Some clarifications.........
execmail77 said:
BIG JIM:
But it just didn't sound like that when you referred to, "these people [who] still hang a Bible round their necks and go misty-eyed at the mention of the Founding Fathers," and believe in, "the beard-wearing, finger wagging God of the Old Testament." That sounded pretty personal, and was a rather broad generalization to boot.
It was intended to be personal Exec, but not towards you or or other "general" Christians. That was specifically aimed at the Christian Patriotic Movement, which is why I mentioned both in the same breath. Although they are clever enough to see through a lot of smokescreens about government conspiracies, they're not clever enough to see that the Founding Fathers or their own religion is just another part of that conspiracy. They're also not clever enough to see that if you fight fire with fire, you only end up with a conflageration twice the size of what you started with. The world they'd replace this one with, is just another expression of the same tired, old dictatorial energy they're fighting now. All they're fighting for is their position at the top of it.
I've used Ann of Tickling-Duo as an example before and I hope the good lady doesn't mind me doing so again. She is a catholic. She is also one of the nicest, broad-minded and loving people in the online-community. She is a Christian whom I'm happy to call a friend; as are you. We may disagree on some fundemental things, but you don't come across as the dictatorial type, who'd oppress other people just for the sake of them having a different belief system to yours. I hope that clarifies things.
🙂
execmail77 said:
Also, to say that, "The religious justified repression... is a big vote-winner for American politicians," is also WAY too broad. Sure that's a popular sentiment among those who already feel that way, but trust me, that is a MUCH smaller segment of American society than you might perceive. Vocal? Yes. But a vast majority of us are not to the extreme right or left, but somewhere in the reasonable middle.
Yup, that forms a large part of those big conspiracy threads I pointed you towards. The vocal (and thus the most power-sponsored parts) of American politics are an unreasonable minority. But the buggers are exceeedingly cunning. A lot of people are influenced by them without even realising that religion is being used to do it.
As for them being "a MUCH smaller segment of American society than you might perceive", well I'm not so sure. Certainly a lot of people who fall into this category wouldn't think of themselves as actively being a part of it. But I've lost count of the times when an American has responded to a thread like the one about abortion with a phrase like "It is an offence in the sight of God". So it might be, but as I said then, just when did God call a press conference and say this? That may sound flippant, but I'm being deadly serious here. All religious texts are a mass of contradicitions. God apparently says "Thou shalt not kill". But this is the same God who was allegedly happy to wipe out the world with a flood, nuke two cities on the basis of one guy's observations in ONE of them and incite "his chosen people" to murder, rape and thieve from anyone who wasn't of their creed. In those threads I gave links to, I examine religion and it's inconsistencies in minute detail. Rather than me regurgitate it all here, I can only suggest you read all my comments (which as is typical of me, are quite long-winded) in them.
execmail77 said:
And, whew! You, "assosciate most organisations that peddle control through fear and falsehood as being interlocked at their top-most levels. This includes politics, religion, the medical profession, the banking industry, education and the military"? That's one helluva conspiracy theory!
Yes it is. There's one thread in particular in those links I gave you. "The Big Politics/Religion Thread" that outlines my reasons for being a "conspiracy theorist". The other three or four all give supporting information to it, but that one is the best place to start if you want to know my reasons for thinking that way.
execmail77 said:
Finally, you just KNEW I'd ask for a clarification on what the heck you mean by America being, "the most backward country in western civilisation... still stuck 300 years behind the rest of the civilised world." I'd love to see a list of these "certain areas" you're referring to...?!
1/ The continued propogation of the death penalty despite it being a)More expensive than life imprionment (It's actually cheaper to imprison someone in solitary confinement at the highest level of security for 40 years, than it is to execute them!) b) A safer bet considering the ability of the American courts in convicting innocent people c) A proven fact that it does not deter crime, with places of the highest execution rates having higher murder rates d) Being used only for the sake of appeasing the need for revenge, given that everyone is going to die one day anyway and 40 years of brutal, anal rape at the hands of Benny The Bughole Buster on B-Wing is much more frightening. If you want to see more about that, go here.........
http://www.ticklingforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19781&highlight=death+penalty (There is even a list of 24 (I think) innocent people who I said were executed in America in the last century.)
2/ The belief in the execution of children who have committed capital offences.(A whole seperate issue.) This includes children as young as 11 or 12. Doesn't just extend to execution either. There is a very disturbing and utterly nonsensical trend of treating juvenille criminals the same as adult ones.
3/ The widespread use of religious dogma in politics and public service. This tends to be strongly Christian in America, purely because that's the dominant religion there. But it's almost on a par sometimes with things the Taliban did in Afghanistan. As yet, there's not been a huge amount of mass, physical co-ercion, but watch this space!
4/ The "Hulk angry, Hulk SMASH!!!!!!!!" mentality. This basically justifies the bombing/other military action against anyone who the US is pissed off wih on any particular day. It doesn't need logical justification or military common sense to do it, just the desire for revenge and the fact that no-one is powerful enough to stop America doing just whatever the hell it wants. A good example is the annihilation of a village in Afghanistan, two weeks after American intelligence were aware that the Taliban had vacated it. Another good example is the way we know that Bush and Blair lied to us about Iraqi capabilities to justify the war in Iraq. The general signals they're giving out now is "Well even if we were wrong about the WMD, it was all in a good cause wasn't it?" Most people, like myself, have no sympathy whatsoever for Osama and Saddam, who are both insane criminals. But The twin administrations of the US and UK were perfectly well aware of this situation weeks before the war started and probably had these "all in a good cause" speeches written months in advance, for when they were rumbled about talking total and utter claptrap.
5/ The gradual erosions of it's citizens civil rights and liberties. This has been most conspicuous in the wake of events like Oklahoma and 9/11. See the linked threads above for more information.
Now a lot of Americans who are my friends are probably feeling quite pissed at me right now. Probably they held some of the above opinions. Well I'd like to make it clear that I'm not setting the UK about the US at all. During the 1960's and 70's we had our very own version of Apartheid in Northern Ireland and we've been more than happy to pitch in beside the US whenever there's been something in the offing. The US tends to be the extrovert "male energy" partner; flexing it's muscles in public and roaring. The UK more takes the part of the "female energy". Working behind the scenes etc. I'm not seeking to demonise the US for the sake of making the UK look superior.
I also am not insulting people who belong to any particular religion. I have a big beef with the people at the top of those religions, because they're perfectly aware of what they're doing. But people who innocently follow a faith and use it to put some good into the world I have no problem with. People who use the biblical argument of an "eye for an eye" to justify capital punishment, I do; although not by far as much as I have with the chief manipulators.
I always will! 
