The non-consensual crap

[rhiannon]

She may not have agreed to the extent that she got tickled

You know what? Compared to a lot of other videos, the tickling going on in that one was pretty lame and tame. I always thought she was behaving way over the top, additionally repeating the same sentences over and over again....

 

[rhiannon]

There is a story here on the TMF (circa 2005) where a bank employee continually tickled another employee despite her pleas for him not to do it. She eventually sued. She lost.

Seriously? I would imagine if someone continuously touches me although I tell them no, that would qualify as sexual harrassment! I know it does where I work.

 

[giggle-maker]

Ok, There is non-con in bondage vids, but the real acid-test is the fact that they are not tickling vids. They are BDSM vids where the dom just tickles the sub out of the blue. The reactions are serious and without question.

So yes, they do exist. But the Paradise non-con is a fake.

 

[stockytickler]

Except for a very specific subgroup (who also saw "Girl With a Dragon Tattoo" multiple times and will be responsible for a percentage of the DVD sales), real noncon isn't hot. In all reality it would be shrieking, sobbing, yelling and yeah, maybe some laughter, but really ugly, soul-churning stuff because a person has been kidnapped and restrained against their will and "hotness" is not a top priority for them. Instead you get scared, cringing, mewling and pathetic, which are meant as defense triggers and could even work if the tickler were not a psychopath, which is the other half of that equation.

If you encountered real noncon, what you would be looking at would be /evidence/.

In summary: Simulated noncon = hot. Real noncon = distressing .. for, y'know, human beings. }:|

 

[NY ler]

People have said that the prostitute from this video also appeared in other videos, but no one has any clips?

 

[Libertine]

No-one is going to be stupid enough to film themselves committing a crime, then crown their imbecility by posting the proof on the net. And a release signed under duress is worthless in a court of law, so the production company could be sued/charged by any law enforcement agency willing to do so even without the model herself undertaking a lawsuit. If you knew how many excellent actors can't find proper work in the legitimate areas of the profession you'd understand how some stray into adult films and are capable of giving very convincing performances indeed. Can we please let this one die?

 

[jhop220]

I never liked the idea of Non-Con videos. I understand the FANTASY of Non-Con, but the true ones really do absolutely nothing for me. I am the exact opposite on this spectrum. I like pure consensual tickling. I like it when the women beg for more, or are clearly turned on by tickling. I guess it plays into the foreplay before the main event for me.

That is why I stay clear of Skylreta (can't spell) videos. The first Non-Con video I saw literally had the woman yelling "Get the fuck off me." while screaming "Fuck You." Hardly any laughter, but pure rage and disdain.

It does nothing for me because I think the woman should want it or consent to it.

 

[rhiannon]

The first Non-Con video I saw literally had the woman yelling "Get the fuck off me." while screaming "Fuck You." Hardly any laughter, but pure rage and disdain.

I think you're talking about the fake one there.

 

[jhop220]

I think you're talking about the fake one there.

maybe so, but it was something that just didn't appeal to me. It seemed when I first saw it and that was enough for me to fold on Non-Con Fantasy or Real situations.

 

[maniactickler]

I think you're talking about the fake one there.

That was as real as the day is long!

 

[kcantankerous]

No-one is going to be stupid enough to film themselves committing a crime, then crown their imbecility by posting the proof on the net. And a release signed under duress is worthless. If you knew how many excellent actors can't find proper work in the legitimate areas of the profession you'd understand how some stray into adult films and are capable of giving very convincing performances indeed. Can we please let this one die?

Oh yes some people would in fact be that stupid.

Thanks,
K

 

[stockytickler]

People film all sorts of stuff with whatever intention. I did, for example, mention that subgroup that /would/ provide a market for snuff/rape/noncon/kiddie ... people are willing to pay enough, people will craft the product. It's ugly, you're not going to find it on Netflix, and I'd personally rephrase it from "stupid" to "evil," but yeah, there are people who are that evil.

 

[kcantankerous]

People film all sorts of stuff with whatever intention. I did, for example, mention that subgroup that /would/ provide a market for snuff/rape/noncon/kiddie ... people are willing to pay enough, people will craft the product. It's ugly, you're not going to find it on Netflix, and I'd personally rephrase it from "stupid" to "evil," but yeah, there are people who are that evil.

I like your comment earlier about "how if the non con clips were real, than the view would be watch evidence" (I know this isn't the exact quote you used.) It is very true.

Thanks,
K

 

[stockytickler]

I just think it would be obvious, and it would be awful. The victim would be causing themselves pain in their struggle to free themselves, they'd be screaming themselves hoarse for help, they'd be crying. It would be the total opposite of "Help! Stop! hahaha!" It would basically hurt your soul to watch it. imo.

 

[rhiannon]

That was as real as the day is long!

We're talking about this clip forever and there are a million good reasons that already showed why it's not real, but I will not list them all again. 🙂 You believe what makes you happy! 🙂

 

[coldneck]

Well...maybe if she is afraid to be on the edge, you should respect that! It is not your place to decide when enough is enough - that decision is hers and hers only!

WRONG! She's a paid employee.
She signed up to do a job.
The decision is her boss's alone.
Think of it as an occupational hazard.
As long as she's not injured, the employer is not liable.
Labor Law 101 is over for the day.

 

[giggle-maker]

That is why I stay clear of Skylreta (can't spell) videos. The first Non-Con video I saw literally had the woman yelling "Get the fuck off me." while screaming "Fuck You." Hardly any laughter, but pure rage and disdain.

I think you're talking about the fake one there.

That was as real as the day is long!

We're talking about this clip forever and there are a million good reasons that already showed why it's not real, but I will not list them all again. 🙂 You believe what makes you happy! 🙂

The Paradise vid is fake. I haven't seen the Skelerata vid.

 

[rhiannon]

WRONG! She's a paid employee.
She signed up to do a job.
The decision is her boss's alone.
Think of it as an occupational hazard.
As long as she's not injured, the employer is not liable.
Labor Law 101 is over for the day.

In any job that I know, I as an employer always, at any point of time, have the option to say "I don't want to do it any longer, I quit". Same thing here.

 

[Phineas]

In any job that I know, I as an employer always, at any point of time, have the option to say "I don't want to do it any longer, I quit". Same thing here.

True, but as I pointed out when Jeff brought up the whole "fuck safewords" thing way back when, producers can only bend over so far backwards to cover their asses. You can spend an hour going over all the minutae, provide a safeword, make the model sign a detailed waiver that expressly states that she, of sound mind and body, fully understands that she is about to be tortured within an inch of her life and consents to same, and be reminded twice over that the only thing that she can say that will make it stop is the safeword... and then after the session she can decide the tickler went too far, claim she didn't know what she was getting into, or that she didn't really mean it, or not use the safeword and still expect him to stop when she thinks it's "obvious" that she needs him to.

I used to do programming on contract for a guy who ran a boudoir photography business, and he had tales upon tales of girls who would come in, all excited to do sexy photos for her boyfriend, and then come back a week later with said angry boyfriend in tow because he got pissed that she showed some stranger her ho-ho's on camera and she lied to cover her ass and said it was all the photographer's idea. People change their story after the fact, and models can be some of the flakiest people you'll ever meet. Producers have to be able to cover their asses against this sort of thing somehow, no?

 

[rhiannon]

Phineas,

unfortunately I can't find the original posting where I was quoted from, but I think I remember that it was pertaining to a situation without a safeword or a model changing her mind midways wanting to stop the shoot. Personally I believe the model should be able to say "I'm out" at any point of time. Anything else would just be illegal. And the model should decide when she's had enough, not the person tickling her. How can they judge when it's enough, they aren't in the situation!

 

[BigJim]

No-one is going to be stupid enough to film themselves committing a crime, then crown their imbecility by posting the proof on the net.

It happens frequently, Jon. People are always getting arrested and prosecuted for internet-film legal transgressions far worse than tickling against consent.

And a release signed under duress is worthless in a court of law,

Going with "kayfabe as real" (for the sake of argument), in both the TC and original PV non-con releases, the signature was said to have been obtained in the weeks after the actual filming, which would quite possibly have made a charge of duress very hard to prove.

 

[Cosmo_ac]

In any job that I know, I as an employer always, at any point of time, have the option to say "I don't want to do it any longer, I quit". Same thing here.

Pretty much. Labor laws allow people to quiet anytime they want.

 

[maniactickler]

We're talking about this clip forever and there are a million good reasons that already showed why it's not real, but I will not list them all again. 🙂 You believe what makes you happy! 🙂

If it is fake, that hooker should get an Academy award for best actress.

 

[coldneck]

In any job that I know, I as an employer always, at any point of time, have the option to say "I don't want to do it any longer, I quit". Same thing here.

You would be the "employee", not the employer. Big difference.

You also signed a contract, so you are considered "contract labor".

If you want to break the contract and terminate your employment, you may do so, but don't expect to be paid.

As far as a producer "going to far," you are going to be hard pressed to prove anything and your case probably won't even see a courtroom.

"So you allowed the defendant to restrain you and tickle you for a fetish video?"
"Yes your honor, but not that much. He tickled me too much and he didn't stop when I wanted him to."
"Case dismissed"

Expect to see this in Chuck Sheppard's 'News of the Weird'.

 

[Phineas]

Phineas,

unfortunately I can't find the original posting where I was quoted from, but I think I remember that it was pertaining to a situation without a safeword or a model changing her mind midways wanting to stop the shoot. Personally I believe the model should be able to say "I'm out" at any point of time. Anything else would just be illegal. And the model should decide when she's had enough, not the person tickling her. How can they judge when it's enough, they aren't in the situation!

Right, but my point was, if the only way the producer can know that the model truly needs to stop is the safeword, and she doesn't use it, she can't later decide the producer did stuff to her against her will - especially when the whole point of the shoot is to have her begging for mercy in an authentic fashion. That's not fair to the producer.

I do fully agree that a model should be able to change her mind and stop if she realizes she can't/won't handle it, but given that we keep talking, in threads like this, about the producer being open to possible criminal action as a result of what is essentially someone doing a 180 about consent on a weird whim (and like I said before, not only does it happen, but people are perfectly willing to lie about it to cover their asses), there's got to be a way for them to legally say "look, I followed all of the guidelines I was supposed to follow, so you can't sue me for this". Otherwise, all it would take is one court case to pretty much kill our little industry, aye? No producer in their right mind would want to keep doing this once one or two of them went to jail.