Tickling/Religion/Guilt & Evil...

[qjakal]

Not so sure...

Please don't think I have anything against music...far from it..it's one of lifes purest pleasures and I treasure it, but I'm not as sure as you are Strel that no one will starve because of that organ. You may be correct, and there probably isn't an apparent need for those funds near your parish, but that of course isn't the whole point. The fact that the people there can easily afford this upgrade is wonderful, and they are most likely hard working industrious types who have earned their music...I'll concede all that and more...and yet, I find myself thinking more and more often lately about the way we allocate resources and how we justify our decisions. Wish I had a solution rather than a vague questioning uneasy feeling, but I'm giving you what I have...lol!

As for the first statement, yeah....mostly at gas stations though...I'm pretty easygoing and I watch my temper closely. I've had my share and then some of those youthful indescretions, and they're getting too expensive both financially and recovery wise, if you get my drift! I'd make an exception for our dear friend Osama though and let the adrenaline rip! Where have you been keeping yourself lately old man? Thought you'd given up on us...lol. Q

 

[Charlie]

This is a very long thread, and I've only read a few posts. I just wanted to say one thing about "pleasure." The idea that sex is for procreation and not recreation ... is not a biblical notion. Proverbs 5:19 is just one example, "Rejoice always in your young wife; let her breasts satisfy you at all times." An entire book of the Old Testament, "Song of Solomon," is devoted to the joys of sexual pleasure. The guy who posted something to the effect that "Surely God can understand that" referring to sexual pleasure didn't go far enough. God more than *understands* it ... He *ordained* it. Why waste a moment feeling guilty about pleasure in all its forms ... when God made us that way?

 

[moriaritytk]

Boko-muru to you, too

It’s interesting that, after all these posts, the one true religion of the foot tickler hasn’t been mentioned. I’m speaking, of course, of Bokononism.

Not familiar with it, you say. Well, the religion was first revealed in Kurt Vonnegut’s “Cat’s Cradle”, which was quite the college campus cult book in the 60s. I was taken with the Zen-like wit of the tongue-in-cheek religion as well as the central ritual, a ceremony called the “boko-muru.” Here is how it is described:

"boko-maru: The mingling of awareness. A Bokononist ritual during which two people press the soles of their bare feet together. Bokononists believe it is impossible to be sole-to-sole with another person without loving that person, provided the feet of both persons are clean and nicely tended.”

What’s not to love about a religion where the main sacrament involves getting women’s shoes off and touching their feet. There is a scene in the book that has the hero and the best-looking female getting sole-to-sole and having an experience that manages to be orgasmic and spiritual at the same time. When I first read it, I thought that I’d died and gone to Heaven. I’ve been a convert ever since.

The story of creation is treated a little differently in the Books of Bokonon. It goes like this:

"All of the true things I am about to tell you are shameless lies. In the beginning, God created earth, and he looked upon it in His cosmic loneliness.
And God said, "Let Us make living creatures out of mud, so the mud can see what We have done." And God created every living creature that now moveth, and one was man. Mud as man alone could speak. God leaned close as mud as man sat up, looked around, and spoke. Man blinked. "What is the purpose of all this?" he asked politely.
"Everything must have a purpose?" asked God.
"Certainly," said man.
"Then I leave it to you to think of one for all this," said God. And He went away."

Bokonon also took issue with Jesus from time to time. Here’s one example:

"Jesus once said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's". Which Bokonon paraphrased, "Pay no attention to Caesar. Caesar doesn't have the slightest idea what's really going on."

Bokonon doesn’t specifically address tickling, but he does have one piece of advice that seems appropriate:

"Maturity is a bitter disappointment for which no remedy exists, unless laughter can be said to remedy anything."

Most ticklers would agree that laughter is a fine remedy for almost whatever ails you. If you ever want a laugh-break from more weighty moral and religious discussions (and want tickler doesn’t want a laugh-break now and then) you can pick up a copy of “Cat’s Cradle” at most college book stores. Or, you can visit the web site that deals specifically in the Books of Bokonon:

http://alumni.aitec.edu.au/~bwechner/Documents/Bokonon/Intro.html

If you want to become a Bokononist, I think you pretty much decide, and that’s it. No services and no collection plates. You just get to spend your life from then on quite morally and religiously justified in spending all your free time trying to get women’s shoes off. As religions go, you could do a lot worse.

 

[qjakal]

Amen....

I'm a bit disappointed I didn't remember this sect...but then again, it WAS the 60's...lol. Been quoting Welcome To The Monkey House a lot, but I should have been looking the other way!! Much thanks for that fresh look! Q

 

[dvnc]

No more perfect instrument has ever been invented than the pipe organ. "Toccata and Fugue in D Minor" wouldn't be the same, played on kazoo, band saw and spoons.

Ahem. The piano is the most perfect instrument, both for performance and for composition. Organ is as close as a synthesizer for such.

The organ DOES sound more dominant, though.

Thanks, Strel. Been agreein' with ya so much, it was startin' t'make me feel like I was charmed or somethin'!

Ever the music student,

dvnc

 

[omega]

Double Ahem!

Ahem. The piano is the most perfect instrument, both for performance and for composition. Organ is as close as a synthesizer for such.

dvnc

I throughly enjoy playing both piano and organ and I think they are fantastic and versatile instruments.

BUT, the most perfect instrument is the human voice.

Wait a minute, I was an instrumental major. I can't believe I even typed that.

 

[dvnc]

Bite your tongue, man! 😉

Voice is relative to the vocalist, and few are so good that they'd be exquisite, and NONE have the range of a piano.

I learned orchestration way back when. It can't be done easily without a piano. Saw a guy TRY to do it with guitar, but it ain't even close to as easy, or as useful.

Bad omega. Bad. You have t'sit with the drummer and the singer, now. 😉

dvnc
who's also a singer

 

[Strelnikov]

I've heard "band" described as "several musicians, and a drummer."

DVNC, an organ IS a synthesizer. It was developed as such, way on back. Heard a guy say so on PBS, so it must be true.

I know what you mean about piano, though. Bach organ concertos and Beethoven piano concertos - tough choice to say which I prefer. Kinda depends on my mood.

One huge difference for live performances: a Steinway Concert Grand sounds great in any large hall, while a pipe organ really needs a cathedral, and the cathedral and organ need to be tuned to each other. Not very portable... Unfortunately, that carries over to home listening too. Some organ tones and over-tones are subsonic or supersonic. Unless your sound system is first rate (and mine isn't), it's hard to make organ music sound right. The frequency response isn't there. Fewer such difficulties with piano.

Voice? I dunno... Choir, maybe. Even a fairly pedestrian instrument like a guitar has a much greater range than any individual voice.

Any bagpipe enthusiasts out there?

Moriarty, thanks for reminding me about Bokononism. Hadn't thought about that in years.

Strelnikov

 

[omega]

Range? is that the only thing that matters for a perfect instrument? No, the voice does not usually have the range of any other insturment, but so what? What matters is purity. The human voice is a pure sound and it is made within us not from outside of us.

I also play bass so most of the time I sit with the drummer and singer anyway.

Also about your comment that none would starve just because a congregation spent 1.5 million to have a pipe organ. I was in Honduras in January this year. There are kids suffering of malnutrition in that country. Do you know what 1.5 million would do?

Qjakal, why do you keep buttering me up? What do you want? 😉
You keep talking about wanting this face to face with God or some god. You admit that I can't do it or make it happen. True. You need to do it all on your own.

For me, I find that I meet God when I am with other people. I don't mean that people are gods. What I mean is that I feel I experience God through other people. I think about when my mother was dying from cancer. I learned alot about pain, suffering, faith and hope as I watched her. I wish she never had to go through that, and I wish she were still here, but since it did happen I did learn. I also had just a small glimpse into the love between two married people. There were times when my mom and dad were together and I felt almost like an intruder. The love between them created a holy space that just awed me.

There is the whole question about why would God allow that suffering for my mother and our family. I don't have an answer other than to say that I don't think we think of suffering as we should. Pain and suffering are not the problems. In fact pain can be good for us. People with leporasy feel no pain. They could reach into a fire, grap a hot coal, and hold it for many minutes without feeling any pain. Of course damage would be done to their hand and fingers. So pain alerts us to danger and possible worse damage.

Pain and suffering in our lives are not the problem. They are indicators that there is a problem. What is the problem then? I guess the Christian would say it is sin. But that is simplistic because pain and suffering many times happen to saints as well as sinners. Maybe it is God's way to get our attention and teach us. Couldn't God do that without pain and suffering? Yes, but would we pay attention. I mean many of us are pretty dense and suffer from attention deficit.

Well, enough meandering for now

 

[dvnc]

Heck, Omega, I *dig* your meandering. I *am* thinkin' it might get the thread bounced to General Discussion soon, but I ain't so worried 'bout that. A conversation here is as good as one there, t'me.

Range is not the ONLY thing that matters, but it DOES matter, for the discussion of a perfect instrument. This is especially true for one that composes music. A voice hasn't the ability to sound the range that a piano can sound, and an organ can't reach the degree of nuance, though it can indeed be louder, and more harmonically complex and compound. I *am* noticing that you haven't pulled the card I laid out - the composition card. I'm talkin' composition. You *could* imply sonority. That'd be hard to argue with the organ, especially, as Strel so astutely indicated, a properly tuned one. The harmonics of voice, even with those infinitessimally few folk that have a great range, will never reach EITHER piano OR organ, or even guitar. Strel points that out, too.

Separately, as a bassist, you're the fundament of the band, and can carry the rhythm even WITHOUT the drums. Don't sell yourself short, brother. Bass is so VERY essential. You can kick out me and the drummer, but the band ain't gonna want t'get rid of a good bass player.

Nice turn around on Q, Omega. Very nice. He's enjoyin' your intellect, here, I suspect. I sure am. You're in the same category, in my head, as Strel, Q, and even Dave2112. Y'all make for good thinkin'. I like that.

As for the why of our suffering, it's how we learn, teach, and remain humble. Like your analogy, with the coals, we may not respond to sense, but damage remains. How you deal with what you're given is as great a thing as the damage itself, and the pain felt. Ask anyone that's suffered something extreme. Some don't even sweat a second occurence. We're DESIGNED to suffer. Arguin' the who isn't as important as why. Sufferin' teaches us. Pain's one of our first motivations to learn. They are, thus, important to our species, REGARDLESS of faith. Addin' faith to it just makes the argument stronger, at least for the faithful.

Strel, I'll take that argument that an organ is a synthesizer, and counter with this question - How do you describe a synthesizer? Why ask this? An organ is a mechanical wind instrument, technically speakin'. The pipes are gettin' resonance from what? Forced air. Where's that air comin' from? Some sort of pump. Why does it make the noise it does? Same reason as the noise made when you whistle - air forces with sufficient pressure across an appropriate opening causes a discrete resonance that we describe as a note.

A synthesizer, technically speaking, is an electrontic device designed to replicate sound via any one of a number of algorithms. Modern organ creators will argue against you. I could argue in favor of your notion. I just wanna know why YOU think of a church organ, pipes and all, as a synth. That's interestin'.

Oh, and I dig bagpipes, with a proper piper. I don't enjoy novices, though. Painful sound, really.

Thanks for the thinkin', folks,

Dave

 

[qjakal]

Voice...

At the risk of further "buttering" Omega...lol..I have to side with the "voice" theory. There is nothing that moves me to tears faster than a good soprano. Other music can motivate me and stimulate a range of emotions, but none has the effect that a voice can produce.

As for that face to face with either the One True God or his/her pantheon, I'm just "networking" out here, bud! As in ancient literature, perhaps one of the gods has come to play with the humans, and I shan't miss my chance for a reckoning due to being shy! A simple question...that's all I shall ask, and not regarding suffering or pain, which I regard much as dvnc, an inconvenience that at times needs to be endured as well as possible. I spent a few years in a wheelchair and relearning how to walk and function myself, and although it was suffering at the time I have seen much good because of it, when viewed with perspective. Nothing to do with tickling either, although if I get a few "bonus" questions, I promise to slip it in for the curious among us. Personally I think it sets us apart as a category that can lay claim to being another version of the "chosen" ones!

Strel...you forgot that quasi-religion also...lol? Can't believe it hadn't resurfaced yet somewhere on this ongoing novel of a thread!!

Dave, I think you're going to have to post a wav file, or some type of midi, so we can hear both you and your instrument...ok?


BRB.....dinnertime! Q

 

[dvnc]

LOL! If ya wanna hear me, Q, yer gonna have to come to one o' my gatherings. Last thing I want is grief about my musical work, and knowin' just how wide the preferences are for such, here, I'd be ASKIN' for it, postin' somethin' here.

Most of what I have, on hand, is Gamelan or instrumental work, meant for soundtracks and the like. I've a few mp3 versions o' that stuff, but no vocal stuff on hand. Oughta get some of that stuff together, now that y'mention it, though.

dvnc

 

[qjakal]

Sotto Voce

There's a clip floating around with Jacklyn tied to a couch, and somebody trying to get her to confess something or other (hey...she's VERY distracting!)...anyway, the guy sounds exactly like I do...it's spooky really. He says something like "Well as long as you're tied up anyway" or some such statement (really really distracting...sigh).

Anyway, if you get an mp3 of something, DL Aimster(oops...forgot..you're a Mac Daddy),err...give it someone who has a nice normal PC and let us get it through Aimster, ok? I just posted up and asked Jen to record some of her laughing at Philly too...I may not be traveling much, but I still want to hear!! Cough it up bud!! Q

 

[omega]

I have a feeling that the discussion has narrowed down to three or four of us. I came into the discussion intent on not offending anyone so that they wouldn't leave and they leave anyway. 😕

I do conceed that for purposes of composing or arranging the piano is perfect. I also tend to think that the pipe organ is an instrument in its own right and the electronic organ (like my 42 year old Hammond) is a synthisizer.

In my meandering I tried to get off of music and back to some topic related to religion/God. But then you guys just keep talking about MP3 files and stuff. 😀

BTW qjakal, now that you have quit asking . . . my wife and I do enjoy tickling. And we enjoy it without guilt because we are married. (I know that is not the question you were asking but it does answer the question you did ask) I just reread the sentence in the parenthesis and all I can say is I hope you understand it better than me.

We have been married for 11 years. We have two girls, one is 9 years old and the other is 5 months old. How is that for spacing your kids out?

Omega

 

[qjakal]

sMART sPACING...

I think it's perfect...the one will be old enough to be the babysitter for the other....lol. Very economical and efficient of you two! Don't sweat the thread "narrowing"..they'll be back when they tire of the "Baby Oil" and Most Ticklish Spot" threads...always happens in cycles. We are adopting a child this year, because we now have a big empty nest, so perhaps we can share 2 am feeding posts soon...lol. My family has suffered a lot of losses over the past decade, and of course that is *part* of my issues with omnipotent powers that be, but only a contributing factor. Won't bore the forum with personal tragedies, since we all have them somewhere, but I AM happy to hear you and your wife are blessed with a love of tickling and a mutual enjoyment! Sorry if I was persistent, but it makes a difference in ones POV and general outlook/posts.

BTW (lol), music and God are certainly easily related, and the beauty of this thread is its wandering nature...we end up back at tickling eventually, but we have had some lovely interesting excursions! Feel free to meander to your hearts content, Omega.

Strel, I'm working on a kazoo arrangement with dvnc that'll knock the congregations socks off(you wish) and they'll be putting that obsolete organ up on the e-bay block immmediately after hearing it I'm sure!

Alright....you want religion and God and evil and such? How about we try to flush out some of our Islamic members on the forum and see if we can get a viewpoint on why the major Islamic nations in the world aren't denouncing/excommunicating these morons who have hijacked the name of Islam for their idiotic purposes? If there was a sect of the KKK running around C4'ing mosques, I'm fairly certain the Pope and such would be loudly calling down the wrath of their flocks and nations! Why hasn't this happened? Can it be there is tacit support for this activity? Perhaps fear of reprisals of either a physical or political nature? Cowardice? PC in the form of "banding" together with ANYBODY calling themselves Muslims? I'm listening.... Q

 

[Strelnikov]

Scattergun Response

DVNC, thinking back on the PBS show, here's what the guy said: A synth is capable of reproducing the sounds of other, more traditional instruments - singly or in combination. A major pipe organ has the same capability. Things equal to the same thing are equal to each other - Q.E.D. I think the analogy falls down when it comes to percussion though. You could set up a synth to sound like kazoo, bandsaw and spoons. The organ could handle kazoo and bandsaw, but it would take some diddling to get a "spoons" sound out of it.

My argument re. superiority was based on range and complexity. Loud is good, too. It should make the building rumble on the low notes and sing on the highs (that's another reason to tune the building.) Wasn't thinking of nuance, but of course you're right. I like piano - really I do - definition of "perfect" depends on what weight you give the various advantages.

Omega, no one will starve because these folks indulged themselves with their organ. Give 1.5 million starving Hondurans each a dollar, and they would eat for one day and be no better off the next. Furthermore, the money spent provided 18 months of well-paid and satisfying work for a shop full of craftsmen whose craft would otherwise die out. We would all be poorer if that happened.

Voice is good. Violin is better.

Q, I'm not sure I want to respond to your last. I thought my "fleas of a thousand camels" post on one of your other threads was self-evidently a provocation designed to smoke out extreme views. Instead, now I think Hal regards me as a Nazi genocide wannabe.

Hal, if you're reading this: An old Cold Warrior named Herman Kahn wrote a book called "Thinking About The Unthinkable" about nuclear war. That threat has mostly receded, but we know that there are people thinking about genocide. The Arabs have threatened the Israelis with it since before you and I were born.

There's evidence that Israel has nuclear weapons, and came within minutes of using them in 1973. It wouldn't surprise me to know that they had weapons grade smallpox - actually more bang for the buck than nukes. The mullahs and tin-pot despots in the Middle East had better be thinking about it too, because that's an asymmetric threat they couldn't possibly defend against.

Strelnikov

 

[omega]

qjakal, congrats on adopting. Our 5 month old is adopted, well almost adopted. The adoption petition has been filed and recorded by the court. The next thing is our court appearance in a few months and everything is finally final. I don't deal with much legal stuff and I seem to always be surprised at how long it takes for our courts to work. 😡 Sorry can't share any 2 am feeding discussions. She started sleeping all night about 3 weeks ago. YEA!

i'm not sure that certain groups of muslims denouncing or excommunicating the terrorist muslims would have much effect. It would be like if the pope excommunicated me. I'm protestant and my response to the excommunication would be, "I guess the pope has too much time on his hands."

Strel, I agree that just using money to give food to people is not a long term answer. But what if the money were used to educate or train people to become productive? I do not think the congregation with the pipe organ is being selfish and I'm sure they give more to missions in one year than we give in five. (Mostly because they probably have much bigger congregation than us)

And along those lines, I have often wondered how it is that the industial nations developed mostly in the northern hemisphere mostly in areas where winters can be a real bear. Closer to the equator with warm weather year round seems like it would be more conducive to developement. I mean you can work outside year round, you can do construction year round, there are no heating costs. So why wasn't that more conducive to industrial and technological growth?

 

[Haltickling]

Disturbing Catholic nuns

Yesterday, Germany's TV stations broadcasted a strange message: In one of our catholic schools, the teachers (all nuns) had torn out the same 14 pages from all school books on sexual education. They claimed that the students' school bags were too heavy…

Although Germany is a secular state, several public and private schools are under catholic control as they were originally donated by the church, and all the teachers are nuns, monks, or priests. They have no influence on the subjects though, the education plans are state-controlled. They have always protested against the nun-teachers being forced to teach sexual education (compulsory subject for age group 8-12).

The 14 pages in question contained graphic depictions of male and female genitals which obviously made the nuns nervous. Their lame excuse is an outright lie. I wonder how the Catholic church would react if the secular schools would start to rip out 14 pages of the students' catechisms…

IMO, this ridiculous action is comparable with Scott's attempt to convert the TMF members. It certifies the ingrained intolerance and inflexibility of the Catholic church, and I'm glad I left that bunch behind 20 years ago.

 

[qjakal]

Left behind...

But not forgotten. We have many members among us with the same general history of disenchantment with their church of childhood and early years. But, I've noticed that as people age they tend to go back to their original sect, clinging perhaps to the notion that all will be well at this late time in their lives if they do so with fervor. So, in 20 more years, Hal will be a pillar of the parish once again,(just an example) and perhaps all of us will be looking for a "crutch" of some sort, a spiritual one, to help us stumble through old age...

Gotta love the relationship between organized religion and governments...like 2 hedgehogs circling a juicy morsel (that would be us ordinary folk), neither wanting to tear way at the prize for fear of exposing itself to attack while "feasting". Perhaps it's time to segue into a discussion on the Moral Majority, and their agenda, and what it COULD be if properly run and administered. With a bit less rigidity on issues that aren't that "religous" in nature, the group could expand to become an actual political force. We'd need to rename the thing to get a fresh start, but the concept was innovative and timely...the execution stunk( from a business/marketing standpoint). 🙄

Omega, happy adoption! We have decided to travel to China and not Russia, since those kids are being adopted at a record rate, and our objective is to go where there is a greater need to fulfill. We'll chat more on this later? Assuming you haven't been excommunicated/defrocked/whatever....lol.

Omegas observation regarding climate vs. technological progress is certainly an intersting one, and I believe we had touched upon another geographical anamoly not that long ago in the thread....something similar about Third World nations not progressing as quickly due to "problems" and interference. All I can say is that when it gets warm, I like a good "siesta" as much as the next guy.

Strel, the Middle East is by far the biggest pot of boiling water in existence...grudges going back millenia and not a lot of ground for compromise in any area. We are going to have to address the issue soon...or continue to wonder if there will ever be security in the world again.

Anyway...Moral Majority>>A good idea with bad results? Islamic nations being silent? Our extreme left factions beginning to be heard again? Perhaps a general turn back to a certain set of "standards", whether imposed by God or Government is the wave of the future. Soooooo much to chat about! 😀 Q

 

[dvnc]

Q said:: DL Aimster(oops...forgot..you're a Mac Daddy)

LOL! Yer killin' me, Q. Ain't Apple's fault that the kids writin' the Aimster software hadn't gotten a reasonable Mac version yet. I've a PC and a Linux box, too. I *am* a software engineer, after all. 😉 Now I ain't puttin' anythin' online outta spite. 😛 I'll still do the kazoo ensemble, though.

Strel, a Pipe Organ doesn't have the ability to sound like a string section, a Javanese Gamelan, or a complex series of vocal utterances, nevermind the sampling abilities of newer devices. They are phenominal devices, but the lack the variability of a good synth (and the portability, too). If they were equal, brother, I'd not separate 'em. Can't hear the orchestration of a 64 piece orchestra from a pipe organ, but you CAN from the right synth. It still ain't as good as a real orchestra with good players, though.

You're definitely correct that it lacks the percussive tonalities, too, unless you bring out sticks, and a ladder to reach the pipes. 😉

Now, if you let a madman like ME at the organ, I'll get a good deal more out of it than some sissy that stays in on the bench. Treated piano still outdoes treated organ, though. Done both. Know it empirically. Doin' a speak-song in the spoken jazz stylings while a pianist works a treated piano is a fine thing. Makes me miss college.

Oh, and you're right about violin.

Omega, cold country is BORING country throughout the winter, like as not, and workin' ain't as hard to argue as it is when the weather's fine and the family's wantin' to go to the beach/lake/river/park. When it's always balmy, it's harder to motivate workers to stay working.

Congrats to both you and Q on the baby front. I just WISH, brother!

On to the religion again. Let's talk about sharin' cultural space in the US with the various religious and non-religious folks. The spiritualists and pagans with the Catholic and Protestant, and the Jews with the Moslems. Omega, can you propose a method to teach the kids to play nicely together? How do I get them all to realize that it's all about the love?

dvnc

 

[shark]

Seems to me that the biggest problem in us getting along is the so called liberals.They are great at tolerating everyone,as long as you agree with them.Let's not forget that they also have positioned themselves in places to use as pulpits of their own:classrooms,media,and career government.They will put forth their beliefs and chastise those who disagree with slanted news,lawsuits,and interference with the raising of one's own children.

 

[dvnc]

ROFL! Shark, I must be mistaken, brother, 'cause I thought I WAS a liberal. I just ain't an idiot. Maybe you meant idiot? Maybe the liberals around ya are idiots?

Brother, everyone CAN'T agree all the time. I'm askin' how we get along anyway. Intolerance like that says we can't. I don't buy that we can't, 'cause we do. I wanna know how we can do better, not worse.

Keep in mind that I don't tolerate ANYONE tellin' me how t'live, worship, love, etc. unless there's REASON in their argument that sways me. I won't, otoh, refuse information or participation from ANY group. Won't like it, necessarily, but I'll bother to include them as Americans, and will afford them the dignity that's due to all citizens.

Sorry to hear that someone masqueradin' as merely liberal was such a pissant towards ya, though, sir.

dvnc

 

[qjakal]

Name Grabbing....

It's getting soooo tough to "label" things and people nowdays! As dvnc stated, there's liberals, and there's jerks assuming the guise of liberals because it's convenient to do so. Being on the other end of the political spectrum, namely the dreaded "conservative", I see the same problem on this side as well. There's a certain type of moron who calls himself conservative when he/she is actually just that...a narrow minded moron. Dave, you and I might disagree on the methods of achieving a goal..let's pick an example..."pay equality" just for illustration. You and I both agree that a woman doing a job shouldn't be paid less than a man.....but, where you might think it should be government mandate that enforces it, I might believe the law of supply and demand will do a better job of balancing the situation. This is a hypothetical setup, and I don't mean to drag dvnc(hehe) into a spot he may not like, but it serves as an illustration that there is a GREAT amount of common ground among even the most seemingly opposite labels of liberal and conservative. Unfortunately, we tend to focus more on both the few areas of disagreement and the processes of achieving the goal, rather than the amount of commonality that exists. Personally, I think many of the tenured professors shark spoke of need to go also, just as I wouldn't care to see Falwell, Farakhan or Sharpton in any type of influential position.

As for Mac...lol...keep that thing away from the PC. And if Linux would make an effort to "stoop" a bit to become more accesible as an OS, we wouldn't need to be beating up MicroSoft, because users would flock to it like seniors to heat! BTW...you know you WANT to put those wavs online...I know it too...just a matter of time till ya crack, big guy!! 😎 Q

 

[dvnc]

I want to cough up music files for free as much as I want to take a beating from a South Philly street gang. G'luck gullin' me into that one, you conservative from another coast, you. 😉

As for arguin' methodologies, Q, I tire of such trivia easily. There's bodies in place for the delineation of such tasks, and I'd sooner let the voters decide than ponce about like I've some inalienable right to tire the masses. 😛

As for the OS sillyness, when Windows allows for an easy way, on a laptop, to do video editing, audio editing, MIDI sequencing, website creation, and the common internet tasks of mail, web, and meeting tracking, all while syncing with a Pilot, well, I'll consider it. Having TESTED that stuff as a profession for 15 years, since back when Compaq suitcases were the concept of portable, I refute the argument as daft. I'll sooner go to Linux, when such is available easily there. Right now, it's usability keepin' me to a Mac. I can do more. If I had more casual uses for my rig, sure, I could get a cheap, slack Windows laptop that was lighter and slimmer. I insist on function over form.

PCs are cheap and the laptops are small. That's the advantage. Expense and size. Beyond being cheap and skinny (which IS good), they're a consumate pain. Having returned to try them every few years, they're LESS of a pain than Windows 2.0 (and which 4 of you remember that?) but there're still a pain.

I've a Toshiba Portégé 3480ct with Windows 2000k on my desk. I can count the number of times it's been useful, and none were personal usage, but it IS skinny and runs for a LONG time on that big ole battery. I've a Dell mammoth with Linux on it, and I love that beast for some work tasks. I've my PowerBook G3 'cause I want to work quickly and easily, so I can deal with TMF stuff without hassle. Only way I'm gettin' rid of it is to get a new PowerBook.

Silly man. 🙂

dvnc

 

[qjakal]

No argument!

Hey...I bow to the techie! No argument from me regarding Linux, except it seems to WANT to be an uppity high end system for sophisticated users only, not interested in becoming more user friendly and therefore more generally accepted, ya know? As for function over form, I also agree (see...i can be nice...once in a while!). But as for skinny and cheap..hehe..I prefer mine to ne a little chubby, very classy and superticklish! Oh..you meant the laptop! Windows 2.0? We were just discussing making up those rubberbanded piles of punchcards 3 inches thick to run a simple pong game...lol...remember THOSE?

Never ignore politics and laws dvnc, these things can bite you in the butt if you don't keep a close eye on them. The public is its own best protection from crazy government, and should always be alert to stupidity. I'm getting ready to write to a judge who gave some moron who hanged 6 dogs NO JAIL TIME! I'd like to have about 20 minutes alone with him, and then I'd probably be doing some jail time, but it would be worth it...a $2000 fine is a joke for that pile of crap masquerading as a human being. These things require our attention, dvnc, and I know you aren't serious about tiring the masses with your wisdom! Gotta go, that South Philly(BTW..North Philly is MUCH worse nowdays)gang I hired needs planefare to the west coast...😛 Q