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Global survey reveals discontent with U.S.

mr spies, and other loons

prove it. simple as that. you say coke is responsible for apartide in south africa ,and pepsi for the '73 coup in chile. well give us at least one iota of proof, other than your drug induced rants.
yes we "right wingers" don't believe this clap trap, cause you commies never provide proof! you throw in a verbal bomb, and run! so put up, or apologise.
steve
 
Steve,

I believe he said 'supported', not 'responsible for'. Big difference.

Why put 'right-wingers' in inverted commas? You are right wing, so why say "right-wingers" like it's some unfounded slur?

Are you gonna apologise for your drug accusations?

Biggles
 
Why is this a world peopled exclusivley by right-wingers and commies? There's a lot of shades of grey between the black and the white. That sort of thinking pattern is what gave Joe McCarthy a hard-on every morning when he realised how important he was, because of people pigeon-holing anyone who was different to them.
 
Biggles of 266 said:
Steve,

I believe he said 'supported', not 'responsible for'. Big difference.

Why put 'right-wingers' in inverted commas? You are right wing, so why say "right-wingers" like it's some unfounded slur?

Are you gonna apologise for your drug accusations?

Biggles

biggles i didn't put inverted commas around right wingers, i put quotation marks. i did so cause that's what mr spies called anyone who disagrees with his statements.
you bet i'm a right winger. that's the surest sign that a persons brain has finaly kicked into gear, they become conservatives!
why on earth should i appologise for calling him a drug user? he is, and has said so, so has shinning ice. so no need. he on the other hand, has made accusations, with out proof, so i say, back it up, or appologise, and admit he's wrong.
steve
 
we're all drug users 😉 ever drunk a beer? smoked a cigarette? had a coffee? had a pepsi? call me Jimmi Hendrix...
 
you bet i'm a right winger. that's the surest sign that a persons brain has finaly kicked into gear



More like running on no gear at all. 🙄
First off I never said i was on drugs, second of all Areenactor I challenge you to admit one mistake that the US should apologise to the world for and if u cant think of one its obvious you're one of the most close minded fools Ive ever met.
 
Last edited:
Ice, you have far too independant a mind to be a marine dude. Just ask Flatfoot! Remember he said that critiscising the President even though you didn't vote for him would land you in the shit? Hell some sergeants even get pissed off when you say you're not a christian. (The dude from Full Metal Jacket was a real life USMC sergeant and was partly responsible for that part being in the script.)



Big Jim-------The TMF's very own Private Pile.
 
BigJim said:
Why is this a world peopled exclusivley by right-wingers and commies? There's a lot of shades of grey between the black and the white. That sort of thinking pattern is what gave Joe McCarthy a hard-on every morning when he realised how important he was, because of people pigeon-holing anyone who was different to them.


Shhhhhhhhhhh!!! Quiet, Jim! If you go saying stuff like this out loud, the people over there *surreptitiously points to the right* and the folks over there *surreptitiously points to the left* might wake up and realize that it's us moderates who REALLY run things. 😀

Fear the power of the independant voter!
BUUUUAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!! :devil:

😛
 
I am not saying that no big companies haven't done some nasty things. Who nows maybe Coke did support apartheid in South Africa but since I have no evidence of it I would give them the benefit of the doubt. Also not every company in the US is supporting nasty overt operations or keeping corrupt goverments in power as seems to be the indication. I think the point I was trying to make is there must come a point where you will no longer tolerate the conditions of your goverment when they oppress you. At that point it is you that must act to put a stop to it because all the complaining and blaming will get you nowhere.
 
This is not intended as a flame, but my opinion is that currently the USA is the biggest threat to world peace since the cold war ended. And I think I speak for many of my fellow europeans...in other words, I fear that IF there's going to be a Third World War, it's going to be the USA that starts it this time.
 
Well

dutch, im sure if it was your country in danger you would feel just a *little* different.
 
DutchTickler said:
This is not intended as a flame, but my opinion is that currently the USA is the biggest threat to world peace since the cold war ended. And I think I speak for many of my fellow europeans...in other words, I fear that IF there's going to be a Third World War, it's going to be the USA that starts it this time.

i am not going to flame you dutch, i just don't have the heart to do it. i had family from holand. my maternal grandffather's family was from holand. their name was vanderhack. there were many members of the family that didn't come to america. they are no more. they died in a little war you might have heard about, it's a little european conflict we came over to help in. it was/is called world war 2.
a friend of my parents was a member of the 101st airborne div. he was shot while comming down in his parachute. and a dutch farmer hid him till more americans arived, and took him away.
but don't worry, we at least win what we start. and i dought anyone expects holand to give any support...i mean, when have you?
steve
 
Actually...

Holland had a ferocious underground during the war, areenactor. I also have relatives there, including a few in Interpol, and their stories of those times are brutally graphic. I doubt you'll find another nation that battled back as well as they did,(given their resources, or lack thereof) and their hatred of the Germans is still legendary. Their operatives supplied intelligence to the Allies whenever possible and were fearless about it.... Q
 
i know qjackel about the dutch during ww2

they are a true study in contridiction. the dutch hid, and smuggled out more jews than all the other countries of europe combined! they also prduced more volunteers to the german ss than all other european countries combined!
the agents of orange as they were called, did indeed do their best, and most gave their lives trying to complete their missions. what little info they provided was largely ignored by the british. the horrendous losses of "operation market garden" are one of the results of this poor judgement.
i do have some respect for the people of holand, and their royal family from the time of ww2. they were vastly over matched, but never gave up.
steve
 
im not going to waste my time adressing your insults about drugs, i have no idea where that came from, i assume its the last refuge of scoundrals, since you have no facts to prove.

cokes support for the aparthied is common knowelege if you dont know that than you have a lot of work to do. im not going to do it for you. Dick Cheney also labeled nelso mandella a terrorist. Trent lott just said we would be better off under segragation.

There are recently released cia documents that prove all of this, and some independant journalists have covered the events. just look up operation condor, there are hundreds of books and scholoarly journal articles on the subject.

the fact that the us supported these regimes is common knowelege, the fact that the US with the help of US conglomorates created them, just do your homework. you can start with a well known author on the subject. noam chomsky.

maybe the problem with the right, is they really just dont know anything.

but i have a feeling none of them will research the information, and even after they find out the truth they still will try and rationalize torturing someone for thought crimes.
 
here are some well citied facts on the economic situation under dictator pinochet. This doesnt event talk about the fascist freedom hating state that crushed chiles democracy,where 200,000 people were tortured and thousands were murdered and imprisoned by the government and military police for thought crimes.

The most phenomenal success story of all is Chile, with its "prospering free-market economy generated by Gen. August Pinochet" (Nash). That is an established truth, repeated everywhere. True, Pinochet was tough, but the "economic miracle" carried out by his Chicago Boys from 1974 to 1989 is there for all to see. To see, if they do not look too closely.

Pinochet's "miracle" turned into the "Chilean catastrophe" in under a decade, David Felix writes; virtually the entire banking system was taken over by the government in an attempt to salvage the economy, leading some to describe the transition from Allende to Pinochet as "a transition from utopian to scientific socialism, since the means of production are ending up in the hands of the state" (Felix), or "the Chicago Road to socialism." The militantly anti-socialist London Economist Intelligence Unit wrote that "the believer in free markets, President Pinochet, had a more comprehensive grip on the `controlling heights of the economy' than President Allende had dared dream of." The government-controlled portion of the economy in 1983 was comparable to the Allende years after the state took over failing enterprises, which it sold off at bargain rates to the private sector when they were resuscitated, along with efficient and profitable public enterprises that were generating 25 percent of the government's revenues, Joseph Collins and John Lear note. Multinational corporations did very nicely in the process, gaining control over large parts of the Chilean economy. Citing Chilean economists, James Petras and Steve Vieux report that "an estimated $600 million in subsidies were provided to purchasers in the 1986-1987 wave of privatizations," including "efficiently run, surplus-producing operations"; the operation is expected to reduce government surplus by $100 to $165 million during 1990-1995.

Until 1980, Chile's GDP per capita did not approach the 1972 (Allende) level, and investment was still below the late 1960s while unemployment was far higher. Per capita health care was more than halved from 1973 to 1985, setting off explosive growth in poverty-related diseases such as typhoid and viral hepatitis. Since 1973, consumption dropped 30 percent for the poorest 20 percent in Santiago and increased 15 percent for the top 20 percent. Private hospitals proudly display their high-tech equipment for the rich, while public ones offer mothers an appointment months away and medicines they cannot afford. College education, free for everyone under Allende, is now for the more privileged; and they will not be exposed to the "subversives" who have been purged, but offered "sociology, political science, and economics courses...more like religious instruction in the revealed truth of free markets and the red peril" (Tina Rosenberg), as in Brazil under the generals, or other places that come to mind. Macroeconomic statistics in the Pinochet years are generally below those for the preceding two decades; the average GNP growth from 1974-1979 was just over half that of 1961-1971, while per capita GNP fell 6.4 percent and per capita consumption 23 percent from 1972-1987. The capital city of Santiago is now "among the most polluted cities in the world," Nathaniel Nash observes, thanks to the free market Friedmanite model with its slogan "Produce, produce, produce," come what may -- what we denounce as the "Stalinist model" when there are points to be scored thereby. What "came" was "the daunting cost of cleaning up, ...and the daunting cost of not cleaning up" in a country with "some of the world's dirtiest factories," no regulations, severe pollution of water supplies, and general environmental ruin with much-feared consequences for the health of the population.

And thanks to the miracle, along with a little US help in "making the economy scream" under the Allende government, the proportion of the population that fell below the poverty line (minimum income required for basic food and housing) increased from 20 percent to 44.4 percent from 1970 to 1987.

"Not much of a miracle," Edward Herman comments.43




41 David Clark Scott, CSM, July 30, 1992; Salvador Corro, Proceso (Mexico), Nov. 18, 1991 (LANU, Jan. 1992); UN Report on the Environment, AP, May 7, 1992; La Botz, Mask, 165, 158; Andrew Reding and Christopher Whalen, Fragile Stability, Mexico Project, World Policy Institute, 1991. Barkin, Report on the Americas (NACLA), May 1991; "Salinastroika," ms., Aug. 1992. Baker, WP, Sept. 10, 1991, cited by Reding and Whalen.

42 Nash, NYT, Nov. 13, 1991; Aug. 1, 1992. Kamm, WSJ, April 16, 1992.

43 Felix, "Financial Blowups"; "Reflections on Privatizing"; "Latin American Monetarism in Crisis," in 'Monetarism' and the Third World, Institute of Development Studies, Sussex, 1981. Data compiled by Chilean economist Patricio Meller; UN ECLA Poverty Study (Santiago, 1990) (Felix, p.c.). Petras and Vieux, "Myths and Realities." Economist Intelligence Unit cited by Doug Henwood, Left Business Observer, no. 50, July 7, 1992. Collins and Lear, "Pinochet's Giveaway," Multinational Monitor, May 1991. Rosenberg, Dissent, Summer 1989. Herman, letter, Washington Report on the Hemisphere, June 3, 1992. Nash, NYT, July 6, 1992.
 
august spies said:
im not going to waste my time adressing your insults about drugs, i have no idea where that came from, i assume its the last refuge of scoundrals, since you have no facts to prove.
look whose calling the kettle black! you are laughable.

cokes support for the aparthied is common knowelege if you dont know that than you have a lot of work to do.
common only to you, and your fellow travelers
im not going to do it for you.
why cause you are lazy, or because there is no proof?

Dick Cheney also labeled nelso mandella a terrorist.
he was!
Trent lott just said we would be better off under segragation.
no he didn't! he said the world might be better off today if the old guy had been elected president in 1948. only you moronic liberals choose to see something more sinister than making a 100 year old person feel good! btw, i do disagree with mr. lott. truman was one of the greatest presidents we've ever had.
There are recently released cia documents that prove all of this, and some independant journalists have covered the events. just look up operation condor, there are hundreds of books and scholoarly journal articles on the subject.

the fact that the us supported these regimes is common knowelege, the fact that the US with the help of US conglomorates created them, just do your homework. you can start with a well known author on the subject. noam chomsky.
well known? funny i never heard of him, what has he writen? oh, and maybe you'd rather we support commie regimes like the sandanistas???

maybe the problem with the right, is they really just dont know anything.
and the problem with the left, is that they refuse to accept the truth.

but i have a feeling none of them will research the information, and even after they find out the truth they still will try and rationalize torturing someone for thought crimes.

oh? torture like your good friends the kgb? and the stazi? and the necklessing that is/was done by the comunist insurgents in south africa? or the killing of hamlet head men, and torture that was done in the name of the people in south viet nam, by the viet cong?
once again we see that you commies wear blinders.
steve
p.s. i'm done with you mr spies, you obviously aren't going to back anything up, so i'll not waste any more time on your replies, i'll just delete them as the effuvium they are.
 
Re: Well

Krokus said:
dutch, im sure if it was your country in danger you would feel just a *little* different.

:zzzzz:

doesn't the view from the moral high-ground ever get boring?

You're right, america is the only country in the world that's in danger.

:zzzzz:
 
Hm..

Has your country been attacked? Thats what I thought.
 
mate, you just proved my point. Stop using other people's pain to justify your arguments.
 
Lol..

Other peoples pain? You just proved my point. You assume FAR too much.
 
areenactor said:


oh? torture like your good friends the kgb? and the stazi? and the necklessing that is/was done by the comunist insurgents in south africa? or the killing of hamlet head men, and torture that was done in the name of the people in south viet nam, by the viet cong?
once again we see that you commies wear blinders.
steve
p.s. i'm done with you mr spies, you obviously aren't going to back anything up, so i'll not waste any more time on your replies, i'll just delete them as the effuvium they are.

Steve, maybe I'm missing something glaringly obvious here, but why is eveyone who's not a right winger a commie? I don't know anything about AS, but he/she laid down some sources of information that supported his point of view (no matter how far from normal it may seem) and all you did was say you would'nt touch any of it with a bargepole. You (or someone from your POV) asked him to back his statements up. He did. You dismissed his sources without a thought or any verificatin, and let loose a rather McCarthy-ist parrot call at the same time. And why do you assume he's best buddies with the KGB etc. because he fits your definition of a commie? Just because someone doesn't believe in ein reich, ein volk, ein fuhrer doesn't mean they're a pinko does it? Or does it? Sometimes I wonder if there is something about politics that I am missing, that is wonderfully obvious to everyone else. I think my life would be a lot bloody simpler if I could see it, but I can't. I find people pigeonholing others to be total pants. (See English slang disctionary.)
 
Coke supposed support for apartheid is not common knowledge and I know some pretty liberal people. Maybe they just don't read up on this stuff. As for Nelson Mandela, he is open supporter of Fidel Castro and communism in general and what respect I had for him in helping to free his people has quickly faded away. If that makes me a nasty person then so be it. What I fail to understand here is what is the point. Even if Coke gave money to support apartheid does that mean the goverment of South Africa is not responsible at all for the situation at the time? Certainly the racist goverment of South Africa bears the brunt of this responsibility. It seems from these discussions that you are more afraid of Coca Cola executives or business executives in general than of Saddam Hussein, or Osama. I mean no disrespect but I find that somewhat curious.
 
" I got a story-ain't got no morals!" 'BWOW! 'BWOW! 'BWOW!
" Let the bad guy win every once in a while!"

What destiny these mortals manifest!

In this world you gotta look out for number one, but don't step in number two!!!

"Don't be knieve, Michael. Presidents don't have people killed!"
"Who's being knieve, Kay?"


Say it again, Sam...

"They're starving in the dessert...hmm...Maybe they should GO
WHERE THE F**KING WATER IS!!!!!" OH!!! O-HO!!!!
"On the other hand, the PEOPLE BY THE WATER WON"T HAVE "UM!!!!
OH!!!!!! OH!!!!!!!!

So many layers to this bloomin' onion!

While on tour in Asia, Alexander the Great stopped by to see the neighborhood's biggest ball of twine. It was tangle apon tangle, knot
beneath knot. The challenge being- who, could undo this great puzzle.

Of course no one could do it, Alexander draws his sword-yadda, yadda,
yadda-problem solved!!!

I guess the modern equivelent would be pulling off the stickers from a Rubik's cube. Well, actually, one could solve a Rubik's cube. I never had the patience, nor the interest come to think of it, myself.

OH!!!!!! OH!!!!!!!!!!

Perhaps a better example could be a great ball of RED TAPE!!!!!
(oooo's and ahhhs)
Buried within would be brass rings and bobbles and some such!

Step right up! Step right up and see those lovably nutty neighbors,
namely, us Americans, attempt to clean they're own back yard so
they might have a bit more room to talk!

"You mean despite our Superbowl Championship of a Constitution, some see us as fall guys for our own elite powers that be?"

"Even the toughest roughriders have to soap the saddles and nurture
the broncos sometime, boys!

'Cause it's just braggin' if you can't back it up!!!
 
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