Bret Hart Tribute: The True King of Kings.

[SlaverTickler]

You do bring valid points to the defense of Bret Hart, but how do you explain the alienation of all fans american?

People who cheered him through out his years and when they started to cheer Austin (this was during the Austin / Hart battles) Bret Hart said that he couldn't understand why people are cheering a guy that's making his life miserable and boo him, then go on to say that fans of the U.S. have nothing on fans else where in the world?

That was an Angle, he was suposed to do that. It's not like he ever burned the flag. If you ever saw "Hit Man Hart: Wrestling with Shadows" he wasn't keen on turning heel, but to get Austin over big it was more or less the best way to do it. His mother Helen was originaly from New York.

As far as Austin inducting him in the hall of fame I've got that on the DVD of wrestlemania 22 and Im going to have to go back out of just flat curiuosity at just how that went down, Ive always wondered that.

Watch the Bret Hart DVD set they put out about Bret, they both talk about their mutual respect for each other.

 

[Goodieluver]

Wow you memory is as good as Vince's. WCW was kicking WWF's ass for 84 weeks, that was before Russo and Fererra left Vince and came to work for Turner. Russo is the single most over raited booker in the history of the buisness, almost as over raited as Cena's work rait.

WCW dominated when they started the nwo and raw became stagnant. Then raw became a T&A show(the raw is war years) which was greatly due to the new booking style and the "who cares about wrestling aspect)

and i do not dispute your review of russo

 

[Goodieluver]

I don't think it's any coincidence with my opinion of WCW that they could take guys like Bret Hart and he becomes invisible within four months, yet Vince McMahon can take two guys in their 60's (Gerald Brisco and Pat Patterson) and turn them into bigger headline stealers than they were when they were actually wrestling.

And how did brisco and patterson get fame? By putting them in stupid comic\degradation side roles

Hart was hot in wcw, hell he became a main feud with goldberg till goldberg literally ended his career

 

[SlaverTickler]

And how did brisco and patterson get fame? By putting them in stupid comic\degradation side roles

Hart was hot in wcw, hell he became a main feud with goldberg till goldberg literally ended his career

Considering all the hype when Bret laft the WWF for WCW their is no question he was under used and miss booked. He should have been working matchs with the top guys in the company in long term fueds. I don't know why they didn't slap a fake belt on him an do like they did with Flair. That what I think Vince was worried about most, that Bret would show up in WCW an do the same thing Flair did with the WCW title.

 

[BigJim]

Now having said that, the guys mention through out this thread (Ric Flair, Shawn Michaels, Triple H and so on) to say they aren't even worth enough to carry the jock of Bret Hart and to say Triple H never got anything unless he married into the family, I'm sorry I have to say something. Ric Flair had to have something going for the past 35 years or else they would have to him to kick rocks long ago. To me he gave great promos and winning a championship sixteen times is just giving him the belt "just because"

Levesque, Flair and HBK are all great performers to one degree or another. Even though I personally can't stand to watch Flair in the ring I acknowledge that the rest of the wrestling world disagrees with me on it, so it must be a personal thing.

Second of all about Bret, Shawn Michaels and Triple H for all the controversy they've caused, not once did they ever turn they're back on the americans fans or any fans for that matter

Bret never turned his back on American fans. That is, Bret the man. Bret the character certainly did, but that was precipitated, as so many things are, but the fans driving arc development. He personally felt some of the things he had to say in character were pretty silly.

Bret Hart, far from being anti-American, is half American and half Canadian and carries a passport from the governments of both countries. He is on record as saying he's just as proud of his American heritage as his Canadian.

Bret Hart had a problem with anyone bigger than him and that got more cheers than him. He hated Shawn Michaels, he hated Stone Cold Steve Austin because they didn't come from the rich wrestling back ground he came from.

There were big differences between Bret and Michael Hickenbottom (the men as opposed to the characters) certainly, but I’m not aware of any tension beyond the normal that existed between Bret and Steve Williams (the men as opposed to the characters). They worked together, if not totally harmoniously, then reasonably well, especially with Wrestlemania 13 and the following three months after that.

Bret Hart never had to watch friends who were like family leave him like Triple H and Shawn Michaels did for Hall and Nash did, when Bret left for WCW, The Anvil and Bulldog (if memory serves me right) left right behind him.

And this is relevant why?

Again, Bret Hart is easily top five, but to me, the Number one guy is Shawn Michaels and Triple H is as he says he is, that damn good.

Michaels is good, but I wouldn’t say he’s number one. HHH has always been one of my favourite characters in the modern game.

 

[BigJim]

Triple H was so in the dog house after the MSG insident that he was squashed and I mean like a bug by the Warrior (and Warrior was still blown out). He was getting tossed into pig pens, and all sort of dumb shit. In fact during the match with Godwin I looked over at a friend and said, "This guy must have pissed off somebody, because he is to talented to be doing this."

Why was he in the shit over MSG? Wasn’t that all down to Hall, Nash, Waltman and Hickenbottom?

 

[BigJim]

You do bring valid points to the defense of Bret Hart, but how do you explain the alienation of all fans american?

People who cheered him through out his years and when they started to cheer Austin (this was during the Austin / Hart battles) Bret Hart said that he couldn't understand why people are cheering a guy that's making his life miserable and boo him, then go on to say that fans of the U.S. have nothing on fans else where in the world?

If fans in pretty much every country but the US were cheering you, but the US ones were heckling and boo'ing, don't you think you'd bea weeniest bit partisan too?

You also don't mention that the fact that the booing instigated his remarks showed that the fans alienated him, then the WWF and he built on that when the character turned heel.

 

[BigJim]

And how did brisco and patterson get fame? By putting them in stupid comic\degradation side roles

Correct. So?

Hart was hot in wcw, hell he became a main feud with goldberg till goldberg literally ended his career

Hart was hot by WCW's standards of heat, which was shite. WCW were much like a Labour Party government: throw money at a problem to make it all shiny and spangly for a few years, then wonder why it comes crashing down around their ears and leaves the country in a shit-awful mess. WCW's booking and artistyr were god-fucking-awful, very people within the busienss who have an ounce of remote objectivity dispute that.

 

[BigJim]

Considering all the hype when Bret laft the WWF for WCW their is no question he was under used and miss booked. He should have been working matchs with the top guys in the company in long term fueds. I don't know why they didn't slap a fake belt on him an do like they did with Flair. That what I think Vince was worried about most, that Bret would show up in WCW an do the same thing Flair did with the WCW title.

I think Bret had way too much integrity to do an Alundra Blayze.

 

[SlaverTickler]

Why was he in the shit over MSG? Wasn’t that all down to Hall, Nash, Waltman and Hickenbottom?

I wouldn't be suprised if it was probably Hickenbottom's idea, but Shawn was to popular, and Hall and Nash were leaving. I double checked things and Walman wasn't involved with that. The entire thing happened after a Cage Match between Shawn and "Diesle", and after HBK won they hugged, then "Razor Ramone" and "Hunter Hurst Helmsly" came out and it was a big love fest between 2 heels and 2 baby face's. Vince had already left the building and didn't know anything about it until later. With Hall and Nash off to WCW and Hickenbottom the top guy the only person to punish was the man who would become "THE GAME". Not unlike Vince trying to humiliate Owen Hart after Bret knocked him out, he couldn't get at Bret for it, so he used Owen as a conduit (sp) hurting Bret through the humiliation his brother.