Should any underage material be allowed on the Theater?

[Celtic_Emperor]

Varicose Dumbledore, allow me to start over.

You claim that what we NEED to do, for the good of the forum, is disallow the posting of fetish-oriented lolikon-type art.

I claim that it would be unnecessary because no government agency would classify it as illegal (thus alleviating any legal reasons for getting rid of it), and because the forum's administration seems to think there's no problem with it, mostly because of the afforementioned lack of legal repercussions from letting it stay.

On top of that, a majority of people who actually give a shit (i.e. the people who voted) agree with me that it should stay.

Now, you can either dismiss this again (because apparently, the fact that a number of people have said something makes it less valid) as you did before, or you can actually try and refute it.

I cannot refute an opinion. What you're asking is impossible, as no matter what I say, your opinion is your opinion and I cannot change it. All you can do and all I can do is make our case and be heard. The internet is for communicating (or at least it used to be before the Great Fapping).

Perhaps this wouldn't be completely true if people had the benefit of being in person when they speak. That way, you take in body language, tone of voice, atmosphere, all kinds of stuff that alter opinions, perceptions, and presense of mind. Because we're just talking to some anonymous person on the other end of a computer keyboard somewhere in the world, that sort of diminishes one's ability to get through to other people.

As far as the staff feeling theres no problem with it, Mistress Valerie said earlier that this is an issue that will be discussed further with the rest of the staff. Even if what you're saying about them is true in the present, it may not be so in the future. In light of that, I think its presumptious and premature to even refer to them and their opinions. Its best to leave them out of it, lest we mistakenly put words in their mouths and make claims to decisions we do not have access to. Even if mods should clearly state where they stand on the issue at present, one should not use that as leverage, since that can change.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Maybe it's time for the mods to lock this thread? The last hundred posts or so just seem to have turned into endless repetition and name calling. Contrary to what people on both sides of this argument seem to be saying, this forum does NOT allow pics of minors in sexually explicit situations (i.e., no nudity, or harder fetish situations). The current rules are a compromise which seems to be working adequately. Whether the policy stays there or is tightened is up the site owner and the mods. Is there really anything else left to be said?

This thread was about bringing up the dissatisfaction of the policy to the staff in the hopes that they would review it. Regardless of how this went down (or how it was started), that objective was met, as validated by Valerie stating that she and the staff will review the matter. Providing she was telling the truth and that was not merely an attempt to passify the disgruntled (I believe in her word and she's good for it), then all is well.

So, as far as I am concerned or care, its a success. The attention was paid to the issue, and I have no problem with having this closed at this point, either.

EDIT:

On a personal note, I do want to say that, had I been the one to make this thread and reside over it, rather than merely be a participant, all of this horrible name-calling and cut-throat anger would not have been allowed here. It would have been much more civil than it was. Be that as it may, however, some people did keep their cool and never made an emotional outburst. Thank you to those people, they're the ones who made some sense out of the craziness. 🙂

 

[Journia]

Then I have the last word!!!

 

[Zeratul1]

I cannot refute an opinion.

That's not my opinion, that's my take on the situation.

Come on! Debate with me. This is an intellectual topic that needs to be tossed back and forth in a lively manner... :sad:

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

That's not my opinion, that's my take on the situation.

Come on! Debate with me. :sad:

I cannot refute your take on the situation because its an opinion. To debase an opinion is impossible. Not only do I have no right to, it simply cannot be done. Perhaps, if I were some demi-god, but not in this mortal form. 🙁

We've got one set of people who don't want loli here and give logical, moral, and reasonable reasons for why it shouldn't be here, and we've got a set of people, who, I will admit, are inside the law, and in quoting the law, are able to get away with this.

Its a typical stalemate situation. We all knew that coming in. I restate though: the issue was brought to staff attention, notice, and consideration. In the end, aside from people agreeing to disagree, thats all I would have wanted, one way or the other.

 

[P[a]pi]

There have been many people who have all said one thing that I don't understand. These people say, "if it's not against the law then it's okay."

I personally don't think that the laws of countries always equal what is right. This thread should be about right and wrong, not legal and illegal.

I've just got one question for the people who don't think we have a problem on TT. The question is why? Why do you have to post or draw artwork of young children tickling each other and licking each others feet? Why can't you just post or draw artwork of the same situations, but with adults since adults are the ones who do these acts not kids. Kids never do what they are drawn doing here, it's unrealistic. If you have to see this stuff because it turns you on then that is wrong. And if it didn't turn you on then you wouldn't be fighting so hard to be able to see it. You are obviously getting some form of adult pleasure out of the artwork.

Do we really need a law to tell us that this is wrong. If a law passes tomorrow saying it's illegal will you agree that it is wrong now? Or will you say that it's still right, but you just obey laws. This is common sense stuff here. The law doesn't make something wrong, morallity and conscience make it wrong. This type of artwork is wrong regardless of the law.

 

[footamateur]

3 pages that if they would be deleted nobody would notice it...

Vlad that continue to try to explain stuff remaining so calm (buddy, how do you do that? have you a secret to stay so calm? 😀 lemme know the secret plz), K that started to be pissed (maybe the first time in more than 4 years here that i saw him like that); and seems that this discussion is going on a personal rail.

honestly was expecting new things, new stuff, new opinion, instead of this; maybe is like Ness said: this topic has reached the end.

I said what i had to say; i read the comments of the people that i respect and learned how other people, taht i never saw here, act and think, so basically instead of continuing to say stuff already said I prefer to stop to receive 30 emails with updates if the tone and the type of discussion start to be like the last 3 pages.

Have fun guys.

 

[Betchass1]

Maybe it's time for the mods to lock this thread?

Why post to it if you want it locked? lol let people have their discussions.

 

[Betchass1]

Why can't you just post or draw artwork of the same situations, but with adults since adults are the ones who do these acts not kids. Kids never do what they are drawn doing here, it's unrealistic.

You know little about child psychology. Didn't you ever get invited to parties?
I can remember one boy saying that one girl had pretty nice tits in 6th grade, 11 years old. It was one of the things we talked about most, and he didn't want her to feel left out. He was just saying it, but yes, some of my classmates were experimenting by then.
Some form of sexuality is present long before adolescence.

 

[Celtic_Emperor]

Vlad that continue to try to explain stuff remaining so calm (buddy, how do you do that? have you a secret to stay so calm? 😀 lemme know the secret plz),

There are three ways to deal with anger:

1.) You absorb it from others and yourself and you let it control you.

2.) You absorb and bottle it up without letting it control you (this leads to stress and its not healthy. You're also likely to explode later on and are more likely to hold grudges, and you'll be easier to set off and will have low-tolerance levels. We call these people "firecrackers", "loosecannons", and "short fuses") or

3.) You acknowledge the anger is there, you center yourself, and you redirect it away from the situation or into it in another form.

I am represented by the third option. In my case, I channel it into excess energy and willpower. Thats how I stay calm and keep going. Also, I'm just a patient person. I guess you can say that the angrier others get, the calmer I get. Thats probably why I seem subdued sometimes.

Its not full-proof, and it doesn't always work, and I'm glad that its that way. I am human, afterall. Besides, dealing with anger, especially rightious anger, is a normal part of life. Allowing yourself to be angry, hurt, and express anger is healthy, as long as you don't do it in excess, don't use it as a crutch, and you vent it appropriately.

 

[MistressValerie1]

I also think that artwork in general should be monitored more and I'm not knocking any of the artists here. What I'm really talking about is the extreme anime/hentai on TT that depicts young children.

... fully clothed and artwork of 6 to 15 year old little anime girls naked, bound, sweating and being tickled and or licked. And there are pics just like that on TT and I know some anime/hentai fans would get mad if they had to go, but they are just too extreme in my opinion.

Please report any such material, because nudity or explicit sexual activity (such as bondage or intercourse) involving obviously prepubescent drawn characters is NOT allowed here even under the current rules.

 

[MistressValerie1]

As always, Valerie remains a voice of calm reason. The policy she has outlined, here and elsewhere, strikes me as reasonable. If it becomes necessary to further tighten the policy, then it should be done. If not, leave things as they are.

Thank you.

This PPG series, though, I have to say has crossed the line.

Please report the specific posts that you believe are in violation and I will have a look myself. (I don't usually visit the art forums except when investigating a complaint.)

 

[MistressValerie1]

I've closed the thread for now, since it has devolved into personal mud-slinging and a debate about pedophilia rather than discussion of our content guidelines. However, please know that this issue is very important to me and my fellow admins, and we will be discussing it to see if we need to make any adjustments to our currently stated policies. We appreciate the input of everyone who remained on-topic.