or

What if something your child says makes me a little angry.

"You tattletale... blah blah blah!" (insert other names here)
I can act just like the children and start calling your child names. I can treat your child really mean, just because I am the one in power.

The problem is your child is not safe with me. The problem is, instead of me trying to improve the environment in which the children are in, I have little excuses.

Will my classroom be a happy-go-lucky, accepting. well-ran, close-knit community for all? NO WAY! Just like this place is not.

So you were holding the door (no closed), why do I stay? Because I choose to stay. I have friends here that I love, and sometimes this is the best place to reach them. I mean... I met my best friend EVER on this forum. I love him with all of my heart and if I hadn't come, I would have been missing out on someone wonderful. (RSL)

A small portion of me thinks that maybe, just maybe the blinders will fall off of someone and they will try to FIX things, change things. The smaller part of me is shrinking, but hey, it is still there.

I didn't just invent this feeling because I felt like someone was "doing me wrong" personally. I have felt like this for a very long time. Even when I was being the good TMF student who always rose her little hand to answer the TMF questions, who was nice in the TMF chatroom (even while being called a nigger by the other TMF students), and tried my best to make sure my little sunshine was there for whoever needed it. 🙂

I'm speaking out because I feel like this place is going downhill and I am not the only one who sees it. Do I think that everything about it is awful? No, not yet. Do I think there is a need for improvement? Sure I do. Do I feel like everyone here is accepted for who they are, and are not grouped, classified, degraded and discriminated against. No I do not. And if my feelings make me "unpopular" and label me the "bad student" then oh well.

Equally, if people here decides to stop talking to me or take me off their guest list or decide I am no longer their friend because of how I feel, then they weren't my friend to begin with. I don't have to agree with everything. I call things the way I see them. Sometimes I see things in a good light, other times bad.

Many of my friends who are no longer part of the forum told me about the problems, why they had left, how they were mistreated. Some of them were just lurkers who told me why they were too afraid to post. It is not like I didn't believe them, or did, I just had to see it for myself and draw my own conclusions. I've done both. Now they all get in my face and laugh and say, "I told you so." But hey... they did. *shrug* What can I say?

Now for the clout statement.... Part of me was just being goofy, but honestly, part of me wasn't. So... it wasn't meant for you to find offense in it. I'm sure you don't know why some people are treated better than others and given more "privileges" than others here. But if you happen to figure it out, I would like to know what the deal is.

Sunrise

 

[Prime]

Nice post....this will be my last reply to by the way. Let me introduce you to the real world. You know the place where things ar'nt always as fair as you would hope. Maybe some people do get favortism here..maybe they don't. I don't know and i dont care. I know i'm sure not getting any privledges passed my way. People who generally rock the boat will probably always be frowned upon. Sure they will have thier supporters (generally the others ones that rock the boat.) to back them up. They see one of the brethern getting the business and they jump in like a pack of wild dogs saying..yeah i too have gotten the shaft...or my buddy got the shaft..or so on and so on. I'm sure there have been mistakes made. If as you say someone racially slurred you in the chatroom at one time or another then i would hope that would have been taken care of. If not i'm sorry. Truely sorry. I am beggining to see where your distate for the Tmf is coming from though. Having said that keep this in mind. Yeah they have rules here...which i would hope get handled fairly in regaurds to everyone. I have no reason to believe otherwise. I guess mostly because nothing bad has ever happened to me here. Still even if it had...even if maybe i felt i wasnt getting a fair shake (and this part is probably going to tee you off) I'm smart enough to realize that this isnt my site. I contribute nothing to make it stay here. I have never donated money. I hav'nt helped design it. I dont try to make things go smoothly. I just show up..post and look over the other posts and see whats going on and whos new. I ocassionally interact with the folks here in posts and i just try to have a good time. It is not my god given right to be here. It is not your god given right to be here. Unless your helping foot the bill. Are you? My point to this is..you keep showing up..thats great. You make friends here. Thats great as well. All this your doing here is on someone elses dime. As well as someone elses time. So if your not paying for the server, or helping run the forum then as has been said before you just visiting someone elses house. In some houses the rule is take your shoes off at the door...while maybe once in a blue moon the house owners best friend or friends doesnt have to take his shoes off before entering. The thing is its his house..his decision to make...i'm not gonna get pissed because i had to take my shoes off.

Sometimes i wish like hell they would make this a pay site. The bad part is we would lose a lot of nice people that cant afford that. That would be sad. Still at least then when your paying for it you would have a basis to gripe. No, you dont have to pay for something to gripe about it. Thats been proven here time and again. Just dont expect everyone to shut up and part the way for you to do it. Everytime someone says when i say something i get bashed for it. Then basically that translates to , I should be able to grip and no one can have another opinion.

Anyway you seem like a decent person with alot of energy. Its a shame that you cant find a more productive way to spend some of it here. I'm guessing at this point there ar'nt to many things the mods could do to make you happy.

Oh and by the way the examples you used of someones kid catching the business at school could'nt really pertain to me.. i have no kids...now if you would have used a puppy farm as an example i may have related better. 😛

 

[RichardAuc]

How many races are there?

Q: How many races are there?

A: One. Human.

 

[Sunriseticklee]

You don't have to post anymore, but that is not going to stop me from replying to your thoughts. And nothing in your post "T-ed" me off because believe me, I have heard it all before. (well... most of it at least)

Just because I live in the "real world" doesn't mean I don't have a right to speak up for what I believe in the hopes that things will change for the better. I never chose to be born where I was or look the way I do, or have some of the experiences that I have had, but they happened. I'm not mad about it, but I was taught a long time ago that when something isn't right, don't hide or cower. Speak up for what you believe in. I have spoken up all of my life, and I don't see that ending any time soon.

Others may think that since they don't foot the bill for this site that they don't have a right to say a word, that they should just sit in silence when they are being mistreated or when others are being mistreated, but since this website is a forum and we are allowed to speak on the real issues, I'm going to talk about them. And that doesn't mean that someone is lacking in intelligence if they choose to speak up. It also doesn't mean they are being counterproductive, whiny, rude, ungrateful, or any of the other things people tend to say when someone disagrees or speaks out.

You can say I am rocking the boat, you can say that I am a trouble maker, you can say that I am being closed-minded, or any other little label that is stuck on someone who speaks up when she sees injustice. Look around and see that I am <U>not</U> one of those people posting negative things to every thread just to see who will get angry. I am <U>not</U> one of those people following certain moderators waiting to jump on their asses. Sometimes I post, sometimes I do not. Sometimes it is lighthearted, sometimes it is not. Sometimes I go off and speak my mind. Other times I sit and stew..... Sometimes I just don't give a damn. That is my right, my prerogative. And I should be treated the same whether I am just a lowly poster or a moderator or whatever, and whether I agree with the majority or not.

I have never complained solely because people don't feel the same way I do, and if you feel that way then you have never taken the time to actually read what I write. You certainly are not obligated. I'm used to being different and thinking differently. You can flat out disagree with someone, and that has nothing to do with treating people the way they should be treated.

Just because I don't pay for the site, or praise this site in every single post does not mean that I should not be allowed to have a voice. I have been a supporter on some issues and a dissenter for about 2 years now. I have agreed and disagreed on many issues. But it is only when I disagree about how a person is being treated that I suddenly become a problem, a "hindrance" to the "community". It is only when I disagree that I am told... "Well maybe you should leave." If people are going to get upset about when I don't follow the norm, they shouldn't commence in kissing my ass when I do.

No one told me I had to be here, but it is free for me and so here I am. If I had to pay for it tomorrow, it would be hard for me to decide to financially support a forum that allowed some people and "groups" of people to be mistreated from time to time while others are cuddled and hugged and praised (regardless of how wrong they are). But like I said, I do have wonderful friends here, and if they were all gone tomorrow, I would be too.

I didn't share or help with picking the rules, but they are the ones the mods put in place. And if they tell us that the rules are for everyone, then the rules should apply to every single person on the forum. No exceptions... and applied consistently.

I don't want anyone kissing my ass, but I don't want anyone treating me like crap either. That is not too much to ask. According to the "rules" here, it is a requirement. A requirement that not all have to follow and that is not always applied. And if they are going to swear by the rules, they should apply to everyone. If people are going to be treated better or worse, then they should just say it so everyone knows what to expect. If they are going to discriminate then they shouldn't lie and swear that they are fair to all.

The fact of the matter is, everyone keeps talking about how TMF is the perfect place for this tickling community. I don't think everyone here understands the word community. One day they will, or maybe not. It's all pretty damn sad if you think about it.

But you are right, this is the real world and I why should I have a right to be a rebel and speak up, try to call attention and change the way the world is run? LOL

Well it was the rebels who spoke out and made a difference in this world. I'm not foolish enough to think that things haven't changed for the better. We aren't a finished by far, but there are still people afraid to speak up against the norm, rock the boat for something better. I'm not one of them, nor will I ever be.

On this thread I spoke up about inequality, on treating people of various groups with respect and making them feel accepted (politically correct or not). That was the purpose of this thread. And if it made anyone feel uncomfortable or if it called someone out, or if someone felt as if I was stepping on their toes, if it woke someone up to the way they treat others who are different from the way than they are, I did what I set out to do.

Lastly it's too bad you feel the way you feel about me. We've never chatted or been close friends, or even been friends at all, so I don't feel a sense of loss or sadness that I "disappoint". You have your idea of what is productive; I have my idea of mine. Since I chose to use my time on this thread and I don't feel as if one ounce of it was wasted, then perhaps you were the one who was being unproductive when you spent your time and effort replying. You certainly didn't have to. I wasn't looking for your seal of approval or your agreement. I was looking for varying points of view. I in turn find it a shame and such a waste that you have spent your time sharing your opinion on something that you "deemed" unproductive. Hopefully you will think twice before you post to something I write again.

Sunrise