who cares

[LD_Tickler]

One more time: The point is that you can't make that "point" sensitively. Either you don't get that, in which case there's no use discussing this, or you are the troll people accuse you of being.

So he makes an insensitive point. Then, people start attacking him personally, forcing him into a position where he has to make the point over and over again with more insistence, or else concede that he is a "shithead" "bastard" etc.

I really am shocked at how people lose sensibility and awareness when they get mad.

 

[Babyshambles]

I agree entirely with this.

I have noticed the same thing against other people, including gobsmaskingly when a popular girl like annie hall had the audacity to go on record with a slightly controversial opinion.

I wish the owner hadnt called me a shithead, I wish skip had not called me a shit stirrer. I wish viper had not called me a bitch and told me to fuck off.

I can hadly being disliked here, I can handle dealing with shit.

I do not agree with personal insults - they have no place in a civil, adult conversation.

Sure, some will say I am playing the victim card. Im not. Im expressing my opinion.

So he makes an insensitive point. Then, people start attacking him personally, forcing him into a position where he has to make the point over and over again with more insistence, or else concede that he is a "shithead" "bastard" etc.

I really am shocked at how people lose sensibility and awareness when they get mad.

 

[ViperGTS]

When you're right, you're right, meangry. And as a result of my assholery, I got banned. Then I cooled off, came back with a fresh, friendly attitude, and here I am, putting out videos for people to beat their cocks into submission over. I agree with you 100%.

But the "If you can give it, you better be able to take it" argument goes both ways - I took my lumps, and I have every right to express my opinion about someone the same way you do you about me. Real to real? You should practice what you preach, or don't preach at all.

No offense intended, of course. 🙂

On another note, I haven't reported anyone in quite a long time until today (not you, meangry lol).

 

[Skipadeedoodah]

That this situation mirrors the Drew situation suggests that Drew shouldn't have been banned as much as it suggests Shambles deserves his ban.

I'm not speaking of banning at all. That post, right there, sounds exactly like something drew70 would have said. That's what I said, and that's what I meant.

So he makes an insensitive point. Then, people start attacking him personally, forcing him into a position where he has to make the point over and over again with more insistence, or else concede that he is a "shithead" "bastard" etc.

I really am shocked at how people lose sensibility and awareness when they get mad.

It's his track record, LD. He has a nasty little habit of "being insensitive" if you want to say it nicely. People lose patience after awhile. He does this to himself on purpose so he can play the victim and get a pity party of people defending him.

 

[Babyshambles]

I'm not speaking of banning at all. That post, right there, sounds exactly like something drew70 would have said. That's what I said, and that's what I meant.



It's his track record, LD. He has a nasty little habit of "being insensitive" if you want to say it nicely. People lose patience after awhile. He does this to himself on purpose so he can play the victim and get a pity party of people defending him.

I dont want any pity. I just want to be able to come here, make a contribution and leave. Simple that.

I dont come here to make friends and I dont come here to make enemies. I come here to partake of a discussion and then leave.

I try to make positive, helpful, constructive contributions.

 

[kis123]

Did I express an opinion sensitively? Yes!

Sure it might not be what goth wanted to hear, but it was expressed sensitively enough and I believe it to be the truth.

Do you ever consider the impact of your statements before you put them in print? You have a grown man who is scared, confused, depressed, and miserable over the love of his life and you all but say she dumped him?

It's okay the have the thought shambles; it's NOT always okay or appropriate to say it. That's why they have a PM function; you could've easily your dissenting opinion in PRIVATE. Wow, what a novel concept!

And guess what else? I haven't always been on the good side of the mods and I let them know exactly how I felt about their decisions.......IN PRIVATE! Disrespecting those in authority doesn't make you a victim, it makes you look like a crap-stirring, trouble making, fool. Now you claim you're none of those things and I'd love to believe you. But based on your posts over the last several weeks, it's a walking and a quacking.....

Then when you've been more than advised to keep said opinion off the forum because it was NOT within the scope of the OP, you go into persecution complex mode. We PMd about this a couple of weeks ago; I told you then I wasn't the only person taking issue with you. I truly hope you take the blinders off; you aren't the victim here. What you did in goth's thread was horrible; if you were going through the worst period of your life, would you want someone making accusations? How many times did this man say she was the love of his life? As a parent, I understand what she did, but she panicked and got desparate. I know how an abusive man can control long after the relationship is over.

You're not winning this argument and you've brought the flame on yourself. The sooner you come to this blatently obvious conclusion and stop it with the blame game, the better off you'll be. If not, I don't see this getting any better for you.

 

[The Fallen Angel]

cant believe this hasnt happened yet from someone but why doesnt someone suggest this be moved to general discussion since it has no buisness in the tickling discussion and seeing as babyshambles cant post there, the argument would be over. and in a comical way at that

 

[LD_Tickler]

I'm not speaking of banning at all. That post, right there, sounds exactly like something drew70 would have said. That's what I said, and that's what I meant.

Nevermind then.

It's his track record, LD. He has a nasty little habit of "being insensitive" if you want to say it nicely. People lose patience after awhile. He does this to himself on purpose so he can play the victim and get a pity party of people defending him.

I know his track record. I read almost all of his threads because I can't resist a good fight. He's contrary and blunt, and his opinions piss people off. If you want to quote the rules, those who have "lost patience" (if you want to say it nicely) are in much clearer violation than him, even given his pattern. Whether or not you or I think he does it for a pity party is irrelevant, I'm sorry to say.

There's no justification for banning him yet nobody who's lashed out at him, according to the rules. This happens all the time, and it's why I'm more and more convinced that, for better or for worse, the rules are secondary to majoritarianism on this forum - which I wouldn't mind, if people just admitted it.

 

[Babyshambles]

cant believe this hasnt happened yet from someone but why doesnt someone suggest this be moved to general discussion since it has no buisness in the tickling discussion and seeing as babyshambles cant post there, the argument would be over. and in a comical way at that

its a good point.

i can still see the general discussion though, i just cant post there

and of course, it would only reinforce my view, and the view of many supportive private messages that the people running this show get out of control at times.

 

[Skipadeedoodah]

I dont want any pity. I just want to be able to come here, make a contribution and leave. Simple that.

I dont come here to make friends and I dont come here to make enemies. I come here to partake of a discussion and then leave.

I try to make positive, helpful, constructive contributions.

And sometimes you do that, and that's very pleasant. Just today, before all this stuff on goth's thread, I read something you posted in a controversial thread actually encouraging friendly disagreement, and I was surprised and happy. I said to myself, "Hm, it has indeed been awhile since Shambles was a jerk. Maybe he really is 'verysorry' for his behavior."

But then, just in time to prove me wrong, you go into a very emotional thread and act like a jerk and say hurtful things.

I've seen you contribute good discussion and be decent, so I know you can do it, which is why I get all the more pissed off when you act like an asshole.

You want to be able to come here and offer opinions, do it, but don't do it the way you've been doin' it, cause the way you've been doin' it sucks.

 

[LD_Tickler]

Shambles posts a lot of tactless, confrontational points. One of two things are true.

1) Such posts are against the rules
Yet, I've seen dozens of forum members post similar posts, habitually, without this same level of mod response.

2) His behaviour is technically not against the rules, just ill-advised.
Yet, he's being banned.

Either way, I see selectivity and hypocrisy.

 

[Babyshambles]

You see.

I like this.

This is nice and constructive.

I can see now that what I said to goth was hurtful. I thought it might be doing him a big favour to see the other side of the coin, indeed he said that his father echoes my concerns, so they must have had some base.

Sometimes I think it can be better to tell people an unpleasant truth than a happy lie. I tried to point out that I dont know the situation that well and that I could be completely wrong.

I just didnt appreciated the man's heartfelt pain, which I certainly didnt want to add to.

I have always liked goth and thought he seems a decent sort, which is why I felt i owed it to him to pull no punches and as sensitively as possible let him know what I thought, which would be worth a seconds thought before involving police and social services.

Well, this is off topic.

I really don't hate anyone here, or have any agenda. Sometimes i say the most stupid things in my bumbling way of trying to help, and I guess I am often totally unprepared for the backlash that gets unleashed

And sometimes you do that, and that's very pleasant. Just today, before all this stuff on goth's thread, I read something you posted in a controversial thread actually encouraging friendly disagreement, and I was surprised and happy. I said to myself, "Hm, it has indeed been awhile since Shambles was a jerk. Maybe he really is 'verysorry' for his behavior."

But then, just in time to prove me wrong, you go into a very emotional thread and act like a jerk and say hurtful things.

I've seen you contribute good discussion and be decent, so I know you can do it, which is why I get all the more pissed off when you act like an asshole.

You want to be able to come here and offer opinions, do it, but don't do it the way you've been doin' it, cause the way you've been doin' it sucks.

 

[goddess_nemesis]

You tried to get Goth to see a reality that simply doesn't exist. To suggest that Saeria ran because she wanted to leave Goth is unfathomable. Many people here are good friends of the couple and know how in love they truly are. Some people tried to get you to see the situation as it really is and they saw your comments as insensitive and far from what Goth needed to see and read.

The fact that you started this thread originally to air a PM sent to you by Jeff was a dumb move on your part. It only serves to make this worse for you. Jeff and the rest of the mods are fair people. It takes a lot for them to ban someone. It takes a helluva lot more for them to permanently ban someone from the forum, best example of that is drew70.

If you have a problem with your ban from gen. discussion, take it up with the mods through PM, not through a thread like this.

 

[LD_Tickler]

If you have a problem with your ban from gen. discussion, take it up with the mods through PM, not through a thread like this.

I don't know, I appreciate being kept abreast of things. Enforcement and appeals of mod decisions are things which, theoretically, concern us all. I definitely enjoy knowing precedents and such. Keeps you from being blindsided, imho.

 

[Babyshambles]

Good points.

I felt that Jeff's comments were completely out of order and many orders of magnitude worse than anything I have ever said here.

But I have also deleted those comments.

You tried to get Goth to see a reality that simply doesn't exist. To suggest that Saeria ran because she wanted to leave Goth is unfathomable. Many people here are good friends of the couple and know how in love they truly are. Some people tried to get you to see the situation as it really is and they saw your comments as insensitive and far from what Goth needed to see and read.

The fact that you started this thread originally to air a PM sent to you by Jeff was a dumb move on your part. It only serves to make this worse for you. Jeff and the rest of the mods are fair people. It takes a lot for them to ban someone. It takes a helluva lot more for them to permanently ban someone from the forum, best example of that is drew70.

If you have a problem with your ban from gen. discussion, take it up with the mods through PM, not through a thread like this.

 

[CrystalLight]

lol.

You must be absolutely loving this, Shambles. You're well aware of what it is you're doing and none of the advice that people are giving is anything you're going to take. I saw the comment you made in Goth's thread and thought it was fucked up and not constructive coming from you.

Folks who are siding with you (word 'siding' used loosely), seem to be forgetting that the statement itself might have been easily viewed as constructive if it was coming from someone who hasn't continuously proved themselves to be a troll time and time again.

There was nothing constructive or even moderately helpful about his post in that thread. He was well aware of the response it was going to get. Of course he's not going to think about it because then he might actually post something that isn't going to cause people's backs to go up.

 

[LD_Tickler]

lol.

You must be absolutely loving this, Shambles. You're well aware of what it is you're doing and none of the advice that people are giving is anything you're going to take. I saw the comment you made in Goth's thread and thought it was fucked up and not constructive coming from you.

Folks who are siding with you (word 'siding' used loosely), seem to be forgetting that the statement itself might have been easily viewed as constructive if it was coming from someone who hasn't continuously proved themselves to be a troll time and time again.

Come on. People's posts need to be judged by their contents, not the reputations of their posters, if we want any clear system of rules to exist on this forum. If you admit what he said might easily be viewed as constructive if you or I had said it, but assert that from him it was banworthy, you're justifying prejudice - which is bullhonky no matter how many times the dude has pissed us off.

 

[Skipadeedoodah]

Come on. People's posts need to be judged by their contents, not the reputations of their posters, if we want any clear system of rules to exist on this forum. If you admit what he said might easily be viewed as constructive if you or I had said it, but assert that from him it was banworthy, you're justifying prejudice - which is bullhonky no matter how many times the dude has pissed us off.

It would have been a shitty comment coming from anybody.

 

[Babyshambles]

Why would you assume I am enjoying this.

I can assure you that I am not.

I would much rather wake up tomorrow an at some point have an apology from Jeff for his conduct towards me and a promise to allow me to see and post in the Gen Disc in due course.

I still cannot see why I have been banned from the Gen Disc - from what I can tell I pissed off Geoff and some others for being insensitive towards their friend.

Sure that is not good - but worth banning me???? I cant tihink it is

lol.

You must be absolutely loving this, Shambles. You're well aware of what it is you're doing and none of the advice that people are giving is anything you're going to take. I saw the comment you made in Goth's thread and thought it was fucked up and not constructive coming from you.

Folks who are siding with you (word 'siding' used loosely), seem to be forgetting that the statement itself might have been easily viewed as constructive if it was coming from someone who hasn't continuously proved themselves to be a troll time and time again.

There was nothing constructive or even moderately helpful about his post in that thread. He was well aware of the response it was going to get. Of course he's not going to think about it because then he might actually post something that isn't going to cause people's backs to go up.

 

[LD_Tickler]

It would have been a shitty comment coming from anybody.

Not shitty enough to deserve this, if we compare it to countless other statements made by unpunished users.

 

[The Fallen Angel]

It would have been a shitty comment coming from anybody.

agreed not something that should have been posted. It was a legitimate thought but didnt need to be said. But in all honesty it is something goth needs to think about although i hope that isnt what has happened. Some people dont seem to have that filter in your head that deciphers something you should think and not say

 

[CrystalLight]

Shambles posts a lot of tactless, confrontational points. One of two things are true.

1) Such posts are against the rules
Yet, I've seen dozens of forum members post similar posts, habitually, without this same level of mod response.

2) His behaviour is technically not against the rules, just ill-advised.
Yet, he's being banned.

Either way, I see selectivity and hypocrisy.

His behavior is upsetting and subtly directed towards other members on the forum.

There's a difference between being generally confrontational and personally.

It's no different then what another member's behavior was before he got banned.

Starting a topic and knowing it's going to be a hot-button topic, but not where it'll be directed subtly or not at another person is a lot different then just discussing a general hot-button topic. (Cliques as a whole, abortion, etc).

Come on. People's posts need to be judged by their contents, not the reputations of their posters, if we want any clear system of rules to exist on this forum. If you admit what he said might easily be viewed as constructive if you or I had said it, but assert that from him it was banworthy, you're justifying prejudice - which is bullhonky no matter how many times the dude has pissed us off.

No offense but; Bullshit.

A post that's subtly attacking or being negative towards someone is going to go across a lot worse then one that's making an honest comment. Posts are judged by contents, but our participation here builds our reputation. And not a lot of folks are going to take to kindly to a well-seen negative person acting as so.

 

[CrystalLight]

It would have been a shitty comment coming from anybody.

I don't think the comment itself was shitty. Just the timing and the person doing it was.

He got banned from posting in Gen-Dis. So what? That's of the norm for problem users and I'm sure it was discussed beforehand anyways.

I think there's no need to be all hot to trot 'cus the guy can't post in there. He brought his shit to TK. So what's the difference?

 

[LD_Tickler]

His behavior is upsetting and subtly directed towards other members on the forum.

There's a difference between being generally confrontational and personally.

It's no different then what another member's behavior was before he got banned.

Starting a topic and knowing it's going to be a hot-button topic, but not where it'll be directed subtly or not at another person is a lot different then just discussing a general hot-button topic. (Cliques as a whole, abortion, etc).

He had profanity and name calling slung at him. THAT'S personal. So you can either claim "he deserved it" in which case you subscribe to a "you get what you give" system under which you'd be a hypocrite to call for mod intervention, OR, about 10 people here need to be banned too.

No offense but; Bullshit.

A post that's subtly attacking or being negative towards someone is going to go across a lot worse then one that's making an honest comment. Posts are judged by contents, but our participation here builds our reputation. And not a lot of folks are going to take to kindly to a well-seen negative person acting as so.

So then at what point can he start making hard-hitting, legitimate yet insensitive posts which seem reserved for those who are sufficiently well thought-of? Who gets to judge that?

 

[kis123]

Not shitty enough to deserve this, if we compare it to countless other statements made by unpunished users.

Honestly, you don't know if anyone else has been punished or not. When I've gotten into it with mods, I didn't advertise it and I'd venture to guess that those who've gotten their coattails pulled don't advertise it either. It is beyond counterproductive to take a private mod decision to the public forum; it makes the perpetrator appear immature and unable to deal with the structure of an adult forum.

Just take your lumps quietly and stop with the "poor me, I'm a victim" defense. And definitely do not take a mod's private conversation and post it in public demanding an apology. Not only is his wish not going to be granted, it only adds fuel to the fire. That is NOT being controversial at all and the respect level drops several notches.