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Any Kilt-Fanciers?

Icycle said:
I find it kind of strange and sad that American mainstream culture doesn't really let men enjoy the unconstrained comfort of non-legged clothing, given the anatomical differences between men and women.
Just in case anyone was unclear, what Icycle's trying to say is, "the boys need their space." :shock:

Icycle said:
I own a couple of Utilikilts, and I would love to wear them more often, but my wife won't let me wear them out with her. Sometimes I wear them to work though. They are very comfortable and stylish.
Dammit. Now I'm going to have to let him wear them, just because drew70 wouldn't like it. 😀 Well played honey, well played. :Kiss2:
 
Wow. Not only the self appointed moral police, but the self appointed culture police now too! Up next: Mens Poker Nights are for queers! 🙄

Kilts rock. I'd HARDLY classify Red, Dan, Dave, Icycle, or DVNC as "metro-sexual drag queens". More like manly enough to do and wear what they want without giving a rats ass about what insecure homophobes might think. You go boys. :smilelove
 
Moral police....culture police....Would either of those be anything like the OPINION POLICE? You know, those who decide which opinions are suitable and do their best to enforce them?
 
Something like that. Can't have one without the other. :wavingguy
 
:::wearing official OPINION POLICE helmet, complete with red light and siren:::

:blaugh: Love ya, Meemers.

See, but the cool thing about the OPINION POLICE is that you can see them coming. They always post under the same screen name. :evilha:
 
AffectionateDan said:
See, but the cool thing about the OPINION POLICE is that you can see them coming. They always post under the same screen name. :evilha:
Well, these days they do, anyway.

:cuddle: and :tickle: to Le Mimi. And :wub: to Lindy on my behalf as well as Icycle's.
 
Whoopsie! Clumsy me!

Found this and just hadda share... :bump:
<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/oFpzXmsP0cc&rel=1&border=0"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/oFpzXmsP0cc&rel=1&border=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent"width="425" height="355"></embed></object>
 
Not only do I think kilts - and Utilikilts- are sexy as hell, I actually like just a plain old regular skirt on a guy. They do make sense for comfort (assuming they're the long flowing sort and not the tight mini sort) and the one or two men I've known who have worn them have had a wicked self confidence that pulls me in like magnet.

I did a college weekend at a seriously liberal arty school in the mountains of western NC and when we pulled into the place, my dad and I saw a guy with gorgeous long hair and a gorgeous long skirt. Dad decided right then and there that I wouldn't be attending that school but he did leave me for the weekend because he had a golf trip planned. I sure do wish I'd gone there.
 
One Halloween I cross-dressed for my costume, and I wore a broomstick skirt. It was the most comfortable lower-body garment I've ever worn. Sadly, though I have the confidence to walk around in public in a male garment like a kilt, I wouldn't feel comfortable walking around in a women's skirt.

There was a guy in my University who wore broomstick skirts all the time. He was tall, bearded, and wore heavy boots, so he pulled it off without looking feminine at all.
 
LOL. Great commercial, Dan. I can't wait to get mine, so that I too can finally be respected as a violent cross-dressing psychopath. :blaugh:
 
One Halloween I cross-dressed for my costume, and I wore a broomstick skirt. It was the most comfortable lower-body garment I've ever worn.

I remember that Halloween. Making out with you, realistic falsies and all, kooked me out. 😀

I can't wait to get mine, so that I too can finally be respected as a violent cross-dressing psychopath. :blaugh:

A violent traditional-male-garment-wearing psychopath WITH A HOT ACCENT! And that makes all the difference! :xpulcy:
 
A violent traditional-male-garment-wearing psychopath WITH A HOT ACCENT! And that makes all the difference! :xpulcy:
So the kilt and the accent are so attractive that you can overlook violent psychotic behavior? Or do you find that attractive as well? :illogical
 
So the kilt and the accent are so attractive that you can overlook violent psychotic behavior? Or do you find that attractive as well? :illogical

I found it funny. I'm pretty sure that's the typical, and intended, response to the Mockumercial. I don't think viewers are supposed to seriously entertain the notion that kilts are actually associated with violent behavior. 😛
 
I found it funny. I'm pretty sure that's the typical, and intended, response to the Mockumercial. I don't think viewers are supposed to seriously entertain the notion that kilts are actually associated with violent behavior. 😛
You're sidestepping the question. Did you find the guy hot, or not? Was he hot in spite of his violent psychotic behavior or because of it?

No, they don't want people to associate their kilts with violent behavior. They want people to associate kilts with pure masculinity, and they go to ridiculous lengths to make their point, which they wouldn't have to do if kilts were even half as masculine as they try to make them out to be.

These mockumercials (a term I couldn't find in any dictionary) sink to new depths in insulting the the viewers, that they would be more accurately referred to as fuckyoumercials. They are reminiscent of the TV commercials from the 60s in which advertisers would try to get a guy to believe that if you smoke their cigarette, drink their beer, or wear their cologne, you'll get lots of chicks. Ultimately this strategy backfired. People began refusing to buy the products because nobody wanted to look stupid or desperate enough to have fallen for such shallow and transparent advertising gimmicks.

Most of the women I know wear pants exclusively, by choice, even when dressing for office work. Think about it. If non-bifurcated garments are all the rage that Utilikilts advertizers would have us believe, why is it that the majority of women in America prefer pants?

And finally, exactly what physical attributes differentiate a kilt from a skirt?
 
You're sidestepping the question. Did you find the guy hot, or not? Was he hot in spite of his violent psychotic behavior or because of it?

I only ever said the accent was hot. But the person bearing it in the case was appealing because he made me laugh. Real psychopaths are not hot. This clip pokes fun at both kilts, and the stupid prejudices of anti-kilt people like, well, you. I think you're taking it way too seriously as far as whatever political point it's supposedly trying to make.

I'm also sorry if I offended your delicate sensibilities with my use of the slang term "mockumercial." Clearly, the fact that you couldn't find it in the dictionary bolsters your argument in some way. 😛

As for the factual stuff regarding what kilts are and why men like to wear them, I'll leave that to one of the men to cover. I believe it has something to do with having a penis and testicles. Anyway, there might be somebody out there who still wants to bother trying to get through to you, so I'll leave well enough alone. 🙄
 
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Most of the women I know wear pants exclusively, by choice, even when dressing for office work. Think about it. If non-bifurcated garments are all the rage that Utilikilts advertizers would have us believe, why is it that the majority of women in America prefer pants?

Well, ahem, I don't know how to tell you this Drew, but there's a bit of an anatomical difference, you know, down there. I'd say pants are a much more natural fit for women. 🙂

And finally, exactly what physical attributes differentiate a kilt from a skirt?

As far as I understand the term, skirt is a somewhat generic term, though most definitions of skirt are restricted to garments intended to be worn by women and girls. Furthermore a kilt is a very distinctive garment that has a number of characteristics that define it as a kilt and simultaneously distinguish it from other similar garments.

Wikipedia has a quite nice summary of the distinguishing features of a traditional Scottish kilt, which happen to apply quite nicely to my more modern Utilikilts as well. They are tailored garments (as opposed to loose fitting or free flowing). They wrap around the wearer's body, starting on the wearer's left side, around the front and back, and across the front again to the opposite side. The two layers of cloth in front are fastened together. They cover the legs to just above the knees. The overlapping layers of fabric in front are flat, while the single layers of fabric on the sides and in back are pleated.
 
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As far as I understand the term, skirt is a somewhat generic term, though most definitions of skirt are restricted to garments intended to be worn by women and girls. Furthermore a kilt is a very distinctive garment that has a number of characteristics that define it as a kilt and simultaneously distinguish it from other similar garments.
A kilt is distinguished from a skirt in the same way that women's pants are distinguished from men's pants: mainly the cut of the garment.

I suppose Drew might not be aware of it, but the pants that he's seen all those women wearing likely wouldn't fit him very well (even assuming they were sized to his waist and inseam). They're cut differently because a woman's hips and waist and thighs relate differently to one another than a man's do. Of course some women deliberately buy and wear men's pants (this is especially common for blue jeans), but that just points up the difference.

The makers of Utilikilts point this out on their website, in the FAQ about kilts for women. They say "Sizing is gonna be tough. Especially if yer a curvy girl. See, our kilts are cut very straight. They are not made for your lovely hips. So if you wear one of our kilts, you want to wear it low on your hips, like low-rise jeans."

The Utilikilts folks are happy to sell their kilts to women (money knows no gender, after all), but they have a firm policy against tailoring them to fit a woman's body. They're a male garment, and made to be so.

Calling a kilt a skirt is like calling a kimono a bathrobe. It betrays a basic lack of clue about the history, structure, and use of the garment. When carries the idea so far that he deliberately misinterprets a commercial as literal fact, it leaves me wondering just what is threatening him so deeply.
 
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Speaking of bathrobes Redmage, have you noticed they are called bathrobes regardless of whether they are made for men or women? Using the same terminology for both men's and women's clothing is not as novel a concept as you would seem to have us think. We don't call pants something different simply because they are taylored for the opposite sex. We can still call them pants regardless of whether they are tailored for a man or a woman. In fact, the same is true of shoes, sweaters, vests, blazers, shorts, socks, coats, gloves, sweatshirts, boots, watches, slippers, belts, and caps, sandals, earrings, and mittens.

So why is it so unreasonable to call a skirt that's tailored for men a skirt? Face it. A kilt is a specific type of skirt.

By the way, here's a more realistic look at the reactions guys get for wearing kilts. Take note of the closing comments.

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Speaking of bathrobes Redmage, have you noticed they are called bathrobes regardless of whether they are made for men or women? Using the same terminology for both men's and women's clothing is not as novel a concept as you would seem to have us think. We don't call pants something different simply because they are taylored for the opposite sex. We can still call them pants regardless of whether they are tailored for a man or a woman. In fact, the same is true of shoes, sweaters, vests, blazers, shorts, socks, coats, gloves, sweatshirts, boots, watches, slippers, belts, and caps, sandals, earrings, and mittens.

While a skirt and a kilt may look similar, they have independent origins in distinct cultural traditions. It is not simply a skirt tailored to fit a man. The fact that it looks similar a modern garment that you would call a skirt is just a coincidence. The history of the kilt in its modern form goes back at least to the 18th century, but women in Western society didn't start wearing garments that resemble modern skirts until well into the 20th century.


So why is it so unreasonable to call a skirt that's tailored for men a skirt? Face it. A kilt is a specific type of skirt.

Because a kilt is not a skirt, no more than a dolphin is a fish just because it has a similar shape.

There are in fact men who cross-dress in women's skirts, and there are even skirts designed for men:

http://www.anderslandinger.com/

But a kilt is a distinct and very specific garment.

By the way, here's a more realistic look at the reactions guys get for wearing kilts. Take note of the closing comments.

I suppose if you hang around with homophobic, insecure, immature idiots, then this may be the kind of reaction you might expect. But I'd hardly call that a typical reaction. More like what you'd expect at your local college fraternity house.

I believe you've mentioned that you would never wear a kilt yourself, nor have you ever seen anyone wear one, so that suggests that you have no idea how most real people would really react.

As I've mentioned many times before, I regularly wear a kilt in public, at work, at dance events, and just today at the local shopping mall.

At the mall today, most people took no notice all. And those who did notice, were merely curious about it. Not a single person mocked me or my kilt. Not to my face, nor within eyeshot of me. If the mall isn't a relatively typical slice of America, then I don't know what is.

I'm not entirely certain why your masculinity is so threatened by kilts and the men who wear them, but I don't particularly care. As I've also mentioned before, my kilt gets me lots of positive attention from the women I hang around with, so I'm perfectly comfortable wearing one!
 
I'm not entirely certain why your masculinity is so threatened by kilts and the men who wear them, but I don't particularly care. As I've also mentioned before, my kilt gets me lots of positive attention from the women I hang around with, so I'm perfectly comfortable wearing one!
LOL. You guys always stoop to the same old innuendo. Homophobia. Threatened masculinity. Hey, I could walk out in the middle of Times Square in a lavender tutu singing "Everything's Coming Up Roses" and my masculinity would not be threatened, though I doubt the same could be said about my reputation.

It's not about homophobia or threatened masculinity. Sleeping with Lorena Bobbit - THAT's threatened masculinity. Wearing a kilt is a threat to one's fashion image. If I were to see a guy in a skirt, kilt, or whatever you're comfortable calling it (WHO's masculinity is threatened, I wonder?) I would be seeing somebody starved for attention. Something that radically out-of-step with mainstream dress style is tantamount to a lonely cry, "Look at ME! See how SPECIAL I am!" A guy wearing pants and a shirt? That tells me, "Hey, if you want to know what's special about me, you're going to have to get to know me." This is a guy who's comfortable with who he is and doesn't need a gimmick to attract friends and lovers.

A long time buddy of mine was stationed in Denver in the early 80s. He used to attend showings of the cult flick Rocky Horror every weekend. At this particular theater, people would act out the parts on the stage in sync with the movie on the screen behind them. This buddy of mine used to play the part of Frankenfurter in full costume and full makeup. Lipstick, eye shadow, rouge, the works. It doesn't get any more drag than Frankenfurter. Long story short, this buddy of mine got laid by incredibly hot chicks after every show. They all wanted a piece of him.

I tell that story to demonstrate that positive attention from women doesn't preclude effeminacy. Wearing something bizarre like a kilt can definitely get a guy favorable attention from the ladies. The question is, what kind of guy wants to resort to something like that? Can you spell desperation?
 
LOL. You guys always stoop to the same old innuendo. Homophobia. Threatened masculinity.

Dude! What do you call this:

LOL. I hear these things are really popular for released convicts who are still into the prison lifestyle. They love that quick easy access. :blaugh:

That's not even innuendo, man. That's flat out stating that kilts should be popular among the ass-fucking set.

I'm pretty sure the only person reading this thread who believes your comments are not homophobic is you, so I'll not waste my time trying to convince anyone else.

If I were to see a guy in a skirt, kilt, or whatever you're comfortable calling it (WHO's masculinity is threatened, I wonder?) I would be seeing somebody starved for attention. Something that radically out-of-step with mainstream dress style is tantamount to a lonely cry, "Look at ME! See how SPECIAL I am!"

Well, that's what you would see. OTOH, I spent three hours in a shopping mall with a kilt-clad Icycle yesterday, and what I saw was... well, nothing. If I'd filmed it, I could post the video on YouTube, but it would have been awfully boring: just two people shopping. We didn't actually garner attention of any kind, so I wouldn't advocate wearing a kilt as a strategy to get people to notice you. Wearing a kilt isn't the same as dressing in drag; normal people realize that and react accordingly.

I tell that story to demonstrate that positive attention from women doesn't preclude effeminacy. Wearing something bizarre like a kilt can definitely get a guy favorable attention from the ladies. The question is, what kind of guy wants to resort to something like that? Can you spell desperation?

And now we see a hairpin change in tactics: now that drew can no longer claim that most people, including women, would shun a kilt-wearer, he now claims that wearing kilts must be a desperate ploy for female attention. Please. These women encounter a man in a kilt, and they see someone who wears what he wants, without worrying what some homophobic, conservative idiot will think. A kilt demonstrates the presence of a self-confident, secure male. And that's hot. :justlips:
 
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And now we see a hairpin change in tactics: now that drew can no longer claim that most people, including women, would shun a kilt-wearer, he now claims that wearing kilts must be a desperate ploy for female attention.
It's an odd claim in and of itself. A "desperation move" is the sort of thing someone does when nothing else is working. So one would have to believe that a man who has nothing else to recommend him would suddenly become a babe-magnet by donning a kilt.

I wonder what Drew thinks of women, that he supposes it would work that way. Although I can't say that I wonder enough to actually ask him. "New Drew" was nice while it lasted, but the old habits seem to die hard. How much more of your time is it worth to argue against arguments that refute themselves?
 
Ah, Lindy. I knew you'd be back, despite your claim that you were "done trying to get through to me." 😀
That's not even innuendo, man. That's flat out stating that kilts are popular among the ass-fucking set.
That was my response to the muckumercial's suggestion that Kilt-wearers are uber-manly, take-no-shit ass-kickers. After all, where would such violence ultimately lead a guy, if not prison? :jester:

LindyHopper said:
I'm pretty sure the only person reading this thread who believes your comments are not homophobic is you, so I'll not waste my time trying to convince anyone else.
You're free to your opinions of course, but claiming to speak for everyone else reading this thread is rather arrogant and presumptuous, don't you think? How is my reaction to kilts any more homophobic than your reaction to "ass-fucking"? You might be justified invoking the label of homophobia if I were saying something like, "kilts are for fags and queers!" But I've not said any such thing, nor would I.

LindyHopper said:
Well, that's what you would see. OTOH, I spent three hours in a shopping mall with a kilt-clad Icycle yesterday, and what I saw was... well, nothing. If I'd filmed it, I could post the video on YouTube, but it would have been awfully boring: just two people shopping. We didn't actually garner attention of any kind, so I wouldn't advocate wearing a kilt as a strategy to get people to notice you. Wearing a kilt isn't the same as dressing in drag; normal people realize that and react accordingly.
Trust me, they noticed. I can almost hear the whispering, "Psst. Look at that guy, he's wearing a skirt!" "*snicker*...Shhh! They'll hear you!" And so forth. Of course nobody reacted visibly. They just wait till your backs are turned, and shake their heads, laughing. And guess what. THEY'RE not homophobic either. They're just amused the way they would be at any guy going to such lengths to make a fashion statement.

LindyHopper said:
And now we see a hairpin change in tactics: now that drew can no longer claim that most people, including women, would shun a kilt-wearer, he now claims that wearing kilts must be a desperate ploy for female attention.
LOL. Drew never claimed that most people would shun a kilt-wearer. Although I suspect many would, I think more would simply laugh, poke fun at, or derive amusement from the spectacle. And to clarify, I said wearing a kilt CAN get a guy positive attention from females, but it's by no means any guarantee. I suspect most women prefer a guy who's more comfortable in his own ability to be attractive without resorting to radical fashion statements, but some girls are easily taken in by (pardon the pun) "flashy" apparel. :blaugh:

LindyHopper said:
A kilt displays a self-confident, secure male. And that's hot.
Riiight. So hot that until you realized my stance on kilts, you refused to allow Icy to wear his kilt in public with you. 😉
 
It's an odd claim in and of itself. A "desperation move" is the sort of thing someone does when nothing else is working. So one would have to believe that a man who has nothing else to recommend him would suddenly become a babe-magnet by donning a kilt.

I wonder what Drew thinks of women, that he supposes it would work that way. Although I can't say that I wonder enough to actually ask him. "New Drew" was nice while it lasted, but the old habits seem to die hard. How much more of your time is it worth to argue against arguments that refute themselves?
Hey, come on now. I don't take any of this shit seriously, and I would hope that you don't, either. I find the entire topic hilarious, but if it's starting to upset you, I'll back off. No hard feelings.
 
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