One of the courses I study in university is physics, so when I do an assignment or a term paper, I do so with what I have learned and been taught in class. I may disgree at or with certain points, but I do want to make good grades, even though it isn,t what I am majoring in. I along with a number of my classmates have had some rather heated arguments with our professor on this very topic. We can do that in our classroom without fear of repercussions. These exchanges could have possibly turned ugly and perhaps even into knockdown drag-em-outs if we had been in a different environment or forum, and yet, I see this very same professor in church. So what is he doing there? Is he hedging his bets just in case? Science is a very useful tool, dry, matter of fact, but everchanging, with no humanity, and is flawed. Christianity is flawed and everchanging, and you can argue about the humanity in it as well, just as any other type of religion, supposed non religion, idealogy, philosophy or anything else. Many wars and terrorist acts are caused by perverted and radical religious beliefs, just as they are caused by and for material gain out of greed and a lust for power. Nobody wins, except those who choose to send our troops into battle or put them in harms way under false pretences, while they line their pockets over the blood of mothers, daughters, fathers and sons. I use science each day in one form or other to accomplish any variety of things, but I still question it. I also question certain types of religions as well as my own at times, and no Relent, I was never taught by a pedophile in a white collar:lol, sorry. I sometimes think that we should have all read the Bible for ourselves using a Bullingers or other companion as it does contain so much symbolism and was written so long ago. I also know that there were more than 30 gospels written and we should have access to all of them. I can see the faults, I,m not as blind or stupid as I may be considered to be. I could care less about snap judgements and need to generalize or marginalize. We can all read the same book, it doesn,t matter which one, and come away with differing opinions, views and conclusions, but that is where a healthy discussion comes into play, instead of ranting or pushing your own private assessment or agenda on someone else, insisting that yours is the only correct one, and that you are the only one who truly sees the light. Questions about any subject matter means that there is room for doubt. We cannot and will never know everything, it,s impossible. We learn more everyday, but no-one has read and understood every book ever written or published, studied and learned every subject, technological discovery, medical or the myriad of others to perfection, and weighed the pros and cons of all of them against each other. If we had, much or most of the weaponry and methods we use in which to kill, maim or disfigure, would have never have left the drawing board or lab and a cure for cancer and all of the other deadly diseases could have been found. Imagine if the same amount of funding, drive, interest and devotion had been placed in curing and not killing. I cannot understand why science is used to the detrimant of humanity and also to scare and intimidate, and if you were born, raised and educated where I am, between the two biggist bullies on the planet who are forever posturing and threatening, you too might understand what I mean. Being capable of destroying our habitat, invirionment and the people who live here without taking this technology and using it to positive advantage makes no sense to me, whatsoever. We haven,t finished discovering and learning about all of wonders of and on our own planet, the different species, and all life and nonlife forms that exist here and what they have to offer and represent as to positive effect or some measure of enlightenment. It makes me uncomfortable when people talk about sailing off to Mars, as if they have given up on our planet because there have been stumbling blocks or forks in the road along the way. There is no perfect world and there will not come a time that we find one, here or on another planet, but that shouldn,t stop us from trying to improve our way of life and caring for those who are unable to do it for themselves through no fault of their own. Perhaps you weren,t prom king, coming home queen, money is tight, can,t get your dream career, wasn,t the most gorgeous, handsome, popular, intelligent, sports jock or you felt ignored, picked on or bullied. So now is it your turn to bully and make everyone else pay for it, or for your own short-comings{most won,t admit to that} preferring instead to blame others or circumstances? Go ahead, live on a rusty, freezing and miserable planet, be my guest, that,ll show em. I just happen to believe that there is much more to be accomplished and repaired here first, before we take the next step or leap. People have enough difficulty getting along here, and this thread is a perfect example, let alone being prepared to infiltrate and occupy another space and world with such a hostile climate. Starvation, poverty, shelter, economics, disease, healthcare, pollution, our judicial systems, laws, violence, war and a better form of government are what we should be concerned about and focusing our attention on. Our priorities are either in the wrong order, all mixed up or completely off target. You don,t need to be spiritual, theist, agnostic or athiest to do the right thing. Save space travel and the setup of inter-planetary communities for another day. We live here now, in the present, not the future. Technology is wonderful instrument and it,s applications should be used to the benefit of all mankind. Is that too idealistic to ever be attained? Perhaps so, if it is, do we give up or keep striving for something better? Lets get it right here first before getting caught up and wasting time, money and energy on someone elses pipe-dreams which may be several lifetimes away at the very least. I,m more interested and concerned about the kind of world we hand over to our children, if there is one left to hand over. We haven.t exactly been the best of keepers, preservers and tenants to this gift we,ve been given, whether you believe in God or not. Some are very angry because God himself hasn,t appeared before them in person, patted them on the head and bestowed upon them all the answers to the universe. Others are angry at the state of our planet and at God for seemingly standing in the wings and letting this along with all the atrosities and corruption take place. What kind of a loving and forgiving God would hesitate and not help when he is supposedly all seeing and all powerful? I can only speak about what I have read and learned and I hesitate to give my interpretation because some will see it as a sermon or preachy and be offended. Believe it or not, I try my best not to do that. I understand why certain people may be offended but these same groups or individuals would not hesitate to offend me or my peers and have done so without remorse. I get angry as well when someone questions my personal beliefs, then sits back in judgement, believing in their own sophistication and astuteness, all smug in their comfort zone, safe and hiding behind a keyboard, feeling superior, as if they have been there and done all of that, bullshit! You will never have all of your answers and neither will I, not in this life and if indeed you are correct and there is nothing in the hereafter, then hope for many is lost. Without hope, what do most have? A person without hope can be extremely dangerous and unrepentant, perhaps that is why we have the world as it is now, because of greed, glutony, sloth and ignorance. Becoming frustrated by disagreement and wanting to impose your will on others and then lashing out, if is isn,t working, isn,t going to help. I have done so myself at the beginning of this thread, to no avail and it was ridiculous of me to get caught up in something as absurd as an argument between science and religion in the first place. Everyone is still searching for answers and are as much in the dark as anyone else, even though they might disagree and tell you that they know all, with certainty, or falsely deny that they do not know. The thought of impending death at some point for all of us, is the great equilizer, we are born with nothing and we leave this life the same way as we came into it. From dust we came and to dust we shall return. That statement is perhaps harsh and over simplified, but it is true. We will be absorbed into the earth in one form or another after we die. Does our spirit then fly off to be with the creator, lay in a dormant stage until called upon, or is there such an entity as a spirit at all? Is there a heaven or paradise in the afterlife and is there an afterlife? Believe as you will. I said that there would be no negotiating with my personal beliefs in a different thread, I meant it then and I mean it now. There were two separate people, atheists by there own admission, who somehow took offence to what I had said even though I attempted to explain myself in a non obtrusive way and jumped all over it even though I would have been perfectly delighted, contented and willing to leave it there, but instead, they preferred to attack me and my beliefs on a personal level, as if they are the be-alls, end-alls and know-it-alls, again, bullshit! I don,t like discussing it, it,s no-ones business but my own and I don,t go around preaching about it as they do about their own ways of perception. I,m perfectly willing to keep it to myself but they can,t leave well enough alone and feel the need to go on and on pestering, badgering and trying to push their beliefs not only on me but and other believers as well as the undecideds, when most reading these comments probably wish that we would all just shut up. I respectfully agree with those that do. How does what I believe affect your lives? Neither of you know me, and from what I have read from each of you, twisting, corrupting and taking statements, and not just mine out of context to suit your own ends. I have no intention or desire of getting to know either of you let alone ever becoming friends. I went ahead and pushed some of their buttons as they had mine, got some hollow enjoyment from doing so, as I knew it angered them as much as they had angered me. The anger or enjoyment didn,t last, there was no point to this exercise in futility, except that some feed off negativity. It helps them to feel better about themselves in some vague way, which I wouldn,t venture to attempt to explain. You are not going to change my mind, neither I yours, so accept it and get on with your lives. I might not agree with what you believe or disbelieve, but I would never take away your right to think, write or state it, unless there was danger or a physical threat of harm toward society, persons or individuals. There is no reason why Christianity and all other forms of religion along with science can,t co-exist, so lighten up and I,ll do the same. I won,t be back to read any of your comments, this is my final statement on this uncompromising and rude thread, in which I have been as rude, derisory and uncompromising at times as anyone else. For that, I do apologize, it couldn,t be any other way I,m afraid. When you are continually poking, prodding and attempting to tear down someones foundations, they tend to become combative. It is an obnoxious act to begin with and they are vexations to the spirit, mine at least, even if they do not believe in such themselves. It comes down to common courtesy and being polite, if nothing else. For those who came to this late. this argument began in another thread about why Bill Maher is a great American. I happen to like him and agree with him 90% of the time and wish that there were more like him being watchdogs for the rest of us on political and environmental issues. I do feel that there are somethings that are off limits however, mine and others personal beliefs in particular and whether or not we do or do not believe in a creator. If he wants to attack the institution I have no problem, but not the individual. He has a forum that we do not have access to as individuals and he is able to spout his own particular brand of propaganda without absolute proof is no better than many tv evangalists, most of whom I disagree with, especially when they come across as nothing more than money grubbing harlots. I was trying to be kind there.
