what happened to clips4sale????

[kingmaker]

For the delays they asked us to agree to make an audit of our content to unblock the payout. But no time-frame specified yet

 

[U.N.Owen]

For the delays they asked us to agree to make an audit of our content to unblock the payout. But no time-frame specified yet

Maybe they're realizing they're endangering their own site if they wreck most of the content it hosts? Though if so, that realization seems to be coming rather late. (It's clearly all being driven by the payment platforms, but there's compliance and over-compliance.)

 

[BBGuy5240]

I'm not optimistic, but it would be nice if the lightbulb went off over at C4S that they're just damaging their own site by purging like 90% of the content on their side. I may have been a little off by going directly at C4S, but still, it seems like they have not handled this well regarding how their talking to content creators. From what I've been seeing from creators who talk about this upcoming purge, their anger seems far more directed at C4S than at the payment platforms.

 

[U.N.Owen]

I'm not optimistic, but it would be nice if the lightbulb went off over at C4S that they're just damaging their own site by purging like 90% of the content on their side. I may have been a little off by going directly at C4S, but still, it seems like they have not handled this well regarding how their talking to content creators. From what I've been seeing from creators who talk about this upcoming purge, their anger seems far more directed at C4S than at the payment platforms.

As I understand it, the pressure to "do something" is coming from the payment platforms, but the feeling among producers is that C4S is responding with a sledgehammer.

 

[BBGuy5240]

I agree 100%. There's got to be a better way than "We just gotta purge everything". I'm hoping with everything that something can be worked out as we head into this purge, but I'm not optimistic at all. And while I understand that C4S is facing pressure, some things that I've noticed during the past couple years I think are just silly.

Like for example, this is something I noticed a couple months ago. We've all seen clips where it's a therapy setting and someone plays the role of a persons therapist. Well when searching for clips, you can search the word "Therapy" and clips will come up without issue. But if you search the word "Therapist", you get a 404/broken page. It took me a minute to catch what the issue likely is. The search likely sees what the final 6 letters in the word spell out. So yeah, I think C4S at times is responding to things in a matter that's too absolute.

 

[Tickle Lover 1]

I was more concerned about the "Exclusive offer for you!" page you get directed to after making a purchase.

Spoiler Alert - the "Exclusive Offer" is they ask you to tip the video producer.

 

[kingmaker]

It also feels very backwards : The EU is trying to impose platform responsibility over Creator responsibility, but the US is currently trying to sanctify Section 230 (from what I understood, the Big tech behind President Trump is pushing for that).

Even at my small scale, I encountered many horror stories on c4s since 2021 :

• A video filmed on the street could never get published because we could see cleaning staff far away, even blurred, nothing to do.
• I sometimes had to cut and censor videos on c4s because it was a custom story involving giving money to the model to convince her to be tickled
• Contracts signed on an Ipad stopped being valid one day, unless authentified on paying platforms that cost an arm
• If your video gets flagged on upload, re-verification is super slow, ticket system does not work. at least for me. Better to delete and re-upload than dealing with the support
• My cats meowing flagged a video for featuring a baby, and if they pop in the background I need to blur them
• Sometimes they confuse people with their facial recognition and will ask for more "performers profile"
• And of course a lot of words are flagged, as I said the word Wrapped is like banned because of the similarity with "rapped". 😵

I tried until last year to tell them about these issues so that they can improve their platform and processes, but nothing changed yet.

Yet I understand that if they loose their payment processor, it is game over for everyone. So Complying is the least bad option. I would just hope that they comply more smartly

 

[kingmaker]

By the way from what I understand, they still did not deploy all the tools to enforce their policy update, they are going to deploy something for models to have a profile on c4s and we can ask for their consent simply. This will be live in April, meaning the cleanup will probably start in May or later.

In 2021, they warned us at least 2 months in advance that we will need to upload IDs of models

 

[kingmaker]

But if you search the word "Therapist", you get a 404/broken page. It took me a minute to catch what the issue likely is. The search likely sees what the final 6 letters in the word spell out. So yeah, I think C4S at times is responding to things in a matter that's too absolute.

Damn this would have never come to my mind lol.
The good way of handling this would be to have the videos flagged for a thorough Review and then approved by moderation. That's clearly a bug and not a feature

 

[U.N.Owen]

By the way from what I understand, they still did not deploy all the tools to enforce their policy update, they are going to deploy something for models to have a profile on c4s and we can ask for their consent simply. This will be live in April, meaning the cleanup will probably start in May or later.

In 2021, they warned us at least 2 months in advance that we will need to upload IDs of models

Does that mean having to go back and ask for consent from models from years ago that the producers can no longer contact, despite having the original contract and proof of age on file? Or would that only be if there isn't proof of ID that can be provided?

 

[kingmaker]

if you have the documents and they are already uploaded you are fine. But a lot of producers did not take pictures of models ID and simply checked them before 2021. Shooting a video back then was like serving alcohol, you check the ID when you have a doubt. Plus they signed a contract stating they are over 18.

For producers that have missing IDs, it means trying to go talk to your old models and try to convince them to send you a pic of their ID.

Any model where you did not take ID and / or contract, the video will go away from c4s. Even if they are clearly 50 years old they are presumed to be underage.
If you have a video with 3 or 4 models and one is missing a document, the video will be gone as well.

 

[U.N.Owen]

Yes it means trying to go talk to your old models and try to convince them to send you a pic of their ID.

Any model where you did not take ID and / or contract, the video will go away from c4s. Even if they are clearly 50 years old they are presumed to be underage

So at least where producers do have ID and/or contract from however long ago, C4S will still accept that?

 

[kingmaker]

Of course but you need both.

 

[U.N.Owen]

Of course but you need both.

Right, both contract and a copy of ID.

At least that does make sense as a policy... though they should have been consistent all along and not changed rules retroactively.

And thanks for the edited reply above. That made the situation much clearer.

 

[BBGuy5240]

By the way from what I understand, they still did not deploy all the tools to enforce their policy update, they are going to deploy something for models to have a profile on c4s and we can ask for their consent simply. This will be live in April, meaning the cleanup will probably start in May or later.

In 2021, they warned us at least 2 months in advance that we will need to upload IDs of models

If this is the case, hopefully C4S can come up with some response that doesn't cripple so many of the creators. I get that C4S is in a tight spot, but a purge simply isn't the answer. I'm still not too optimistic though.

Damn this would have never come to my mind lol.
The good way of handling this would be to have the videos flagged for a thorough Review and then approved by moderation. That's clearly a bug and not a feature

Regardless, this is something they need to fix. Content creators can't change what words may have in them, or what words may sound like. Like I said, things are too absolute. There should be room for context.

 

[U.N.Owen]

If this is the case, hopefully C4S can come up with some response that doesn't cripple so many of the creators. I get that C4S is in a tight spot, but a purge simply isn't the answer. I'm still not too optimistic though.

Particularly because C4S was itself up and running while these older producers were producing and the producers were following its own rules at the time. The requirement for a copy of ID makes sense, but "actually our rules 20 years ago are now different than what we told you they were 20 years ago" is a problem.

 

[SadCuzNotTcklsh]

Would all this mean the videos are still there if you have the video link? That is the case now for vis pre-2010 I think?
Is there a way to download an entire c4s store for future use in case most of it gets removed?

 

[kingmaker]

The videos will be removed, period. It’s up to creators to find a solution to sell their old content (if they even want to)

 

[U.N.Owen]

The videos will be removed, period. It’s up to creators to find a solution to sell their old content (if they even want to)

And it sounds as if some creators don't even have their old content stored anywhere other than C4S.

 

[BBGuy5240]

Particularly because C4S was itself up and running while these older producers were producing and the producers were following its own rules at the time. The requirement for a copy of ID makes sense, but "actually our rules 20 years ago are now different than what we told you they were 20 years ago" is a problem.

For sure. I'm not at all against asking for further I.D. It's the change affecting older content that I'm against. Models come and go every day, and it's downright impossible for some of them who've been out of the industry for so long to be contacted today. It should be set up so content prior to these changes aren't affected. It's just not fair to the producers at the end of the day.

And it sounds as if some creators don't even have their old content stored anywhere other than C4S.

Most don't. That's something I've been hearing a lot from creators who've been vocal about what's going on. And in their defense, I get it. You obviously never know what's coming, but I don't think anyone thought that a purge like this would happen. Older content shouldn't be affected like this.

 

[kingmaker]

Producers that’s don’t have a backup platform I understand, but using the platform instead of a proper backup solution is really dumb

 

[BBGuy5240]

Producers that’s don’t have a backup platform I understand, but using the platform instead of a proper backup solution is really dumb

I agree that they should've backed up their stuff somewhere. Because like I said, at the end of the day you never know what's coming in the future. I'm still more sympathetic to the creators than anything else. Because this is a massive change in policy, and the creators get the short end of the stick when it's all said and done.

One of my favorite creators is TickleTown, and now I'm really glad that he not only kept all his context backed up, he remained at his own site. He never joined C4S as far as I know. He went away for a couple years, but he's now back with his own site that has all of his older tickle clips available for streaming if you subscribe to the site. And who knows if his vids would survive this new C4S thing. Damn near of the models he worked with were "Girl Next Door" types. Except for Jasmine Mendez and Kimberly Marvel. Mendez is still around, but Kimberly Marvel has been out of the industry for over a decade. So getting in contact with like 99% of the girls he worked with is likely downright impossible at this point.

 

[U.N.Owen]

I agree that they should've backed up their stuff somewhere. Because like I said, at the end of the day you never know what's coming in the future. I'm still more sympathetic to the creators than anything else. Because this is a massive change in policy, and the creators get the short end of the stick when it's all said and done.

One of my favorite creators is TickleTown, and now I'm really glad that he not only kept all his context backed up, he remained at his own site. He never joined C4S as far as I know. He went away for a couple years, but he's now back with his own site that has all of his older tickle clips available for streaming if you subscribe to the site. And who knows if his vids would survive this new C4S thing. Damn near of the models he worked with were "Girl Next Door" types. Except for Jasmine Mendez and Kimberly Marvel. Mendez is still around, but Kimberly Marvel has been out of the industry for over a decade. So getting in contact with like 99% of the girls he worked with is likely downright impossible at this point.

I too am very glad Oblesklk brought Tickle Town back online. He even upscaled the quality of the old videos via the streaming website - they look amazing. Oblesklk said specifically that he wanted to avoid C4S. He was on Patreon before he opened the new site last fall, and they made it a complete nightmare - even though he does have all the documentation C4S is now demanding, and more. (Discussing this whole situation last night, he said that he not only took photos of models' IDs, he took photos of the models holding the same ID, just to be safe, and got a signed contract and a signed release. But Patreon was determined to deny him hosting service and claimed his contracts had to include the Patreon web address in their text - even though his videos were made long before Patreon existed. So he wouldn't need to contact his old models to satisfy C4S... though if that were demanded, it couldn't be done. He's had no contact with any of them for more than 10 years.)

 

[U.N.Owen]

Producers that’s don’t have a backup platform I understand, but using the platform instead of a proper backup solution is really dumb

It was certainly inadvisable to not have any backup. Though given how old C4S is and that many producers have been hosting their material there since they started out, it's not surprising.

 

[SoleMates]

But a lot of producers did not take pictures of models ID and simply checked them before 2021. Shooting a video back then was like serving alcohol, you check the ID when you have a doubt. Plus they signed a contract stating they are over 18.

I'm sorry, but that is beyond stupid.

I've been shooting since 2013 and even with the barest amount of research I did on the topic I knew that keeping a copy of the ID on file was 100% required. As much as I defend producers on random shit I will never sympathize with anyone who simply doesn't have the records. Before 2021? Zero. Excuse. ZE-RO. Only the laziest possible interpretation of the 2257 code would even hint that you didn't need a copy of the ID. Anyone with half a brain would do it as a matter of routine CYA.

I'm surprise to hear TickleTown had so much trouble on Patreon. I ran an adult-material page there for Sole Males for a li'l less than two years (closed in down in September of '24) and it was completely painless. Nobody so much as asked for paperwork. Now OnlyFans, on the other hand, they flat-out said "we can't be bothered to verify your entire roster. Denied."

Trust me, if I could score similar sales and traffic - such as it is - from sites other than C4S I'd expand, but I've had to shut down accounts on a handful of other sites over the years due to a total lack of income. For me, it's C4S or nothing.

That said, only problem I've ever had with compliance that was unjustified was how they started cracking down on the fact that I included a phone number in the legally-required contact information at the end of the video. It's clearly labeled as 2257 compliance information, was never a problem for twelve-some-odd years, but all of a sudden I started having videos denied for it. I was usually able to get them to re-approve, but eventually I just said fuck it and removed the number. The address is still there, and they don't seem to care about that.

Generally speaking I'm all for improved enforcement of compliance as long as it's consistent. Problem is, it's not (re: phone numbers).

Oh well. Less competition after the purge I guess.